Go Back  R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Radio and Electronics
New radio= faster laps? >

New radio= faster laps?

New radio= faster laps?

Old 03-22-2015, 07:25 PM
  #1  
Tech Addict
Thread Starter
iTrader: (27)
 
crazy nick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Emmaus , PA
Posts: 540
Trader Rating: 27 (100%+)
Default New radio= faster laps?

So i raced the first time with my new lynx 4s today. For the last year i ve been running a 4pl. So I ve really been struggling being consistant and pulling fast laps. Well last week i was 20 second lap times. Today, 18's alll day and the fastest lap with a 17.4. Out of everyone in every class. I really didnt think transit time would make much a difference, but the numbers completely proved me wrong. Anyone else ever switch to a higher end remote and get noticably faster and more consistant?
crazy nick is offline  
Old 03-22-2015, 07:30 PM
  #2  
Tech Lord
iTrader: (24)
 
wingracer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,730
Trader Rating: 24 (100%+)
Default

Faster? No, not really. More consistent with fewer mistakes? Oh hell yes! Latency is a bitch, keep it at a minimum.
wingracer is offline  
Old 03-22-2015, 08:03 PM
  #3  
Tech Addict
Thread Starter
iTrader: (27)
 
crazy nick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Emmaus , PA
Posts: 540
Trader Rating: 27 (100%+)
Default

Thats what i thought also, i ve gone down hill since the day i bought the 4pl. I never felt in tune with my car. Now with the new tx, i just feel much more in tune with it. I cant believe that latency makes that much of a difference. I will never cheap out on a radio ever again.
crazy nick is offline  
Old 03-22-2015, 09:10 PM
  #4  
Tech Master
iTrader: (15)
 
sschultz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: SW Minnesota
Posts: 1,351
Trader Rating: 15 (100%+)
Default

agreed, got a m11x this season and its night and day difference to what I was running. I know the m11x is not the latest and greatest, but its nice and works great for me....
sschultz is offline  
Old 03-23-2015, 01:49 AM
  #5  
Tech Master
iTrader: (5)
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,876
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Default

There might be a threshold that once you drop below it your driving might suffer. I don't think I can run any faster laps with my 4PKSR than my MT4 or my M12 than my 4PKSR. I would say all these radios are above the threshold. Now, when I have my gf my old MT4 to replace her Traxxas rtr radio she was immediately driving better. She said the response was more linear to her input and faster. I would say the Traxxas radio was below the threshold. Ergonomics was an issue too.
My ST-RR EVO is offline  
Old 03-23-2015, 08:55 AM
  #6  
Tech Elite
iTrader: (33)
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Austin, Tx
Posts: 2,384
Trader Rating: 33 (100%+)
Default

i agree with everyone here.. good radio.. qith fast response times.. makes a big difference. and after using the fastest.. even when the upgrades come out.. i notice the difference.

i ran M8, thought it was the best.. then ran the Helios.. wow.. then after so many years with my helios.. a friend was selling a eurus for a great deal.. and needed money.. i decided to get it.. didnt think i would notice a difference.. and wow.. same thing. much quicker..

i have switched from eurus to EX-1.. and noticed a difference again.. i have not, yet.. upgraded to the newest faster ko receivers yet.. but.. who knows how much better they will be then..

also.. to me.. you spend all this money on a car.. motor.. servos.. everything.. only to run some flysky or off brand 100 dollar radio.. when.. that should be your best thing anyway.. why would you want 100 dollar cheapo radio.. controlling your 800+ dollar equipment..

dont chinch on your radio..
dgrobe2112 is offline  
Old 03-23-2015, 02:51 PM
  #7  
Tech Lord
iTrader: (24)
 
wingracer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,730
Trader Rating: 24 (100%+)
Default

You can go cheap on the radio if you do it right. Used M11Xs and MT4S's are pretty cheap and very near as fast as the best of the best. I've been using a M11 for years (slight but noticeable improvement over the M8) but just now picked up a used M12.
wingracer is offline  
Old 03-23-2015, 04:14 PM
  #8  
Tech Master
iTrader: (1)
 
R1Joel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,183
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

I went from a Futaba 3PRKA to an MT4 and felt the difference immediately on a friends backyard track. The response time was incredible. When I was racing I immediately noticed the difference more. I did approx 5 minutes straight with no crashing where as before I was making mistakes.
Before I bought a buggy I just had a Slash. I took the Futaba out of the Slash to put in the buggy(before I had the MT4) and put a cheap flysky in the Slash. It was undriveable. (more the usual). The Futaba was a big jump up from the Flysky and the Mt4 was an even bigger jump ahead from the Futuba.
R1Joel is offline  
Old 03-23-2015, 05:02 PM
  #9  
Tech Elite
iTrader: (1)
 
sakadachi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: USA
Posts: 2,354
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

I think it has to do more with ergonomics as someone already posted.
People get use to minor latency.
sakadachi is offline  
Old 03-23-2015, 05:51 PM
  #10  
Tech Lord
iTrader: (24)
 
wingracer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,730
Trader Rating: 24 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by sakadachi
People get use to minor latency.
That's actually very true but there is another problem to contend with. Cheap radios with high latency also tend to have a big variance in the latency, especially if they also have a low frame rate. A fast, high frame rate radio might have an average latency of say 4ms with a high of 6 and a low of 2 so the biggest difference you will ever see from one input to the next is 4ms. A cheap radio might have an average latency of 20ms but it varies from 12 to 30. That's not good. If it was 20ms EVERY SINGLE TIME, no problem at all but if one corner it responds in 12 and the next corner 28, you will struggle with consistency.
wingracer is offline  
Old 03-23-2015, 07:40 PM
  #11  
Tech Addict
Thread Starter
iTrader: (27)
 
crazy nick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Emmaus , PA
Posts: 540
Trader Rating: 27 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by wingracer
That's actually very true but there is another problem to contend with. Cheap radios with high latency also tend to have a big variance in the latency, especially if they also have a low frame rate. A fast, high frame rate radio might have an average latency of say 4ms with a high of 6 and a low of 2 so the biggest difference you will ever see from one input to the next is 4ms. A cheap radio might have an average latency of 20ms but it varies from 12 to 30. That's not good. If it was 20ms EVERY SINGLE TIME, no problem at all but if one corner it responds in 12 and the next corner 28, you will struggle with consistency.
Very good explanation. I new better radios have less latency, but didn't no there was a variance like that. Kind of like gas, 93 octane isnt always 93, but it is atleast 93+. To me it makes perfect sence. I had an mt4 with a 471 receiver(4ms claimed) latency. I would qualify pretty good and as season went on my lap times would improve. Then i sold it due to financial reasons. When i started racing again i bought an mx-v. I could not be consistant with it at all so i sold it and bought a used 4pl with the cheaper receiver. I ve struggled for a whole year badly. I thought i was just getting old and washed up. I was never consistant at all with it. Now since I bought the lynx 4s , My lap times were better by 2 second average (which is a whole lot). I went from makin the C main every week to placing 3rd in the A main and pulling the fastest lap of the day. No way is it just the ergonomics of the radio.
crazy nick is offline  
Old 03-23-2015, 08:50 PM
  #12  
Tech Champion
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 7,342
Default

Get used to minor latency? Perhaps on a clean lap, adjust turn in. But what about unexpected slides, traffic not working as expected, etc?
Dave H is offline  
Old 03-23-2015, 10:36 PM
  #13  
sbd
Tech Regular
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 378
Default

Originally Posted by wingracer
That's actually very true but there is another problem to contend with. Cheap radios with high latency also tend to have a big variance in the latency, especially if they also have a low frame rate. A fast, high frame rate radio might have an average latency of say 4ms with a high of 6 and a low of 2 so the biggest difference you will ever see from one input to the next is 4ms. A cheap radio might have an average latency of 20ms but it varies from 12 to 30. That's not good. If it was 20ms EVERY SINGLE TIME, no problem at all but if one corner it responds in 12 and the next corner 28, you will struggle with consistency.

Hi,
Do you have some objective measurements proving the statement the cheep radios are significantly more inconsistent? This is regularly stated assumption I had never seen evidence for.
sbd is offline  
Old 03-24-2015, 04:40 AM
  #14  
Tech Lord
iTrader: (24)
 
wingracer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,730
Trader Rating: 24 (100%+)
Default

No I don't because I have never seen proper independent tests on car radios however if you do some searching you can find lots of tests on plane radios. Heli guys seem particularly preoccupied with latency. The variance on some plane radios is disturbing.

Also it doesn't take tests to realize that lower frame rates are going to have more variance. Just think about it.

Also, I use the word "cheap" as a generalization but it isn't really accurate. I'm sure some cheap radios perform quite well (MT4 for example) while some expensive ones are junk.
wingracer is offline  
Old 03-24-2015, 07:03 AM
  #15  
sbd
Tech Regular
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 378
Default

Originally Posted by wingracer
Also it doesn't take tests to realize that lower frame rates are going to have more variance. Just think about it.
You just make me think about it. Should a lower frame rate mean slower (as fr 20ms vs fr 3ms -> 20ms is lower fr) I absolutely agree.

It is unfortunate we do not have good RF stability and error correction comparison for our radios to be able to objectively compare the different brands/RF systems as all use different variation of the spread spectrum technology.
sbd is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.