Are expensive motors worth it?
02-18-2016, 07:18 PM
#1
Are expensive motors worth it?
So I am just starting into RC again and have a couple questions:
1. Is there a big difference between a cheap motor and an expensive one if they have the same turns?
I can get a Trackstar 17.5 T for less than $50 or I can spend over double the cost on another brand. Is it worth for a beginner to splurge on those fancy motors??
2. From what I have been reading, these motors pull less than 50 amps. SO what's the point of getting an expensive battery that puts out 100s of amp?
It might make sense for a professional in a racing situation, bit does it matter if I'm just practicing on track?
People are convincing me to dump $100s for just the battery and a motor, but it makes no sence for me to do that when you run once or twice a week for fun. Yeah, I do want to go faster of course, but does it really require me to get a $150 motor and a $100 battery.
I'll probably end up getting a used motor to save money, but my question still stands.
1. Is there a big difference between a cheap motor and an expensive one if they have the same turns?
I can get a Trackstar 17.5 T for less than $50 or I can spend over double the cost on another brand. Is it worth for a beginner to splurge on those fancy motors??
2. From what I have been reading, these motors pull less than 50 amps. SO what's the point of getting an expensive battery that puts out 100s of amp?
It might make sense for a professional in a racing situation, bit does it matter if I'm just practicing on track?
People are convincing me to dump $100s for just the battery and a motor, but it makes no sence for me to do that when you run once or twice a week for fun. Yeah, I do want to go faster of course, but does it really require me to get a $150 motor and a $100 battery.
I'll probably end up getting a used motor to save money, but my question still stands.
02-18-2016, 07:43 PM
#2
If you can get the people who are trying to convince you to spend the big money to pay for it, go for it .But if they want you to pay ..... Pass
Best way to go faster is to practice practice and more practice .
An esc from a name brand will usually be a better place to spend on an upgrade as you will get better results than from one that's included in an rtr vehicle .
That said best place for improvement would be the rubber , that's what hits the road So it doesn't matter how much you spend anywhere else , if the tires are crap you aren't going anywhere .
Best way to go faster is to practice practice and more practice .
An esc from a name brand will usually be a better place to spend on an upgrade as you will get better results than from one that's included in an rtr vehicle .
That said best place for improvement would be the rubber , that's what hits the road So it doesn't matter how much you spend anywhere else , if the tires are crap you aren't going anywhere .
02-18-2016, 07:54 PM
#3
Short answer is no, you do NOT have to spend a fortune today to get solid motors & batteries. As an example, are the Trackstar 17.5's you mentioned yourself, I've tried one in my 2WD buggy, & I was VERY impressed, felt every bit as strong as the $130 Schurrspeed Signature edition 17.5 that I've had for awhile(& the lap times bore that out as well, those little guys have a LOT of torque, & decent top end to go with it, only downside I noticed is that they seem to run about 10-15 degrees F hotter than my Schurrspeed over the course of a race, but still stay within the usual tolerances). And about batteries, here is a good example of quality batteries at a good price( http://www.promatchracing.com/products.php?cat=38 ), I have several of them, & they do just fine. Keep in mind that those C ratings are a bit deceptive, as every retailer has their own standard & their own method of calculating it. And also, remember that the battery's C rating does not mean it'll force anything into a system, the battery will only put out what the motor & ESC demand of it. The higher ratings do usually mean lower internal resistance, which can help with punch, but just ONE brush against a wall, or one bad landing off a jump will waste every little bit of advantage those $100+ batteries might give you, so your mileage may vary...
02-18-2016, 08:16 PM
#5
Short answer is no, you do NOT have to spend a fortune today to get solid motors & batteries. As an example, are the Trackstar 17.5's you mentioned yourself, I've tried one in my 2WD buggy, & I was VERY impressed, felt every bit as strong as the $130 Schurrspeed Signature edition 17.5 that I've had for awhile(& the lap times bore that out as well, those little guys have a LOT of torque, & decent top end to go with it, only downside I noticed is that they seem to run about 10-15 degrees F hotter than my Schurrspeed over the course of a race, but still stay within the usual tolerances). And about batteries, here is a good example of quality batteries at a good price( http://www.promatchracing.com/products.php?cat=38 ), I have several of them, & they do just fine. Keep in mind that those C ratings are a bit deceptive, as every retailer has their own standard & their own method of calculating it. And also, remember that the battery's C rating does not mean it'll force anything into a system, the battery will only put out what the motor & ESC demand of it. The higher ratings do usually mean lower internal resistance, which can help with punch, but just ONE brush against a wall, or one bad landing off a jump will waste every little bit of advantage those $100+ batteries might give you, so your mileage may vary...
But the promatch ones look pretty good. I guess I'll go with the TrackStart motor unless I can find something else used.
02-18-2016, 08:20 PM
#6
If you can get the people who are trying to convince you to spend the big money to pay for it, go for it .But if they want you to pay ..... Pass
Best way to go faster is to practice practice and more practice .
An esc from a name brand will usually be a better place to spend on an upgrade as you will get better results than from one that's included in an rtr vehicle .
That said best place for improvement would be the rubber , that's what hits the road So it doesn't matter how much you spend anywhere else , if the tires are crap you aren't going anywhere .
Best way to go faster is to practice practice and more practice .
An esc from a name brand will usually be a better place to spend on an upgrade as you will get better results than from one that's included in an rtr vehicle .
That said best place for improvement would be the rubber , that's what hits the road So it doesn't matter how much you spend anywhere else , if the tires are crap you aren't going anywhere .
I'm using a TrackStar 120A esc with a Novak Ballistic 21.5 right now. So I guess an ESC should be my next upgrade
I also have a Novak GTB ESC in my SCT. bit I'm guessing that it won't work well since its so old.
02-19-2016, 02:03 AM
#7
We use LRP or Muchmore motors in our touring car. Previously ORCA.
Some at our local track sometimes uses cheaper options, and I often think that I can feel and see that they are....... cheaper.
But whether that is only a subjective opinion with no real evidence, I don't know, but I have always believed, that the real price premium you pay for with a brand motor, esc or lipo is quality control.
Buying only brand motors, esc and lipos now, we have NEVER had a motor, esc or lipo that did not work out of the box. Never had a "mysterious" malfunction.
Totally undocumented, I believe if you buy a LRP, Muchmore, ORCA etc. motor from their "pro" series, you get a product that have been through a stricter quality control than a Hobbyking Trackstar product or equivalent.
Previously we used a lot of the cheaper products, and we had occasionally a products not working from the box or dying shortly after only light use. This didn't bothered us, because we could buy 2 or 3 of e.g. the motor for the same price as a brand motor. And when they worked, they worked great. You could be just as competitive as with brand products.
Then we became more serious with our racing and today take our racing quite seriously and travel to international races.
Suddenly it was not OK to have a motor, esc or lipo suddenly die on you during a race. Off course, you could replace a faulty discount product with a new one, but at many races the number of heats are limited, and you cannot afford loosing some.
When we go to a race, we have to have maximum trust in our motor, esc and lipo. If we replace a motor, esc or lipo, we must know for sure that it works. Not a 25% (just an example) chance that it may or may not work.
To me, that is the main difference between a brand product and a discount product. The discount product is OK when it works, but the failure rate is just too high for some users.
An example of a brand motor were quality control is a highlighted featute of the motor. This off course is costly, and you pay for that.
http://www.reds-racing.com/#!vx-540-...ed-motor/pd7wu
And yes, I know that brand products can also fail, I do not mean that they NEVER fail, just to a much lower extent than discount products.
So, if you do not need the higher reliability offered by the brand products, you should buy a discount product. When they work, they work just as well.
Some at our local track sometimes uses cheaper options, and I often think that I can feel and see that they are....... cheaper.
But whether that is only a subjective opinion with no real evidence, I don't know, but I have always believed, that the real price premium you pay for with a brand motor, esc or lipo is quality control.
Buying only brand motors, esc and lipos now, we have NEVER had a motor, esc or lipo that did not work out of the box. Never had a "mysterious" malfunction.
Totally undocumented, I believe if you buy a LRP, Muchmore, ORCA etc. motor from their "pro" series, you get a product that have been through a stricter quality control than a Hobbyking Trackstar product or equivalent.
Previously we used a lot of the cheaper products, and we had occasionally a products not working from the box or dying shortly after only light use. This didn't bothered us, because we could buy 2 or 3 of e.g. the motor for the same price as a brand motor. And when they worked, they worked great. You could be just as competitive as with brand products.
Then we became more serious with our racing and today take our racing quite seriously and travel to international races.
Suddenly it was not OK to have a motor, esc or lipo suddenly die on you during a race. Off course, you could replace a faulty discount product with a new one, but at many races the number of heats are limited, and you cannot afford loosing some.
When we go to a race, we have to have maximum trust in our motor, esc and lipo. If we replace a motor, esc or lipo, we must know for sure that it works. Not a 25% (just an example) chance that it may or may not work.
To me, that is the main difference between a brand product and a discount product. The discount product is OK when it works, but the failure rate is just too high for some users.
An example of a brand motor were quality control is a highlighted featute of the motor. This off course is costly, and you pay for that.
http://www.reds-racing.com/#!vx-540-...ed-motor/pd7wu
And yes, I know that brand products can also fail, I do not mean that they NEVER fail, just to a much lower extent than discount products.
So, if you do not need the higher reliability offered by the brand products, you should buy a discount product. When they work, they work just as well.
02-19-2016, 05:07 AM
#8
Saikin I do agree with you. Many of the top brand motors are manually checked and matched properly to achieve the best possible result for a 'customer' motor. These motors are more powerful, more reliable and generally run cooler than The cheaper Chinese versions such as trackstar which have been made by machine and probably never even tested just mass produced, boxed and shipped out. There is no doubt that the leading brand names motors have the edge over the cheaper Chinese alternatives however for the average club racer there is nothing wrong with that type of motor. However for me I'll stick to what I believe and trust in.
Another point about the Chinese stuff is they don't innovate or develop products. They just copy what the lead brands are doing. If we don't support these leading brands by investing in their products then the development budgets shrink and we don't progress the technology. I personally do not support the Chinese copy brands at all as it really doesn't do our hobby any favours at all for the future.
Another point about the Chinese stuff is they don't innovate or develop products. They just copy what the lead brands are doing. If we don't support these leading brands by investing in their products then the development budgets shrink and we don't progress the technology. I personally do not support the Chinese copy brands at all as it really doesn't do our hobby any favours at all for the future.
02-19-2016, 06:15 AM
#9
Tech Addict
iTrader: (10)
Yeah the ties were the first thing I bought and they made a massive difference.
I'm using a TrackStar 120A esc with a Novak Ballistic 21.5 right now. So I guess an ESC should be my next upgrade
I also have a Novak GTB ESC in my SCT. bit I'm guessing that it won't work well since its so old.
I'm using a TrackStar 120A esc with a Novak Ballistic 21.5 right now. So I guess an ESC should be my next upgrade
I also have a Novak GTB ESC in my SCT. bit I'm guessing that it won't work well since its so old.
02-19-2016, 08:02 AM
#10
THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT ESC, I RUN THE TRACKSTAR 120A TURBO AND THE GREEN SLINGSHOT 17.5 IN MY B5M AND WHEN GEARED PROPERLY I HAVE NO ISSUES. MY DRIVING SKILLS HAVE ISSUES BUT SPEED AND TORQUE ARE THERE. IF YOU CAN GET INTO THE AMAIN AND RUN THE LENGTH WITH NO CRASH OR 1-2 MARSHALLS THAN YOU MAY LOOK AT SPENDING MORE MONEY ON ELECTRONICS UNTIL THAN YOU ARE JUST PAYING MORE MONEY TO CRASH LOL.
02-19-2016, 01:30 PM
#11
The only thing that I feel I'm lacking at this point(besides skill of course) is punch coming out of the corners. I see others hit the throttle at the exit and they blast off. I am running a 21.5 though. I think I might order the trackstar motor and a SMC lipo and go from there.
I guess then I'll find out if the esc is holding me back or not. I'll look used first though, being a student I can't just start dumping money into the hobby right now.
I guess then I'll find out if the esc is holding me back or not. I'll look used first though, being a student I can't just start dumping money into the hobby right now.
02-19-2016, 01:53 PM
#12
skill is important, but imo, equipments are equally important.
I am a newbie (started 2 months ago), but I don't drive like one.
Why?
Because I have been using race proved equipments, used or new.
I like the idea of buying once and buy it right.
Not to mention... better equipments do improve lap times, I think as a newbie, it is definitely encouraging to see you aren't far behind compared to the "fast guys".
I am a newbie (started 2 months ago), but I don't drive like one.
Why?
Because I have been using race proved equipments, used or new.
I like the idea of buying once and buy it right.
Not to mention... better equipments do improve lap times, I think as a newbie, it is definitely encouraging to see you aren't far behind compared to the "fast guys".
02-19-2016, 02:16 PM
#13
skill is important, but imo, equipments are equally important.
I am a newbie (started 2 months ago), but I don't drive like one.
Why?
Because I have been using race proved equipments, used or new.
I like the idea of buying once and buy it right.
Not to mention... better equipments do improve lap times, I think as a newbie, it is definitely encouraging to see you aren't far behind compared to the "fast guys".
I am a newbie (started 2 months ago), but I don't drive like one.
Why?
Because I have been using race proved equipments, used or new.
I like the idea of buying once and buy it right.
Not to mention... better equipments do improve lap times, I think as a newbie, it is definitely encouraging to see you aren't far behind compared to the "fast guys".
02-19-2016, 02:36 PM
#14
It sounds like you are young, which means, you can learn faster and probably master this hobby sooner.
It feels good to drive a fast car, but it feels much , much better to spank guys with faster cars in a slower car!
I think most guys develop skills first and then move onto better equipments, while I am kind of doing it in a opposite way, I am trying to get best equipments I could comfirtablely afford, and then improve my skills.
Either, you need both in the end. Might as well just up your skills first while you are still in school.
02-19-2016, 02:47 PM
#15
You have no ideas, I get a lot of free stuff from my friends I met at track.
Bodies, motor, and tire cleaner etc, battery.
Some of them were close to new condition.
Also, they usually will give you amazing deals, cuz they are your friends.
I am not saying I am taking advantages of anyone.
I am offering help and try to provide them stuff as much as I can too.
this hobby is hard on your own.