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Old 09-05-2014, 11:20 AM   #16
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Anyone have these in stock?
Brooklyn Hobbies has one for sale for $340
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Old 09-05-2014, 11:22 AM   #17
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For That price your better off getting the MMS, RMS, and you have enough money to pick up the brushless motor checker. Looks like they might be a new one if they are asking about voting on up dates and what they could do to make it better..
MMS and RMS are completely different tools, they will tell you internal resistance and magnet strength. They will not tell you anything about timing. i.e. that a certain manufacturers zero is 35 and another manufacturers zero is -7.

I'm going to label my endbells with the "zero read" from this device.

it is well overpriced, I'll agree with that!
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Old 09-05-2014, 11:25 AM   #18
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MMS and RMS are completely different tools, they will tell you internal resistance and magnet strength. They will not tell you anything about timing. i.e. that a certain manufacturers zero is 35 and another manufacturers zero is -7.

I'm going to label my endbells with the "zero read" from this device.

it is well overpriced, I'll agree with that!
I have that and all the MMS stuff also. And yes the price is way to high
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Old 09-05-2014, 12:34 PM   #19
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I have that and all the MMS stuff also. And yes the price is way to high
Hey for us neofites what is MMS and RMS? How do I google that?
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Old 09-05-2014, 03:34 PM   #20
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Hey for us neofites what is MMS and RMS? How do I google that?
Mms measures stator inductance.

Just buy one of these.

http://www.mcpappyracing.com/dyno.php

I think what we can all agree on, is:

1. None of the motor manufactures put their neutral (0 degree) timing in the same place, and
2. Even if they did, the pickup board variances mean there is extreme difference between one motor to the next (assuming the motors are the same), and
3. Every individual motor has a sweet spot where you advance past and the motors amp draw skyrockets and the motor stops making more power, and
4. That Trinity piece is pricy. So is the rotor checker. So is the inductance meter.

If I cared that much and had unlimited budget, I'd own a rotor checker and maybe a dyno. Heck, I might buy one anyway. I bought every other darn thing.....
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Old 09-05-2014, 03:37 PM   #21
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A Cheap Way To Measure Stator Resistance

Might want to try this if you want to check em on the cheap.
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Old 09-05-2014, 06:49 PM   #22
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I got mine from Trinity today. With the "upgraded wire" kit... same wires included in the box... well almost, the box had two black wires and no blue. So stay away from that particular "upgrade".

I tested it on some of my motors tonight.

R1 V7 21.5 - Phase A, B and C - not even close, brand new, never run before, factory 0 - read 35

Schuurspeed Extreme Spec 17.5 v3 - brand new, never run before. factory setting 35 - read 40

Speed Passion Competition 3.0 MMM - brand new, never run before. Red timing board (+10), so said 30, read 43-45

LRP Stock spec X20 21.5 - used. 37.5 timing insert, read at 40.

Trinity Killshot High RPM 21.5 - used (TA06), timing at 55, read at 40. Then at 0, read -7

Trinity Killshot High RPM 21.5 - used (TB04), timing at 50, read at 35. Then at 0, read -8

images posted here

My killshots read similar, it would be very cool if more motolysers started sharing. I'll keep mine in my pitbox when I'm at Tamiya, we could compare motolysers as well. make sure they read the same.
Got mine today and I'm beginning to have serious questions about the accuracy of the timing readings. Most of my 21.5 motors read low on the motorlyser compared to the endbell timing. M two Killshots (RPM stator) which I thought were Zero timing stators when I had them at 70 degrees on the endbell, the motorlyser said the timing was ~55 degrees. Simialr results with the R1 as TORG Phase A B &C not even close. What is going on? I haven't checked to see if there is any software updates, I'm running the motorlyiser as it came. If the Motorlyser is correct, it is going to open a lot of peoples eyes.

OH BTW my BOSS 25.5 motor at 45 degrees on timing the label, read 58 degrees.

Some the few results I've seen here and elsewhere, the motorlyser is at least being consistent.

Killshot 21.5 RPM end bell timing seems to read about 15 degrees too high.

R1 stator timing is a 35 to 36 degrees instead oof the reported 30.

R1 phasing appears to be off.


Can anyone speak to the accuracy of the motorlyser timing readings (either the average or the individual sensors)?

Last edited by John Wallace2; 09-05-2014 at 07:09 PM.
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Old 09-05-2014, 08:12 PM   #23
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Got mine today and I'm beginning to have serious questions about the accuracy of the timing readings. Most of my 21.5 motors read low on the motorlyser compared to the endbell timing. M two Killshots (RPM stator) which I thought were Zero timing stators when I had them at 70 degrees on the endbell, the motorlyser said the timing was ~55 degrees. Simialr results with the R1 as TORG Phase A B &C not even close. What is going on? I haven't checked to see if there is any software updates, I'm running the motorlyiser as it came. If the Motorlyser is correct, it is going to open a lot of peoples eyes.

OH BTW my BOSS 25.5 motor at 45 degrees on timing the label, read 58 degrees.

Some the few results I've seen here and elsewhere, the motorlyser is at least being consistent.

Killshot 21.5 RPM end bell timing seems to read about 15 degrees too high.

R1 stator timing is a 35 to 36 degrees instead oof the reported 30.

R1 phasing appears to be off.

Can anyone speak to the accuracy of the motorlyser timing readings (either the average or the individual sensors)?
So far our two motolysers are seeing the same thing...

Killshots don't read a constant 15 over though, mine start out at ~-7 then later read 15 over.

There are many manufacturing differences and defects.

check out the hall sensors on this speedpassion board.



it is visually crooked compared to the board markings (this is from the one that was b0rked out of the box anyway).

I'll crack open the R1 to have a look at the sensor board later. I may have to buy some smaller solder tips and a magnifying glass soon

Next I plan on checking Reedy, Thunder power, a second SP MMM 21.5 that arrived, tekins and novaks.
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Old 09-05-2014, 08:17 PM   #24
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Got mine today and I'm beginning to have serious questions about the accuracy of the timing readings.
I'd be inclined to believe the tool if it gets the readings are consistent and repeatable.

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OH BTW my BOSS 25.5 motor at 45 degrees on timing the label, read 58 degrees.
Novak runs their motors in at true neutral (where they make the same power forward and reverse), locks down the timing, and then puts the sticker on at 30 degrees. It's the only one in my experience where you can consistently put it at 44-45 degrees and have the motor run right.

I have one 21.5 here (from another vendor not Novak, that I think has a bad sensor board) that needs an additional 20 degrees to make the same power as it's sister (I ordered two). Suffice to say, of the timing marks are machined in the end bell, it's not 100% accurate to set it at 32* and trust it's right.
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Old 09-11-2014, 04:35 AM   #25
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.

Novak runs their motors in at true neutral (where they make the same power forward and reverse), locks down the timing, and then puts the sticker on at 30 degrees. It's the only one in my experience where you can consistently put it at 44-45 degrees and have the motor run right.

.
I hear you and that is what Novak says, but both of my 25.5 motors at 45 degrees end bell timing have considerably more timing with the motorlyser. I also have a Novak 13.5 Ballistic Spec motor with the same timing label setup. Guess what? At 45 degrees end bell timing that motor only has 40 degrees on the motorlyser (always wondered why that motor didn't seem to have that much power). We have a big race here this weekend and several folks have volunteered to let me test their Novak motors on a non disclosure basis to see if my motors are anomalies. Only conditions are that the timing label must be factory installed and the motor is timed at 45 degrees on that label.

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Old 09-11-2014, 09:43 AM   #26
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I hear you and that is what Novak says, but both of my 25.5 motors at 45 degrees end bell timing have considerably more timing with the motorlyser. I also have a Novak 13.5 Ballistic Spec motor with the same timing label setup. Guess what? At 45 degrees end bell timing that motor only has 40 degrees on the motorlyser (always wondered why that motor didn't seem to have that much power). We have a big race here this weekend and several folks have volunteered to let me test their Novak motors on a non disclosure basis to see if my motors are anomalies. Only conditions are that the timing label must be factory installed and the motor is timed at 45 degrees on that label.
Did you test new motors or used? It will be interesting to see how/if this changes over time. Glad I got some tested before I used them.
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Old 09-11-2014, 10:53 AM   #27
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I think we can accept that the sticker on Novak gear is just a sticker. My novak 17.5 is a decent motor, but it's way past the sticker in timing and seems to be no worse for it. My guess is it's running at about 50-55 degrees of total timing.
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Old 09-11-2014, 11:04 AM   #28
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Did you test new motors or used? It will be interesting to see how/if this changes over time. Glad I got some tested before I used them.
All the motors so far have been used. I got a new D4 motor this morning and have the readings on it. I'll retest after this weekend after a few runs and see if there is any change after a few runs.
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Old 09-11-2014, 11:26 AM   #29
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All the motors so far have been used. I got a new D4 motor this morning and have the readings on it. I'll retest after this weekend after a few runs and see if there is any change after a few runs.
Do you know of anyone else with a motolyser? It's worth a shot to see if they both give the exact readings when used. Good thread thus far.
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Old 09-11-2014, 01:53 PM   #30
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Do you know of anyone else with a motolyser? It's worth a shot to see if they both give the exact readings when used. Good thread thus far.
No, but so far Torg and my motorlysers are giving us very similar readings on motors of the same brand. Still that is not the same as running two different motorlysers on the same motor.
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