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Old 08-28-2013, 05:01 AM   #11161
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Old 08-28-2013, 07:31 AM   #11162
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Hey guys,

I was wondering if some of you were able to provide me with some set-up sheets, or extra information for running a 4.5t motor with the HW v3.1 ESC.

I have looked at the standard mod set-up, but I havn't been able to run it yet. If you guys were able to supply some extra information and settings it would be great, so I can try all these when I run the car next.

I have driven mod before, and I'm able to handle the extra speed provided with this speed controller. My only concern is that this ESC is relatively new, and I'm still not familiar with it's settings, and what temperatures they are capable of producing..

Alot of testing will be done on the day, but a few instant references would be great.

Cheers,
Bill K
Hi Bill,

In terms of mod setup, it does tend to vary a bit with what motor you use. More than anything, that to get the right delivery. For example grunty motors (ProAmps, LRP's) need subtly different settings to say a Reedy or TP motor.

Having said that, I don't really adjust too much on mod settings... normally, once the rev range and punch settings are set, just tweak the boost and turbo levels to suit where you feel your lacking.

Starting from the beginning though, in order of things I setup..

1) FDR - for most tracks and motors, an FDR in the 8 - 7.7 range is about right. Torquey motors towards the 7.7, revvy to the 8. Normally, lower FDR also goes with less boost/turbo, and smoother delivery... although if other settings aren't working to get the speed, going lower on FDR (bigger pinion) is a good way to go.

2) Rev Range - This is the second set of settings I'll sort out. Normally, some where close to 12,000 - 29,000 is a good range to set, as this will work with the FDR above to ensure your not over timing the motor in the slow corners, and is wide enough to take most decent levels of boost timing. Shorten the range up if you think your lacking punch (although I would tweak the punch rate first, see below), and lengthen it (normally just the end rpm) for smoother delivery.

3) Punch rate - For me, this is a big adjustment, and only a few points difference can really change how a motor feels on track. The setting itself is pretty self explanitory... lower number, lower punch, smoother delivery. For grunty motors, I tend to run less than 10 (with my Pro-Amps, I run 6/8), whereas other motors between 12-15. Usually also leave a small split between first and second punch rates, mainly as the first stage will always be more traction limited (it deals with the first 50% of throttle travel). This is also one of the settings I find that has a big effect on motor temp (along with endbell timing, and turbo), so if your a bit hot, look at lowering the punch level.

4) Boost - With the above sorted, set up the boost level. Again, grunty motors don't need as much boost... example is the Pro-Amps, use at most 12 points, whereas on other motors, I've used double that and more. with the rev range and FDR, more boost will help to give more rip out of the corner. Bare in mind that if you have a lot of boost winding in whilst at full throttle, IMO, you'd be better off putting it onto the turbo setting instead.

5) Turbo - I rarely adjust the engage/disengage slopes and delay time (12 / 18 / 0.15s respectively), just the amount of turbo. More turbo = more top speed, simply put. Usually start with around 10-12, and work it in conjunction with boost and the FDR to get decent top speed.

6) Brakes - this is a real feel thing that I'm only really starting to work on, but standard brake setup is 20/20 on the brake punch, then 65 - 75% overall, and tweak it on the radio. I'll also use a fair bit (~14%) of drag brake... but that is really a personally preference thing.

Hope the above helps a bit

Ed
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Old 08-28-2013, 04:02 PM   #11163
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Originally Posted by TryHard View Post
Hi Bill,

In terms of mod setup, it does tend to vary a bit with what motor you use. More than anything, that to get the right delivery. For example grunty motors (ProAmps, LRP's) need subtly different settings to say a Reedy or TP motor.

Having said that, I don't really adjust too much on mod settings... normally, once the rev range and punch settings are set, just tweak the boost and turbo levels to suit where you feel your lacking.

Starting from the beginning though, in order of things I setup..

1) FDR - for most tracks and motors, an FDR in the 8 - 7.7 range is about right. Torquey motors towards the 7.7, revvy to the 8. Normally, lower FDR also goes with less boost/turbo, and smoother delivery... although if other settings aren't working to get the speed, going lower on FDR (bigger pinion) is a good way to go.

2) Rev Range - This is the second set of settings I'll sort out. Normally, some where close to 12,000 - 29,000 is a good range to set, as this will work with the FDR above to ensure your not over timing the motor in the slow corners, and is wide enough to take most decent levels of boost timing. Shorten the range up if you think your lacking punch (although I would tweak the punch rate first, see below), and lengthen it (normally just the end rpm) for smoother delivery.

3) Punch rate - For me, this is a big adjustment, and only a few points difference can really change how a motor feels on track. The setting itself is pretty self explanitory... lower number, lower punch, smoother delivery. For grunty motors, I tend to run less than 10 (with my Pro-Amps, I run 6/8), whereas other motors between 12-15. Usually also leave a small split between first and second punch rates, mainly as the first stage will always be more traction limited (it deals with the first 50% of throttle travel). This is also one of the settings I find that has a big effect on motor temp (along with endbell timing, and turbo), so if your a bit hot, look at lowering the punch level.

4) Boost - With the above sorted, set up the boost level. Again, grunty motors don't need as much boost... example is the Pro-Amps, use at most 12 points, whereas on other motors, I've used double that and more. with the rev range and FDR, more boost will help to give more rip out of the corner. Bare in mind that if you have a lot of boost winding in whilst at full throttle, IMO, you'd be better off putting it onto the turbo setting instead.

5) Turbo - I rarely adjust the engage/disengage slopes and delay time (12 / 18 / 0.15s respectively), just the amount of turbo. More turbo = more top speed, simply put. Usually start with around 10-12, and work it in conjunction with boost and the FDR to get decent top speed.

6) Brakes - this is a real feel thing that I'm only really starting to work on, but standard brake setup is 20/20 on the brake punch, then 65 - 75% overall, and tweak it on the radio. I'll also use a fair bit (~14%) of drag brake... but that is really a personally preference thing.

Hope the above helps a bit



Ed
Great work Ed
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Old 08-29-2013, 03:07 AM   #11164
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Originally Posted by TryHard View Post
Hi Bill,

In terms of mod setup, it does tend to vary a bit with what motor you use. More than anything, that to get the right delivery. For example grunty motors (ProAmps, LRP's) need subtly different settings to say a Reedy or TP motor.

Having said that, I don't really adjust too much on mod settings... normally, once the rev range and punch settings are set, just tweak the boost and turbo levels to suit where you feel your lacking.

Starting from the beginning though, in order of things I setup..

1) FDR - for most tracks and motors, an FDR in the 8 - 7.7 range is about right. Torquey motors towards the 7.7, revvy to the 8. Normally, lower FDR also goes with less boost/turbo, and smoother delivery... although if other settings aren't working to get the speed, going lower on FDR (bigger pinion) is a good way to go.

2) Rev Range - This is the second set of settings I'll sort out. Normally, some where close to 12,000 - 29,000 is a good range to set, as this will work with the FDR above to ensure your not over timing the motor in the slow corners, and is wide enough to take most decent levels of boost timing. Shorten the range up if you think your lacking punch (although I would tweak the punch rate first, see below), and lengthen it (normally just the end rpm) for smoother delivery.

3) Punch rate - For me, this is a big adjustment, and only a few points difference can really change how a motor feels on track. The setting itself is pretty self explanitory... lower number, lower punch, smoother delivery. For grunty motors, I tend to run less than 10 (with my Pro-Amps, I run 6/8), whereas other motors between 12-15. Usually also leave a small split between first and second punch rates, mainly as the first stage will always be more traction limited (it deals with the first 50% of throttle travel). This is also one of the settings I find that has a big effect on motor temp (along with endbell timing, and turbo), so if your a bit hot, look at lowering the punch level.

4) Boost - With the above sorted, set up the boost level. Again, grunty motors don't need as much boost... example is the Pro-Amps, use at most 12 points, whereas on other motors, I've used double that and more. with the rev range and FDR, more boost will help to give more rip out of the corner. Bare in mind that if you have a lot of boost winding in whilst at full throttle, IMO, you'd be better off putting it onto the turbo setting instead.

5) Turbo - I rarely adjust the engage/disengage slopes and delay time (12 / 18 / 0.15s respectively), just the amount of turbo. More turbo = more top speed, simply put. Usually start with around 10-12, and work it in conjunction with boost and the FDR to get decent top speed.

6) Brakes - this is a real feel thing that I'm only really starting to work on, but standard brake setup is 20/20 on the brake punch, then 65 - 75% overall, and tweak it on the radio. I'll also use a fair bit (~14%) of drag brake... but that is really a personally preference thing.

Hope the above helps a bit

Ed
I really appreciate the detailed response you have provided for me to refer to, and the depths you have gone to, explaining each setting in a clear, and understanding manor.

As for the motor I am temporarily using, it is the Nosram storm evolution 4.5t, with upgraded military spec rotor. This provides alot of both bottom and top end power with the correct FDR, but also can achieve very high temperatures if run incorrectly. This is why I am so cautious about the settings I'm going to be running, and how much boost/turbo/punch ect will be applied. Until I get my v10, this is all I have.

As for FDR, I was thinking to run an 8.1 FDR (86/21 48P) for the small technical track I run at, and apply boost and turbo to compensate for the speed down the straight, and remove some punch in the ESC to reduce the motor temperatures. From what I have been told, this could possibly result in cooler motor temperatures, which is ideal for my situation.

You spoke about rev ranges, and I remember when I was running the LRP flow works-team ESC, someone had provided me a chart which I was able to refer to, and see what the rev range would be ideal (For a 17.5 boosted setup). I was told that a shorter rev range = more stress on the motor, more torque and a more aggressive feel + higher heat, and that a longer rev range = less stress on the motor, less torque and smoother feel, cooler motor, correct? Is there a chart or something similar to go with the HW3.1, or is it entirely different as we can choose the start, and end RPM? Really not sure here.

I also find that I am aggressive on the trigger when I run both stock, and mod vehicles, which works at both an advantage, and disadvantage when it comes to motor temperatures, and how well I drive on the track. I have gone for a higher gear ratio, so electronic punch can be reduced as much as possible. I will be starting at a punch rate of 5-8, first and second stage after reading the information you have provided, and I can later play with this at the track. The nosram is a torquey motor, so I shouldn't have an issue with bottom end power.

As for boost and turbo, I'm thinking 5 boost points, and 10 turbo? I know this all depends on the motor, timing, track, FDR, ect. But I do think this is a quick advancing point which the motor should be able to handle and produce a decent outcome. I will be frequently temping the motor (every 4 laps), so I can then graph the temperature increase/decrease with different settings after playing with the standard modified setup.

As for brakes, I feel that the HW provides much smoother, yet stronger brakes than I have ever driven with before. After switching from the LRP to the HW3.1, I was braking too early and hitting the apex's with the stock car. So I might decrease the brakes, and maybe turn drag brake down to 5-10%. Brakes are a huge importance in my driving style, and without them being spot on in conjunction with this, it can be terribly hard to drive in the mid-field.

My current radio (Futaba 3PK) has recently been playing up with glitch issues causing brake/throttle delays, and random turning from time to time, thus why I have been forced to re-use my dx3s, which limits me to settings I'm used to relying on Until I can find a fix for this, alot of experimenting will need to be done in terms of throttle/brake response..

I'm really glad you provided me with the information you did, as I would've gone out too hot and hard without it in regards to punch, boost and turbo settings. Once I get the chance to run, and experiment with these settings I'll let everyone know how they went, and what problems I may be experiencing.

Cheers.
Bill K
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Old 08-29-2013, 01:09 PM   #11165
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Bill K.... I send you a message
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Old 08-30-2013, 12:31 AM   #11166
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Bill K.... I send you a message
Sure, send one over when you have the time.
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Old 08-30-2013, 03:15 AM   #11167
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Got a race coming up where we can use a Tamiya 12t sensorless motor, planning to use this motor with the HW Xerun 60A V2.1.

Yesterday I have installed the older MOD non boosted firmware where I can change the AMTS timing which will work with the sensorless motor if I'm correct.

My question is if I can use the newer STOCK firmware and if the BOOST function will work with the sensorless motor? Is the AMTS timing the same as BOOST as there is no AMTS timing setting in the STOCK firmware?

Thanks,

Robbert
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Old 08-30-2013, 05:57 AM   #11168
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Got a race coming up where we can use a Tamiya 12t sensorless motor, planning to use this motor with the HW Xerun 60A V2.1.

Yesterday I have installed the older MOD non boosted firmware where I can change the AMTS timing which will work with the sensorless motor if I'm correct.

My question is if I can use the newer STOCK firmware and if the BOOST function will work with the sensorless motor? Is the AMTS timing the same as BOOST as there is no AMTS timing setting in the STOCK firmware?

Thanks,

Robbert

I thought u needed sensor to use any timing in the esc

The boost/turbo timing doesn't work without a sensor cable

Amts timing is static timing were as boost and turbo timing is progressive
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Old 08-31-2013, 12:49 AM   #11169
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seems something wrong with the site now.

http://www.hobbywing.com/product_show.asp?id=276

cant download the latest HW firmware for my Xerun120A V2.0.

any link where I can get it?

sent you an email Angelo.

thank you and more power.

rgds,
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Old 08-31-2013, 12:50 AM   #11170
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Damn.... that was fast.. I just sent angelo an email then posted here then after I check my email I got a reply with the file needed.... now that's what you call customer service.... good thing still a loyal Hobbywing FAN!!!!

thanks again team...
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Old 08-31-2013, 12:51 AM   #11171
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seems something wrong with the site now.

http://www.hobbywing.com/product_show.asp?id=276

cant download the latest HW firmware for my Xerun120A V2.0.

any link where I can get it?

sent you an email Angelo.

thank you and more power.

rgds,
Software sent to your email
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Old 08-31-2013, 12:55 AM   #11172
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Software sent to your email
Thank you Angelo. got it... do you guys ever sleep... hahaha

more power....
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Old 08-31-2013, 12:59 AM   #11173
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Thank you Angelo. got it... do you guys ever sleep... hahaha

more power....
Not really haha.Our tech support and customer service is what keeps us ar the top of our industry.But what keeps us in business is our loyal customers like you.
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Old 08-31-2013, 01:01 AM   #11174
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Not really haha.Our tech support and customer service is what keeps us ar the top of our industry.But what keeps us in business is our loyal customers like you.
nice to have you guys behind us.... btw, what would be the best firmware for xerun 2.0 , basically will just use it for my son drift car.

no boost and timing needed right...

thanks,
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Old 08-31-2013, 02:47 AM   #11175
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Originally Posted by tcboy1983 View Post
I thought u needed sensor to use any timing in the esc

The boost/turbo timing doesn't work without a sensor cable

Amts timing is static timing were as boost and turbo timing is progressive

Cobra can you confirm this? Manuel of the esc states that 'timing' can be used with both sensored and sensorless motors.

Thanks,

Robbert
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