What generator do you use at the races?
06-04-2010, 01:37 AM
#17
Tech Regular
I was actually doing a bit of testing for Kipor on this unit (I'm a product test engineer for John Deere by trade, so they were rather interested in my feedback). Overall, it's an outstanding unit. The engine is indeed a copy of the Honda, but the electronics package is a different design.
The run time, power output, noise, size, & weight are all right on par with the Honda, but I did find one significant shortcoming on the Kipor. The electronics package (inverter / throttle control motor / "smart throttle" load sensing circuitry) has issues with any type of heat gun when anything less than max load is placed on the generator. Where the Honda will kick up to the high idle setting and maintain it smoothly regardless of the heat load, the Kipor engine varies speed wildly, with the RPM going from just above the "smart throttle" reduced RPM setting, to more than 1500 RPM above the maximum listed spec. Additionally, in some instances (such as a hair dryer on the low or medium heat setting), the unit will incorrectly go directly to overload, and kick into self protect mode.
I worked with Kipor to determine root cause on this issue, and it was found that the electronics package in the IG2000 / IG2000P gets confused by the way heat guns (or hair dryers) vary the heat output. Depending on the setting, the Kipor generator is either unable to determine the actual load being placed on it, hence the varying RPM, or believes that it is encountering a dead short, which results in the incorrect "overload" scenario. They are working with the engineering group in China to resolve the problem, now that they know about it. With the exception of this one fault, I can honestly say that the Kipor is an excellent unit, and I would not hesitate to buy one.
The RC scene is a unique market segment, where heat guns/hair dryers are routinely used (although, I would think that folks in the RV community, where Kipor is a much bigger name, would use hair dryers all the time. However, they were genuinely caught off guard when I brought this to their attention). If you are one of the folks running nitro who uses a heat gun or hair dryer on their engine, then I would steer clear of the Kipor generator (or just switch to a motor heater like I did....they work just fine with the IG2000
).
Sorry if this is a bit long-winded. I just wanted to make sure that I'm watching out for my fellow RC racers.
The run time, power output, noise, size, & weight are all right on par with the Honda, but I did find one significant shortcoming on the Kipor. The electronics package (inverter / throttle control motor / "smart throttle" load sensing circuitry) has issues with any type of heat gun when anything less than max load is placed on the generator. Where the Honda will kick up to the high idle setting and maintain it smoothly regardless of the heat load, the Kipor engine varies speed wildly, with the RPM going from just above the "smart throttle" reduced RPM setting, to more than 1500 RPM above the maximum listed spec. Additionally, in some instances (such as a hair dryer on the low or medium heat setting), the unit will incorrectly go directly to overload, and kick into self protect mode.
I worked with Kipor to determine root cause on this issue, and it was found that the electronics package in the IG2000 / IG2000P gets confused by the way heat guns (or hair dryers) vary the heat output. Depending on the setting, the Kipor generator is either unable to determine the actual load being placed on it, hence the varying RPM, or believes that it is encountering a dead short, which results in the incorrect "overload" scenario. They are working with the engineering group in China to resolve the problem, now that they know about it. With the exception of this one fault, I can honestly say that the Kipor is an excellent unit, and I would not hesitate to buy one.
The RC scene is a unique market segment, where heat guns/hair dryers are routinely used (although, I would think that folks in the RV community, where Kipor is a much bigger name, would use hair dryers all the time. However, they were genuinely caught off guard when I brought this to their attention). If you are one of the folks running nitro who uses a heat gun or hair dryer on their engine, then I would steer clear of the Kipor generator (or just switch to a motor heater like I did....they work just fine with the IG2000
).Sorry if this is a bit long-winded. I just wanted to make sure that I'm watching out for my fellow RC racers.
06-04-2010, 03:23 AM
#18
Tech Fanatic
iTrader: (1)
Oh that Kipor. I work in the RV world and I've sold 'em all. Want to lose your mind on repairs, mostly voltage reg.,Kipor will send you over the dark side. When you buy any gen set make sure it's a name you've heard of. And the little things matter. Like when your done with it, turn off the fuel and let it run out of gas. The ethanol in pump fuel will gag out the carb in no time. Change the oil often. Air cooled motors use oil for cooling also so it breakes down fast. Most only use one qt. so no big deal. I see alot of people mount it on the jack in front, if so get a cover for it. There a nice one at Northern Tools that works on most. Realy the best I've seen is a Coleman Micro Lite. Very quite and runs very little fuel, has all the power you'll ever need. But they are pricey. How ever when you sell/trade in it jacks the price up real well. Gen sets are like servos, you get what you pay for, plain and simple.
06-04-2010, 05:10 AM
#21
Now, answering your question, even with the smart throttle off, the unit still behaved as I described. It's an inherent design flaw in the current units elctronics package. The Honda, Yamaha, Generac, and even the Briggs Inverter style generators work just fine when using a heat gun (I tried this same test on all of them).
06-04-2010, 05:23 AM
#22
Oh that Kipor. I work in the RV world and I've sold 'em all. Want to lose your mind on repairs, mostly voltage reg.,Kipor will send you over the dark side. When you buy any gen set make sure it's a name you've heard of. And the little things matter. Like when your done with it, turn off the fuel and let it run out of gas. The ethanol in pump fuel will gag out the carb in no time. Change the oil often. Air cooled motors use oil for cooling also so it breakes down fast. Most only use one qt. so no big deal. I see alot of people mount it on the jack in front, if so get a cover for it. There a nice one at Northern Tools that works on most. Realy the best I've seen is a Coleman Micro Lite. Very quite and runs very little fuel, has all the power you'll ever need. But they are pricey. How ever when you sell/trade in it jacks the price up real well. Gen sets are like servos, you get what you pay for, plain and simple.
I've been told that when the proposed fix is completed, they want to send me the updated controller to install in my unit, and see if it solves the problem. Only time will tell if they're committed enough to actually solve the problem, and follow through with this, but I'm happy with it so far.
As far as fuel goes, I only use 100LL aviation fuel in all of my small engines, with the addition of TCP to address lead deposits. Aviation fuel requires no stabilizer, and is rated for strorage in plastic container for 2+ years. This is the same fuel that we run our equipment with on the assembly lines, since those engines may not be started again for some time. When it evaporates, it leaves no residue behind to gum up the carb. My local regional airport sells it to the gereral public...they even have a credit card reader at the pump.
06-05-2010, 08:22 AM
#24
06-06-2010, 06:16 PM
#26
Thanks for all the replies! great info too. I wish I could afford a honda but that is just out of the question right now. When I buy it is going to be for my house too since I live in Florida so 5500 or higher is what I will be buying. I have a line on a coleman and a troybuilt both $300 each and 6500 but just not sure if they are worth it used and they didnt come up much in this thread. will have to bring some goodies like a heat gun and such to test them. If I have too I will install a better exhaust on my farmer gen. when I get it, dont like the noise much myself. anyways thanks greatly for the input
guys!
Matt
guys!
Matt
06-07-2010, 05:35 AM
#27
Tech Adept
Thanks for all the replies! great info too. I wish I could afford a honda but that is just out of the question right now. When I buy it is going to be for my house too since I live in Florida so 5500 or higher is what I will be buying. I have a line on a coleman and a troybuilt both $300 each and 6500 but just not sure if they are worth it used and they didnt come up much in this thread. will have to bring some goodies like a heat gun and such to test them. If I have too I will install a better exhaust on my farmer gen. when I get it, dont like the noise much myself. anyways thanks greatly for the input
guys!
Matt
guys!
Matt
You're better off buying a quieter generator. A quieter muffler that fits is likely going to be more expensive than you're expecting and it might be difficult to find one that fits. Spend a little more now and get one that's already quieter. Here's an example of a bunch to choose from, some of which are pretty quiet for not much cash. This is hurricane season (at least here) so these things are everywhere in the local stores:
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/too...00-4-999-watts
Good luck!
06-08-2010, 09:40 AM
#30
- Using a heat gun - usually no less than 2000W, unless it's a VERY small heat gun.
- Running an 12,000 BTU (1 ton) A/C unit, such as found on a trailer - 3000W minimum (4000W is preferrable).
- Air compressor - Motor HP will determine size. 1 HP = 745.69 watts. Figure 2.5 times for start up wattage requirement, and 80% efficiency on the motor. (ex. 1.5 HP compressor motor will require 3495.42 Watts at start up [1.5 x 745.69 x 2.5 / .80 = 3495.42]. In that situation, you'd want to buy a 4000W generator).
In general, you want to size the generator so that, with all the items you plan to run at once, including start up requirements, you don't exceed 80-85% of the rated output of the generator. Running them at full capacity for extended periods will both consume fuel very fast, and also greatly shorten the unit's life expectancy.
Here's a very informative link...worth reading before buying a generator.
Last edited by Stubbs; 06-09-2010 at 08:51 AM. Reason: fixing typos...