1LikesMugen MTX-4R
10-24-2008, 07:58 PM
#2221
I too ran the 3. It was a used car and I ran the car from march 2006 to march 2007(bought a 4). I honestly can't remember stripping a gear. I do remember running the same spur gears for months and only changed them because they looked really beat up. The 4 uses the same spur gears as the 3, so why is the 4 stripping like hell.
What changed in the drivetrain going from the 3 to the 4? I think the answer is there.
I still love Mugen but damn that s$%t is annoying.
What changed in the drivetrain going from the 3 to the 4? I think the answer is there.
I still love Mugen but damn that s$%t is annoying.
If you can't find a known reason why a gear stripped; take a look at your tire diameter and compare this to the rollout chart.
IMO
Pass you soon...
10-25-2008, 01:16 AM
#2222
I think you might be on to something with your motor causing the stripping. When I first got my 4, I bought a one-piece engine mount with it. I tried every single suggestion on here. I even had a mugen driver try to help but it still happened. I never changed the motor though. Once I put on the 4mm chassis, it stopped and never happened again. I'm thinking it may have something to do with motor/engine mount/chassis combination. Basically, if you have the magic combination to cause it, nothing else will fix it. But, perhaps changing one of those variables will. Just a thought. I have to say though, as a loyal Mugen customer, I am disappointed that this problem was never addressed or admitted to by the company. I'm even considering switching cars next year and that is one of the reasons why.
10-25-2008, 05:05 AM
#2223
Tech Adept
I must be one of the lucky ones because ive had 2 mtx3s and 2 mtx4s and ive never once stripped a gear in any of them. Ive used the 1.0 and the .8 gears with the same results. I also use a solid engine mount but still use the 3mm chassis. Just for making these comments im sure ill strip a gear sunday at our club race.
10-25-2008, 05:25 AM
#2224
The original 3 had 1.0 gears and the 3 pro-spec had a different internal gear ratio. I believe the higher internal gear ratio (More accelaration) of the 4 cause the car to stay in second gear longer which causes the gear to over heat which eventually strips the gear. And if you don't watch your tire diameter and roll-out this will strip gears all day long.
What happened from the 0.8 gears on a MTX3 and the 0.8 gears on the MTX4? More horsepower on the engines we bolt on them. Bearings and clutches suffer a lot and people neglect them a lot.
Mugen released a different spurs with harder material and different 2nd gear clutch shoes, that seems to solve that cursed problem. Me like many other haven't suffered that problem but YMMV.
10-26-2008, 11:11 AM
#2225
Tech Initiate
Ha, this topic seems never end, who's the gear killer? is the engine mount ? the misaligned gear mash? chassis flex? insecure screw? all of them? a million dollars question. OK, keep on guessing but I'll let you guys know later.
Tips: What had been change except the 08 gear and the internal ratio on the driving train from 3 to 4?
Tips: What had been change except the 08 gear and the internal ratio on the driving train from 3 to 4?
10-26-2008, 03:20 PM
#2226
10-26-2008, 04:14 PM
#2227
Ha, this topic seems never end, who's the gear killer? is the engine mount ? the misaligned gear mash? chassis flex? insecure screw? all of them? a million dollars question. OK, keep on guessing but I'll let you guys know later.
Tips: What had been change except the 08 gear and the internal ratio on the driving train from 3 to 4?
Tips: What had been change except the 08 gear and the internal ratio on the driving train from 3 to 4?
and my last car was 2 years old and the 2 speed is still in good condition
the secret is put a little bit of grease on the ball bearing in the two speed.
10-26-2008, 06:28 PM
#2228
The original MTX3 and the prospect version had the same internal gear ratio. Nothing changed between them. From MTX3 to MTX4 it changed the internal gear ratio (where you originally went with a 20 or 21t 1st gear you actually go with a 16 or 17t).
What happened from the 0.8 gears on a MTX3 and the 0.8 gears on the MTX4? More horsepower on the engines we bolt on them. Bearings and clutches suffer a lot and people neglect them a lot.
Mugen released a different spurs with harder material and different 2nd gear clutch shoes, that seems to solve that cursed problem. Me like many other haven't suffered that problem but YMMV.
What happened from the 0.8 gears on a MTX3 and the 0.8 gears on the MTX4? More horsepower on the engines we bolt on them. Bearings and clutches suffer a lot and people neglect them a lot.
Mugen released a different spurs with harder material and different 2nd gear clutch shoes, that seems to solve that cursed problem. Me like many other haven't suffered that problem but YMMV.
10-26-2008, 08:25 PM
#2229
Yep, the original one came with 1.0 gears and the prospect came with 0.8 gears, but the internal ratio remain unchanged (1.95:1 IIRC). The MTX4 came with 0.8 gears and higher internal ratio (2.15:1???).
10-26-2008, 09:25 PM
#2230
The original MTX3 and the prospect version had the same internal gear ratio. Nothing changed between them. From MTX3 to MTX4 it changed the internal gear ratio (where you originally went with a 20 or 21t 1st gear you actually go with a 16 or 17t).
What happened from the 0.8 gears on a MTX3 and the 0.8 gears on the MTX4? More horsepower on the engines we bolt on them. Bearings and clutches suffer a lot and people neglect them a lot.
Mugen released a different spurs with harder material and different 2nd gear clutch shoes, that seems to solve that cursed problem. Me like many other haven't suffered that problem but YMMV.
What happened from the 0.8 gears on a MTX3 and the 0.8 gears on the MTX4? More horsepower on the engines we bolt on them. Bearings and clutches suffer a lot and people neglect them a lot.
Mugen released a different spurs with harder material and different 2nd gear clutch shoes, that seems to solve that cursed problem. Me like many other haven't suffered that problem but YMMV.
10-27-2008, 06:56 AM
#2231
There's got to be something we're missing here. I've seen some people strip their gears 3 times in 10 minutes, and I've seen people run a season with no issues. It didn't matter if they used the new 2 speed clutch or the new material gears. Some ran 4mm chassis, some 3mm. Some had some brand of aluminum brace over the motor, some still had the stock plastic piece. Some had a blade swaybar, some had the the wire. Not sure if it's specific to one particular motor or not (although I know some RBs have interesting fitment issues).
The only thing I know for sure from running the Mugen this year is I've only stripped a gear if the motor wasn't meshed right and my bulkhead screws weren't tight. This was running either the 3mm or 4mm chassis. I set my clutch on my Ninja with the thrust bearing spacer (the best way to get that gap right) and ran the thigh wire swaybar. As long as I took time to set the mesh right (I pulled the 1st gear spur off and set the angel and mesh with 2nd gear) and did a quick check on the bulkhead screws, I had no problems. This worked with the old gears and the old 2 speed. I've since changed the 2 speed when I replaced some of the drivetrain parts, but I'm not convinced that made any difference.
The only thing I know for sure from running the Mugen this year is I've only stripped a gear if the motor wasn't meshed right and my bulkhead screws weren't tight. This was running either the 3mm or 4mm chassis. I set my clutch on my Ninja with the thrust bearing spacer (the best way to get that gap right) and ran the thigh wire swaybar. As long as I took time to set the mesh right (I pulled the 1st gear spur off and set the angel and mesh with 2nd gear) and did a quick check on the bulkhead screws, I had no problems. This worked with the old gears and the old 2 speed. I've since changed the 2 speed when I replaced some of the drivetrain parts, but I'm not convinced that made any difference.
10-27-2008, 07:39 AM
#2232
There's got to be something we're missing here. I've seen some people strip their gears 3 times in 10 minutes, and I've seen people run a season with no issues. It didn't matter if they used the new 2 speed clutch or the new material gears. Some ran 4mm chassis, some 3mm. Some had some brand of aluminum brace over the motor, some still had the stock plastic piece. Some had a blade swaybar, some had the the wire. Not sure if it's specific to one particular motor or not (although I know some RBs have interesting fitment issues).
I repost the links to the attachments made that day where I showed what I needed to do to not hit the crankcase with the engine mounts.
http://www.rctech.net/forum/attachme...4-img_1387.jpg
http://www.rctech.net/forum/attachme...4-img_1390.jpg
That was my original post on those days:
http://www.rctech.net/forum/2709181-post6360.html
Found many people that blamed of blowing gears with crankcases hitting the engine mounts or touching the chassis.
On all this time. Only had two MTX4 cars. All two are mostly stock (in fact. I like and prefeer the 3mm vs. 4mm chassis). Only not stock on the transmission is:
- Square hollow main shaft (borrowed from my MTX3).
- Lightened 1st and 2nd gear (borrowed too from my MTX3).
Those three pieces have LOTS of litres thru it and doesn't show a sign of material fatigue and when I blew spur was my fault for not optimal gear mesh or not tightening the engine screws.
If anyone likes, reading of previous messages to mine linked here could show that some found this 'problem' and some pointed to a potential problem there.
During all the time where the MTX4 and MTX4-R threads grew we gave many possible fixes to those 'blowing gear problems' and no one caused the desired effects.
I'm reluctant to believe that 'blowing gear problem' is a design problem on the car and I'm more eager to think that's a assembly fault associated with the higher and higher power output of the engines lately (anyone tried to race with a 2003/2004 engine and taken some actual laptimes? - I did it).
10-27-2008, 01:20 PM
#2233
I'm reluctant to believe that 'blowing gear problem' is a design problem on the car and I'm more eager to think that's a assembly fault associated with the higher and higher power output of the engines lately (anyone tried to race with a 2003/2004 engine and taken some actual laptimes? - I did it).
And I did run a car with an RB X12. Quite a difference in that Ninja, I tell you...
