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Old 07-04-2011, 03:11 AM   #5491
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Originally Posted by COBRARACING View Post
211 is the latest for stock and 119 for Mod .the latest versions and have more timing and more features like the turbo slope ,boost acc etc .The others are older and are limited to features thats all .
thanks cobraracing much appreciated
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Old 07-04-2011, 03:32 AM   #5492
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Default motor limit for offroad 2s

why is the xtreme stock rated to motors 11.5 and over, whereas the 60amp version is rated to 8.5 onwards when both controllers are 60amp units?
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Old 07-04-2011, 03:54 AM   #5493
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Default HW 120A V2.1 & HW 13.5T motor settings

Hi Guys, i have just purchased a HW motor to go with my HW ESC and was wandering what settings to use as my car is lacking top end speed at my local track. it has a 70m straight. I was running a novak ballistic until it cooked ( 2 runs @ 70'c, then 3rd came off at 110'C ) and it was lacking in brakes too :-(

these were my settings:-

7.4 FDR

1. Running Mode -For/Brake
2. Drag Brake -0%
3. Volt Prot -3.0v/cell
4. DRRS Punch Level -9
5. Brake Force -100%
6. Reverse Force -100%
7. Initial Brake -40%
8. Neutral Range -6%
9. Boost Timing -40
10. Turbo Slope -fastest
11. Overheat -Enable
12. Turbo Timing -24
13. Start RPM -8000
14. Turbo Delay - none
15. Timing ACC -250
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Old 07-04-2011, 04:16 AM   #5494
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hacker View Post
why is the xtreme stock rated to motors 11.5 and over, whereas the 60amp version is rated to 8.5 onwards when both controllers are 60amp units?
The xtreme stock is rated at 8.5T with turbo settings and 5.5T with no turbo at all and i mean at all .

I would recommened to be safe with turbo settings run at atleast 10.5T and above and without turbo 6.5T just to be on the safe side .
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Old 07-04-2011, 04:23 AM   #5495
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcdoogle View Post
Hi Guys, i have just purchased a HW motor to go with my HW ESC and was wandering what settings to use as my car is lacking top end speed at my local track. it has a 70m straight. I was running a novak ballistic until it cooked ( 2 runs @ 70'c, then 3rd came off at 110'C ) and it was lacking in brakes too :-(

these were my settings:-

7.4 FDR

1. Running Mode -For/Brake
2. Drag Brake -0%
3. Volt Prot -3.0v/cell
4. DRRS Punch Level -9
5. Brake Force -100%
6. Reverse Force -100%
7. Initial Brake -40%
8. Neutral Range -6%
9. Boost Timing -40
10. Turbo Slope -fastest
11. Overheat -Enable
12. Turbo Timing -24
13. Start RPM -8000
14. Turbo Delay - none
15. Timing ACC -250
I would run a delay especially with a 70 meter straight turbo is on instantly from start to finish of the straight and that would make the motor very hot as its at its end of the gearing top end .

drop the punch level to 8

boost timing to 28-32

turbo timing is ok maybe 22-24

start rpm 4000

turbo slope say 18 as your ramping up the turbo to quick .\\

try that and let us know .
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Old 07-04-2011, 04:26 AM   #5496
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Quote:
Originally Posted by COBRARACING View Post
The xtreme stock is rated at 8.5T with turbo settings and 5.5T with no turbo at all and i mean at all .

I would recommened to be safe with turbo settings run at atleast 10.5T and above and without turbo 6.5T just to be on the safe side .
thanks angelo
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Old 07-04-2011, 06:46 AM   #5497
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hacker View Post
thanks angelo
your welcome and thank you for supporting hobbywing and its products

regards Angelo
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Old 07-04-2011, 06:55 AM   #5498
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I used the 211 Stock version on last Sunday. (v2.1 120A / 13.5T) Just wow, loads of torque at low end, blazing speed on straight. I love the ESC but motor bearings seems not last very long. I think to change these to ceramic ball bearings.

Thanks Hobbywing for that quality product and Cobra for your support.
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Old 07-04-2011, 08:27 AM   #5499
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Quote:
Originally Posted by COBRARACING View Post
I would run a delay especially with a 70 meter straight turbo is on instantly from start to finish of the straight and that would make the motor very hot as its at its end of the gearing top end .

drop the punch level to 8

boost timing to 28-32

turbo timing is ok maybe 22-24

start rpm 4000

turbo slope say 18 as your ramping up the turbo to quick .\\

try that and let us know .
Thanks for your quick reply, i will test it at the weekend. I race indoors as well and that has a 30m straight, the rest is fairly tight and technical but still flowing, would you change any settings for this ?
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Old 07-04-2011, 09:17 AM   #5500
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Default hw 17,5 sensored

hello guys
I'm trying to hit a motor hw, and I'm having problems, our track is + - 270 meters and the main straight is 40 meters, and the engine with about 3 minutes reaches 92.7 ░ C, would you have idea what's going on?
I tried to talk about the relations q, along with various settings xtreme stock esc
I began with, 8.0, 7.93, 7.34, 6.89, 6, 69, to reach 5.25, the FDR And no, heated up with all these
now esc
I'm with the 518 because the 211 even more heated, this was the best I could leave but decided not too
DRRs 7
brake force 50
boost timing 8
turbo level 7
start 6000 rpm
delay 0.4
timing punch -3

with the 211 I was just
6 DDRs
brake force 50
boost timing 40
18 turbo slope
24 turbo timing
start 4000 rpm
delay 0.3
350 acc

relations with all this and has not worked after 6 minutes is the 136c ░
I tried with the 211 timing from 34 to 45
fastest turbo slope up from 24
I've been timing with 45 non turbo boost then he walked next to 90c ░ but not rode anything was final, even with the 6.6 FDR
I tried to start from 3000 until 9000, but to no avail he was powerless, and so had he entered the turbo, i put 150 acc, but improved heated back up
on the bench he consumes 3.67 ah, testaei that too, to see if there was engine trouble, but 4 engines tested, because I bought 5 of them, and all give the same problem, so it's not supposed to be the engine, and tested 2 xtreme stock, q I q same thing, but do not know how to solve it, or if this engine goes hot even
I wish someone would help me with this engine, because I have work to hit, and also tested a novak, and I did not have any problem, he's cold about 78C ░ in the final eight minutes and walk strong, but how we define hw as a mark of our league, we already have drivers for all motor

Thank you and look forward to some help from you
Excuse my English, I do not speak well, then turned to google translator, q hopefully understand what I mean !!!!!!!!!!
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Old 07-04-2011, 09:49 AM   #5501
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I heard HW is coming out a new esc, anybody has any information? If yes, I will wait for a new one.
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Old 07-04-2011, 11:16 AM   #5502
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Originally Posted by Benzaah View Post
When are people going to stop dreaming about this Friggin Data Logger. They will never make it fit into a small enough package for us to be happy with. There is hardly any room in a modern car as it is.


And I wish they would actually tell us what each step of the boost and turbo was in degree's so we could figure out our end Rpm... Back in the good old 518 days it was much easier IMO as setting 7 was 18 degrees and if I had 6 turbo and timing acc 350 with a 6000 start my end rpm was going to be 14400. The current set up guide for 211 is not exactly clear on this issue.

Bank on approx 1/2 (old degree) per point on the ESC and you will not be far out. One thing that is pointless is this fascination with end RPM, unless you are using a Data logger it is no use in the real world, as an example with my Logger and very low gearing I have hit what I believe to be the absolute limit of RPM on the HW 13.5 at 54,000RPM ON THE TRACK. We know this as it held that figure for 6/10th of a second during a speed run. This obsession with End RPM actually means nothing because it is the point at which the ESC ceases to add any more timing, this does not mean that the motor miraculously tops out but that it will carry on accelerating up to its design limitations or Detonation !

Has anyone done much testing with settings above 64 points IE boost 50 turbo 30? I have one club meet for the season left and after the last race I plan on seeing if I can blow up my seasons motor with max settings(just for fun) Technically the 211 manual says the speedy won’t add more than 64 points.
The ESC will only add a total of 64 points of timing.

Doing the destruction run may well detonate your ESC too and with the fact you posted your intentions here I doubt any of the distributors would be willing to honour the repair FoC


Quote:
Originally Posted by ozzy-crawl View Post
how could Hobbywing give a end rpm, they would have to calculate every variable, which would be every motor that could be used with the esc
with every different gearing possibility and with every different boost/turbo combo. because changing anyone of these would change the end rpm.
the chart would be more confusing than the esc itself would it not
Hmm as you say we need a data logger hehe
Well I refer you to the passage above, but the make of motor is unimportant as the ESC reads RPM and RPM is RPM whoever makes the motor (Physics)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jay m View Post
anyone tried the HW Xerun motors and how they compare
I have had the misfortune to be the victim of a moron at the track who was the first person I have heard of killing an XERUN Motor on an extreme stock ESC, he turned off the Thermal protection and wondered why it melted. When I went into his settings on 211 and geared in the 4's on a 21.5 on a medium size UK track ,he was on 53 Boost and 31 Turbo with a slope of 24/0.1 !

The XERUN motors, as I keep on telling people are not at all torquey like the GM's et al they like to be revved at Eastbourne on Sunday my car was so bloody quick (but alas it still fears corners / under skilled driver) whereas the consensus was 6.5:1 FDR I run mine at 7.75:1 has better brakes, much better acceleration (DDRS 1 !) and fairly screams down the straight. This is not from Guesswork but I spent two entire weeks (every Day) at Brooklands track testing so many settings and gearings with the Data Logger (Which we sell BTW) to gain this information. HW motors NEED to be geared about 15 to 20% Higher than other brands to get the best from them.

Motors are bloody awesome mine has now done about a year of being Totally abused and is still as strong as the day I took it out of the packet, great for racers (not so great for us sellers loll come on guys kill some motors :sneaky
:

Quote:
Originally Posted by M7H View Post
according to your theory, if you put boost to 0 degree, your car would not run?

On 0 degrees of timing, the motors KV rating come into account, this is the RPM it can reach without any boost timing added.
Actually, the KV ratings are the number you could look at, to give you an idea about the motors end RPM, under load. Boost timing doesn't affect that end RPM much... (Maybe +20%)


On this comment please ignore the KV rating on motors as this is the amount of RPM out of the box the motors will do per VOLT from the cells e.g. HW 13.5 2500kv equates to an unboosted 8.4x2500 = 21000 RPM Max. This was a very important piece of information back when we were running GTB's et al with no electronic boost profiles as it mainly equates to the amount of internal timing that has been added to the motor in question, with Boosted profiles this figure is now a pointless rather naughty, bit of marketing hype (C Ratings anyone?? )
You say Boost Timing doesn't affect the top end by much more than 20%, I refer you back to our results the 13.5 with a kV of 2500 has a non boosted RPM max of 21000 RPM, yet with Boost we are achieving 54000 RPM, Hobbywing have destruction tested 11.5's at over 100,000 RPM !!! So, on that point buddy you are barking up the wrong tree.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig W View Post
Hi guys

Don’t know if I put this in right part of forum but I was wondering if you could help looking for setting for Xtreme stock with x12 13.5t running on tight 20x30mtr carpet track and FDR ply
Hobbywing ESC Settings ONLY

Quote:
Originally Posted by ozzy-crawl View Post
going to get jumped on as usual but here goes
worse thing to do is constantly balance charge lipo`s every time
I used to balance charge every time years ago, but was told by a guy in the battery industry the worst thing to do is balance them too much.
since then I only balance charge if the cells are more than .03 of a volt out
which is very very rare, I have had a couple packs for 3-4 years still going strong that have never been balanced.
mind you I check voltage every charge and very rarely run till low voltage kicks in and I take care of by packs.
lipo quality has come a long way in the last 4-5 years and are not as temperamental or fragile as they once were.
Am with you here mate I balance mine every 25 or so charges and they are rarely out of balance, but they feel soft when they have been balanced whereas the Batts feel punchier as they have a number of abusive runs on them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jay m View Post
can some1 explain the difference between 119 mod, 528mod, and 205mod and which is the latest one. also with stock 323a to 211stock cheers
Will try....

518 excellent software, for those who are new to Hobbywing, easy to setup, no complications and idiot proof. Has fixed timing bands 1 to 9 and 1-8 Turbo settings.
ESC starts adding boost from start point, if you hit full throttle and the delay has been met then it will add turbo, if you haven’t hit full boost after turbo it will continue to add in timing until it is all spent. (Heavy finger = hot motor)
Good start point for 13.5/10.5 (HW Motor) is as follows:-

Boost Max
Turbo Max
Delay 0.4
Start RPM 3000
Supercharger Punch (15) at -5 or -6

Simples !!

119 is a progression from 518 but replaces fixed timing with steps of timing in much smaller increments with a maximum figure of 64 points, this is now spread between Boost Timing and Turbo timing e.g. 40 Boost 24 Turbo. We have 1 to 64 on boost and 1 to 40 on Turbo (our testing suggests that Boost is about 0.4 degrees per point and turbo is 0.2 degrees). The rate at which the boost comes in is adjustable once more from setting 15 but is now in 50RPM increments. The rate at which Turbo comes in is set by the Turbo Slope (e.g. 18/0.1). Early adopters of the 119 firmware expressed concern when converting settings over from 518 that the cars were too slow, you have to remember that with setting 15 we now have twice the number of steps so if you were using -6 (1000 RPM / Degree) you now need to be looking at 500 and so on.

Once more the same parameters have to be met for Turbo to engage(i.e. Full Throttle for prescribed delay time) and again if the total boost has not been added it will add it in on top of the Turbo once that had expired, so once more heavy fingers = Hot motors.

This is a much more adjustable firmware and it is difficult to translate one person’s settings to another person as the cars handle power differently, and we all have unique driving styles.

211/213 Latest and probably the best firmware’s (if used correctly) they are a progression from 119 and feature the exact same parameters as 119. With a HUGE Difference.......... the Timing is now split into 2 distinct 'Phases' Boost and Turbo, gone are the requirements for Full Throttle and delay, the ESC will add all the timing from the Boost phase BEFORE adding the Turbo Phase, so you can safely mash the throttle at the beginning of the straight and just let the ESC do the work, we have experimented with delay but it is pointless as the Boost phase must be complete before the Turbo will engage.

Excellent settings for EASTBOURNE / MARITIME (on 13.5T HW) are FDR around 7.1 to 7.5, Boost 40, Turbo 24, Slope 24, Delay 0.0, boost Acc (15) at 400 to 500. Just mash the throttle and GRIN !!

On these firmware’s Heavy fingered drivers among us can run with the certain knowledge that the ESC is doing all the complicated work.


Quote:
Originally Posted by 2wdrive View Post
yesterday my front bearing of my Xerun 10.5t motor gave way during the first final . So I only could limp a few rounds after which I had to pull it from the track. Thank god I had a new 10.5t motor in my bag so only had to unplug the motor and switch it out. Man I love those motor wire plugs!

Can I buy a replacement bearing direct from Hobbywing or does a store carry them? I looked around briefly but could not find them.
Give me a call on 01708 500 700 and I can sort you out with one or two as I have a brand new 2 run 21.5T which a Muppet blew up Sunday can pull the bearings from that if you like, Royal Oil is the best thing for Bearing lube, do not put 3 in 1 or other light general purpose oils in them, give them a blow over with airline and re lube them after every meeting and the bearings will last forever (refer to my abused motor above)

Quote:
Originally Posted by xraydad View Post
I agree they are a cool idea, can you get spare male connectors to fit onto spare motors at all?. If so, is there a part number I could have to order from Racers in exile, our importer?
Many thanks

Will make some enquiries, by the way we have replacement Fans, Caps, switched, Wires, Heat sinks and plastic cases for all the ESC's !!


Quote:
Originally Posted by hacker View Post
why is the Xtreme stock rated to motors 11.5 and over, whereas the 60amp version is rated to 8.5 onwards when both controllers are 60amp units?
We advise users with the latest Boosting packages to stay 10.5T and above as in most countries the Stock classes end at 10.5T, the ESC will run a 5.5T on Non Boosted original software but it isn't what they were designed for, for that get an XERUN 120A SD V2.1


Sorry I have been absent for a while, Hobbywing and Eagle Racing commitments as well as real life are taking up all my time, am still around to answer questions give me a ring or an email.

Tel: 01708 500 700
email: sales@racersinexile.co.uk
web: www.racersinexile.org.uk

Hope it all helps !

Cherry
xx
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www.racersinexile.org.uk | 'Official Certified' UK/Euro Importer for the Hobbywing XERUN Series Equipment We ship the world !!!| Quote code 'cherry' for 10% discount on our Web Store.

Last edited by cherry2blost; 07-04-2011 at 03:14 PM.
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Old 07-04-2011, 11:17 AM   #5503
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Originally Posted by ioxqq View Post
I heard HW is coming out a new esc, anybody has any information? If yes, I will wait for a new one.
About a year or so, we are told by Hobbywing / Angelo.
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Old 07-04-2011, 03:02 PM   #5504
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Originally Posted by cherry2blost View Post
Hobbywing have destruction tested 11.5's at over 100,000 RPM !!! So, on that point buddy you are barking up the wrong tree.
I know Stuart, I was trying to make a point.
But I was talking about the rpm under load Which will never reach does figures!....

p.s. exploded view pictures of my ESC are on there way.
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Old 07-04-2011, 03:07 PM   #5505
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M7H View Post
I know Stuart, I was trying to make a point.
But I was talking about the rpm under load Which will never reach does figures!....

p.s. exploded view pictures of my ESC are on there way.
However our own testing of the 13.5's has been under load at 54,000 RPM, was just stating that the theoretical limit is even higher (off load)
Our testing is with Data Loggers and actual race conditions
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