65LikesTC3 Forum
01-11-2004, 08:18 PM
#7411
Originally posted by mike_Webb
Barry was a hugh help last year. Maybe I will pick on someone else this year
.
This Weekend My car was hooked up but I hit a wall and broke a c-hub. I fixed that and knowticed that my foam tires where Coning so I trued them all to 58mm. Went out for my First Qualifier and the rear end of my car just spun out going around ever turn. I checked my Droop and the balance of the car and everything was fine. Usually in the Front my arms are adjusted so that the spring rest right up against the collar. In the Rear there is maybe 1-2mm of play where the Springs drops below the collar. I made sure that was alright and the same thing happened again for the second qualifier. then I knowticed I was using the New Jaco wheels. I put a brand new set of Foam Tires on the car cut to 60mm and the car was hooked up again.
What is the minimum diameter you can go with these newer Jaco Tires. Last year at snowbirds I was traction Rolling in Stock Class and I fixed that by running 56-57mm tires. I would hate to have the rear end swap again because now all I have are 8 sets of the New Jaco Tires.
Mike Webb
Barry was a hugh help last year. Maybe I will pick on someone else this year
.This Weekend My car was hooked up but I hit a wall and broke a c-hub. I fixed that and knowticed that my foam tires where Coning so I trued them all to 58mm. Went out for my First Qualifier and the rear end of my car just spun out going around ever turn. I checked my Droop and the balance of the car and everything was fine. Usually in the Front my arms are adjusted so that the spring rest right up against the collar. In the Rear there is maybe 1-2mm of play where the Springs drops below the collar. I made sure that was alright and the same thing happened again for the second qualifier. then I knowticed I was using the New Jaco wheels. I put a brand new set of Foam Tires on the car cut to 60mm and the car was hooked up again.
What is the minimum diameter you can go with these newer Jaco Tires. Last year at snowbirds I was traction Rolling in Stock Class and I fixed that by running 56-57mm tires. I would hate to have the rear end swap again because now all I have are 8 sets of the New Jaco Tires.
Mike Webb
This is something I find alot on my gas car. I actually now measure "actual droop" where you measure the ride height then the height of the chassis when the suspension is fully extended downwards.
01-11-2004, 08:19 PM
#7412
haha, ya you took all of my glory
,
lol, ya I try to clean them every two weeks, after that they get too gritty for me.,
lol, lets just say we are both right
, lol, ya I try to clean them every two weeks, after that they get too gritty for me.,
lol, lets just say we are both right
01-11-2004, 08:19 PM
#7413
Hey BubblesTC3
So how did u do last night somebody told me there were some fast guys there.
01-11-2004, 08:41 PM
#7414
Tech Fanatic
Re: Hey BubblesTC3
Originally posted by Bflat
So how did u do last night somebody told me there were some fast guys there.
So how did u do last night somebody told me there were some fast guys there.
01-11-2004, 08:44 PM
#7415
Tech Fanatic
Originally posted by =MisFitz= NuKe
haha, ya you took all of my glory ,
lol, ya I try to clean them every two weeks, after that they get too gritty for me.,
lol, lets just say we are both right
haha, ya you took all of my glory
, lol, ya I try to clean them every two weeks, after that they get too gritty for me.,
lol, lets just say we are both right
01-11-2004, 08:58 PM
#7416
Yep. I made sure that I readjusted my arms after I cut the Tires.
When I do my Droop, I never use a gague. I unscrew the screws in the arms, then I set my rideheight. After that I pick my car up off the table and Everytime my arms drop. SO then I start screwing the screw in till on the front the spring just touches the Collar and in the rear I adjust the arms till the Spring is about 1-2mm off the colar. That is how I have always done my droop in the three years I have been racing. When you read a setup sheet.especially with Foam Tires you have to accoutn for wear. So a person that is running 56mm tires and running 2 droop in the rear, that will not work for someone running 61mm tires and so forth.
Basically what I was told down at snowbirds last year was you hold your front Tires and push up on the front bumper with your thumbs. If 5mm ride height, your car should raise to 5.5mm of ride height. In the rear hold the tires to the ground and with your thumbs lift the rear of the chassis. You should have 7mm of Ride Height (this is dependant on your track). Does that make sense? I think I am explaning it correctly.
If you are running 3-4 on the droop in front and your tires go from 60-58mm when you try and adjust your ride height then the droop screws will almost make it so that you cannot get enough rideheight becasue as you push down on the springs to raise the chassis the screws prevent the chassis from raising.
When I do my Droop, I never use a gague. I unscrew the screws in the arms, then I set my rideheight. After that I pick my car up off the table and Everytime my arms drop. SO then I start screwing the screw in till on the front the spring just touches the Collar and in the rear I adjust the arms till the Spring is about 1-2mm off the colar. That is how I have always done my droop in the three years I have been racing. When you read a setup sheet.especially with Foam Tires you have to accoutn for wear. So a person that is running 56mm tires and running 2 droop in the rear, that will not work for someone running 61mm tires and so forth.
Basically what I was told down at snowbirds last year was you hold your front Tires and push up on the front bumper with your thumbs. If 5mm ride height, your car should raise to 5.5mm of ride height. In the rear hold the tires to the ground and with your thumbs lift the rear of the chassis. You should have 7mm of Ride Height (this is dependant on your track). Does that make sense? I think I am explaning it correctly.
If you are running 3-4 on the droop in front and your tires go from 60-58mm when you try and adjust your ride height then the droop screws will almost make it so that you cannot get enough rideheight becasue as you push down on the springs to raise the chassis the screws prevent the chassis from raising.
01-11-2004, 09:09 PM
#7417
Originally posted by mike_Webb
Yep. I made sure that I readjusted my arms after I cut the Tires.
When I do my Droop, I never use a gague. I unscrew the screws in the arms, then I set my rideheight. After that I pick my car up off the table and Everytime my arms drop. SO then I start screwing the screw in till on the front the spring just touches the Collar and in the rear I adjust the arms till the Spring is about 1-2mm off the colar. That is how I have always done my droop in the three years I have been racing. When you read a setup sheet.especially with Foam Tires you have to accoutn for wear. So a person that is running 56mm tires and running 2 droop in the rear, that will not work for someone running 61mm tires and so forth.
Basically what I was told down at snowbirds last year was you hold your front Tires and push up on the front bumper with your thumbs. If 5mm ride height, your car should raise to 5.5mm of ride height. In the rear hold the tires to the ground and with your thumbs lift the rear of the chassis. You should have 7mm of Ride Height (this is dependant on your track). Does that make sense? I think I am explaning it correctly.
If you are running 3-4 on the droop in front and your tires go from 60-58mm when you try and adjust your ride height then the droop screws will almost make it so that you cannot get enough rideheight becasue as you push down on the springs to raise the chassis the screws prevent the chassis from raising.
Yep. I made sure that I readjusted my arms after I cut the Tires.
When I do my Droop, I never use a gague. I unscrew the screws in the arms, then I set my rideheight. After that I pick my car up off the table and Everytime my arms drop. SO then I start screwing the screw in till on the front the spring just touches the Collar and in the rear I adjust the arms till the Spring is about 1-2mm off the colar. That is how I have always done my droop in the three years I have been racing. When you read a setup sheet.especially with Foam Tires you have to accoutn for wear. So a person that is running 56mm tires and running 2 droop in the rear, that will not work for someone running 61mm tires and so forth.
Basically what I was told down at snowbirds last year was you hold your front Tires and push up on the front bumper with your thumbs. If 5mm ride height, your car should raise to 5.5mm of ride height. In the rear hold the tires to the ground and with your thumbs lift the rear of the chassis. You should have 7mm of Ride Height (this is dependant on your track). Does that make sense? I think I am explaning it correctly.
If you are running 3-4 on the droop in front and your tires go from 60-58mm when you try and adjust your ride height then the droop screws will almost make it so that you cannot get enough rideheight becasue as you push down on the springs to raise the chassis the screws prevent the chassis from raising.
I run my foams routinely down to 58mm and lower and find them hooking up really well. Sorry I cannot add anymore.
01-11-2004, 10:38 PM
#7418
I was doing well on 54mm foams the other weekend. Starting foams at 58.5mm they don't take long to go below 58mm, and I don't think there is any performance decrease worth buying new tires for (at club races) until you get to about 56mm, and even then they still often work well.
01-12-2004, 04:13 AM
#7419
Proficar403: Arun, i always run the composite CVD's. They always seem to outlast anything else i have put in the car, UNTIL i hit something...LOL But you are right, they do add a little lag in the response to throttle input. Its just really noticeable in mod, the car will wiggle around alot as each tire gets the torque stored in the twist of the CVD. On asphalt, not so bad, on carpet, it can be a bother... the car can snap (point in an unexpected direction) on you when you drive the car on the edge. I guess you have to choose one or the other, setup is always a choice. There really is no "best" setup. Just getting from your car what you want.
AMGRACER:
3. The arms and diff cases (carbon stuff) had fairly large moulding runners attached to them. When I broke them off (as opposed to cutting them) they took a big ole chunk of my arms away with them. Did not affect the arm itself but still annoying.
You can alleviate this by using a dremel tool and a cutting disc to remove the arms and tranny cases from the molding runners, leaving some of the runner attached to the part. Then using a small sanding drum, remove the larger part of plastic runner from the part, and then a small file (xacto makes a replaceable belt hand file for under 5$... works really well for battery slots and such) to remove the rest. I go a tad further using a foam sanding block to round and smooth the arms, since it is soft and forms to the surface of the part, and if there are any imperfections, i fill them with slow drying CA/ZAP two part epoxy, and sand them smooth. Some of the older arms that did this, used to break easier, because there was less composite to hold the arm together. I am sure it is negligible, but it does look better for that racer "it looks like it wont break" mindset.
MikeWebb: I just spent two hours today truing tires for the Birds. MAN WHAT A MESS! (ever see your dog try and chew on shredded tire remains on the ground...?) On another thread i asked Josh Cyrul what to start the tires (JACO Plaid, Purple, Double Pinks, and Double Pink/Oranges) out for 19T , he said 2.28 (58mm) to start and he would practice twice on them. Then 2.25 to 2.23 for the qualifiers and mains. Now after cutting all of my JACO tires today, starting at 59mm, or 2.315, i noticed that there was little left on the tires. You asked what the minimum is, and i think anything below 2.23 would put you on a rubberband of a tire! Cut an old tire to see.... you'll find out what i mean! It sounds to me, like your problem lies in a bent hingepin. Maybe a bent shock shaft? You said you broke a front C-hub, did you remove all four shocks and see if the arms dropped on their own weight? I know you said you checked all of it, but it really sounds like something is preventing the car from working right in the corner. To check tweak and droop, the suspension would have to "fall" on its own, but if you had tires on it, the extra weight could have masked the bent pin/shock shaft. Everyone does it a little different. Consistency is the key, and what you are doing sounds right. I just think your problem isnt tires, but somewhere else.... could you have maybe put plaids on the back and purples on the front by accident?? That will make the car swap ends in a heartbeat... no matter WHAT you do...(even if you replace your front shocks with turnbuckles from tower to arm to remove the added steering!!!) Not that i have ever done that or anything...
Lets just say, i no longer toss all of my tires UNLABELED in a box! 
- Dave
AMGRACER:
3. The arms and diff cases (carbon stuff) had fairly large moulding runners attached to them. When I broke them off (as opposed to cutting them) they took a big ole chunk of my arms away with them. Did not affect the arm itself but still annoying.
You can alleviate this by using a dremel tool and a cutting disc to remove the arms and tranny cases from the molding runners, leaving some of the runner attached to the part. Then using a small sanding drum, remove the larger part of plastic runner from the part, and then a small file (xacto makes a replaceable belt hand file for under 5$... works really well for battery slots and such) to remove the rest. I go a tad further using a foam sanding block to round and smooth the arms, since it is soft and forms to the surface of the part, and if there are any imperfections, i fill them with slow drying CA/ZAP two part epoxy, and sand them smooth. Some of the older arms that did this, used to break easier, because there was less composite to hold the arm together. I am sure it is negligible, but it does look better for that racer "it looks like it wont break" mindset.
MikeWebb: I just spent two hours today truing tires for the Birds. MAN WHAT A MESS! (ever see your dog try and chew on shredded tire remains on the ground...?) On another thread i asked Josh Cyrul what to start the tires (JACO Plaid, Purple, Double Pinks, and Double Pink/Oranges) out for 19T , he said 2.28 (58mm) to start and he would practice twice on them. Then 2.25 to 2.23 for the qualifiers and mains. Now after cutting all of my JACO tires today, starting at 59mm, or 2.315, i noticed that there was little left on the tires. You asked what the minimum is, and i think anything below 2.23 would put you on a rubberband of a tire! Cut an old tire to see.... you'll find out what i mean! It sounds to me, like your problem lies in a bent hingepin. Maybe a bent shock shaft? You said you broke a front C-hub, did you remove all four shocks and see if the arms dropped on their own weight? I know you said you checked all of it, but it really sounds like something is preventing the car from working right in the corner. To check tweak and droop, the suspension would have to "fall" on its own, but if you had tires on it, the extra weight could have masked the bent pin/shock shaft. Everyone does it a little different. Consistency is the key, and what you are doing sounds right. I just think your problem isnt tires, but somewhere else.... could you have maybe put plaids on the back and purples on the front by accident?? That will make the car swap ends in a heartbeat... no matter WHAT you do...(even if you replace your front shocks with turnbuckles from tower to arm to remove the added steering!!!) Not that i have ever done that or anything...
Lets just say, i no longer toss all of my tires UNLABELED in a box! - Dave
01-12-2004, 07:01 AM
#7420
Tech Legend
iTrader: (51)
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Castle Mamba Max Pro. Feel its power!!!!!!!!!!
Posts: 21,220
Trader Rating: 51 (100%+)
DaveW that always sucks to cut tires that are new from 63mm out of the box all the way to 59mm. Man their goes alot of tire. I know on carpet they need to be smaller but it is still painful to have to cut them down like that. I bet you had a nice pile of foam dust left over after cutting your tires. The tire machine was working overtime. I hope the machine was paid time and a half for the extra work. If not and the machine is union he it will strike on you and have signs that says stop unfair truing practices.
I hope the machine was paid time and a half for the extra work. If not and the machine is union he it will strike on you and have signs that says stop unfair truing practices.
N
01-12-2004, 11:36 AM
#7422
WYD: Pay the tire truer?? Heck no, an automatic Corally lathe set me back enough, it was paid for and will never see another red cent! I was surprised, it never got the least bit warm nor hesitated in cutting all of those tires... i set it at 59 and let it fly... no smoke or anything like that... its a damn good truer. It really didnt cut the tires off in powder form like i have seen some other truers do, it came off in layers, like i was peeling a skin off of an orange. Tires were true and smooth, so i aint complaining! It does suck to have to cut them down that much, but i guess there are some things you have to pay for no matter what you may want. It would be nice if JACO sold tires precut to 60mm and knocked 5$ off of the price. I wouldnt mind paying 14.95 for a set of tires that made less work for me. You know they are making a killing on tires at 18$ a set!
- Dave
Pay the tire truer?? Heck no, an automatic Corally lathe set me back enough, it was paid for and will never see another red cent! I was surprised, it never got the least bit warm nor hesitated in cutting all of those tires... i set it at 59 and let it fly... no smoke or anything like that... its a damn good truer. It really didnt cut the tires off in powder form like i have seen some other truers do, it came off in layers, like i was peeling a skin off of an orange. Tires were true and smooth, so i aint complaining! It does suck to have to cut them down that much, but i guess there are some things you have to pay for no matter what you may want. It would be nice if JACO sold tires precut to 60mm and knocked 5$ off of the price. I wouldnt mind paying 14.95 for a set of tires that made less work for me. You know they are making a killing on tires at 18$ a set! - Dave
01-12-2004, 01:27 PM
#7423
dave, i agree! you can't run the foams at 63mm, they'll chuck the edges off and be trash before they wear to 59mm. might as well cut them down and run 'em till it's just wheel & powder! it's hard to take $40 for tires and blow through them in a weekend.... i'm all for buying at 60mm for less $$$$$.
01-12-2004, 02:28 PM
#7424
Tech Legend
iTrader: (51)
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Castle Mamba Max Pro. Feel its power!!!!!!!!!!
Posts: 21,220
Trader Rating: 51 (100%+)
DaveW your right about making a killing on tires. I use a set of foams about every two weeks and sometime I do make 3 but that is only on occasion. Glad your truer worked for you. That ole drill press technique sucks. I happen to use my old tried and true Maxmod. Seems to much tires pretty good and I have over the years munched a few sets of tires. Good luck at the Birds.
Good luck at the Birds.
01-12-2004, 04:29 PM
#7425
Dave-
What classes are you running
What classes are you running