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Old 12-12-2010, 06:49 AM   #1906
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zamrioo2 View Post
dear Irgo... as HW give 'end of RPM' formula...

but if your SCTP theory is true... how u calculate the End RPM...?
you can`t calculate end rpm under-load , by sctp,
that's why it will need the esc rpm log firmware.
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Old 12-12-2010, 07:05 AM   #1907
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Originally Posted by zamrioo2 View Post
the formula tells that there is no additional timing (SCTP) as u mention
your idea which DMTS is applied before Boost Start RPM seem intresting and relevant... if the calculation of timing is what like they said... i need to know what timing is applied before Boost Start RPM...? refer to the END RPM formula, only Physical Timing is applied before Boost Start RPM, if that so i can say HW esc torque infield is so weak... eventhough we could counter the less torque with SCTP (at before Boost Start RPM), but it will effect for the top end power which is unconrtrollable heat will produce... get what i mean...? more torque will result less top speed... less torque will result more top speed...

hope someone can clarify... thanc for reply...
evenly the start rpm is program set when detected by esc sensored.
on supercharged hw and sp, both will result, higher torque and higher top speed,
as you see on sctp the esc will reach it's maximum timing depend on, how fast your motor is,during load. those will result stronger torque and cooler temps.

if your motor is unable to reach certain rpm, increasing timing is useless,
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Old 12-12-2010, 09:38 AM   #1908
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hi all i've just purchased a hobbywing xtreme for my tc and was planning on running it with an LRP x12 13.5 motor, can anyone see any problems with doing this ??? will be running on a tight indoor carpet track so would relly like some help with FDR's if possible

thanx Morgy
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Old 12-12-2010, 09:56 AM   #1909
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Quote:
Originally Posted by morgy View Post
hi all i've just purchased a hobbywing xtreme for my tc and was planning on running it with an LRP x12 13.5 motor, can anyone see any problems with doing this ??? will be running on a tight indoor carpet track so would relly like some help with FDR's if possible

thanx Morgy
This motor has a lot of timing built in so I'd recommend you run it with the minimum timing insert (4 dot).

Apart from that, Hobbywing have a very informative .pdf file on their site explaining the ESC settings. I would start with those suggestions and tune to suit.
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Old 12-12-2010, 12:34 PM   #1910
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Default CORALLY RED OR LRP VECTOR

I pondering on whether to get the NOSRAM/LRP 13.5 or CORALLY RED.

I have 518 software, and the life of my v1 Speed passion is coming to an end.

If I get either motor, has anyone any advice on program settings and gear ratio please

thanks
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Old 12-12-2010, 03:47 PM   #1911
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well i have both for 13.5 and the corally is MUCH faster and durable. go corally red...
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Old 12-12-2010, 03:58 PM   #1912
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With the stock firmware, there is no option for # of lipo cells. Am I right to assume it is permanently set for 2 cells?
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Old 12-12-2010, 11:08 PM   #1913
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irgo View Post
evenly the start rpm is program set when detected by esc sensored.
on supercharged hw and sp, both will result, higher torque and higher top speed,
as you see on sctp the esc will reach it's maximum timing depend on, how fast your motor is,during load. those will result stronger torque and cooler temps.

if your motor is unable to reach certain rpm, increasing timing is useless,
if HW concern about timing... why they give the 'END RPM' formula instead of timing...? i still didnt get how u get those SCTP as additional timing after SCT... any result or datalog...?

how u define the SCTP...? as i understand, ur understanding is conjunction with HW... as per manual like this, SCTP is refer to the RPM increment that triggers the ESC timing increase of 1 degree...
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Old 12-13-2010, 07:26 AM   #1914
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stregone View Post
With the stock firmware, there is no option for # of lipo cells. Am I right to assume it is permanently set for 2 cells?
hei bro,
i have asked a similar question and this is what COBRA answer,

"No less that 10.5T and you fine for a 3 cell

remember this anything lower than a 10.5t only 2 cell recommended

above a 10.5t like 13.5 etc 3 cell can be used"

page 111, post 1656
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Old 12-13-2010, 07:30 AM   #1915
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stregone View Post
With the stock firmware, there is no option for # of lipo cells. Am I right to assume it is permanently set for 2 cells?
The only reason other ESCs would ask for the number of cells is to calculate the LiPo cutoff voltage.

I think the Hobbywing automatically figures out the number of cells from the input voltage, so the parameter is not necessary.
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Old 12-13-2010, 07:32 AM   #1916
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could someone explain or direct me to any link explaining in detail about boost,turbo,timing....

im kinda in a mist with those things and also the affect of increasing or decreasing the timing...

thank you
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Old 12-13-2010, 07:51 AM   #1917
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heqal View Post
could someone explain or direct me to any link explaining in detail about boost,turbo,timing....

im kinda in a mist with those things and also the affect of increasing or decreasing the timing...

thank you
Best reading there is - http://www.hobbywing.com/upload/manu...-Hobbywing.pdf
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Old 12-13-2010, 10:03 AM   #1918
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heqal View Post
could someone explain or direct me to any link explaining in detail about boost,turbo,timing....

im kinda in a mist with those things and also the affect of increasing or decreasing the timing...

hopefully this setup guide will help ...


Quote:
Originally Posted by razzor View Post
Basic Starting Setups for Supercharger Software

These are all just starting points for you to further adjust and refine for each car, driving
style and track. These were developed by our team drivers around the world as a set of
basic ESC settings. The different actions the ESC can deliver require you to further tune
to your own tastes with the ultimate goal being lowest lap times. We recommend starting
with these settings, and adjusting after 10 timed laps, and judge by the lap times if you
need to go further in that direction, or the other way. No “extra timing” software is fully
automatic for every situation, so experiment with all the options while looking at lap
times to find what works best for you.

Starting from scratch:
1) Start with one of the slower FDR’s for your track size and motor wind.
2) Start with #14 off and #15 at value 9
3) For the first few runs:
A) The first thing to set is the RPM delay/gearing for the straight. Run the car and
adjust #13 to where the boost is kicking in where you want it, and you want to
gear it to make sure the car is still digging (accelerating) a the end of the straight.
You want it to where it just barely doesn’t top out.
B) #14 works together with #13. Adjust it up from zero one value at a time until it’s
making the Supercharger engage later than it was before – then back it down one
value.
C) Start making 10 lap runs and watch lap times. Adjust AMTS and DRRS to the
levels that gives best lap times
D) Now you can tune the punch (#15) for the infield. Leave it alone if you’ve got
enough rip already, or try the car one value at a time. This setting has a huge
influence on overall motor heat, so monitor temps constantly when going from
higher to lower values.
E) At this point, you should be set to go, or fine tune:
Fine tuning tips:
1) Different winds of motors are going to have different tolerance levels for overall
boost and punch. It’s easy to overboost a 13.5 at the max setting. Too much
advance will make the motor slower on the straight and have less torque just like
over gearing will. It will also dramatically increase motor heat just like over
gearing. Once you’ve completed the above, you can experiment with more overall
boost. You will most likely find a boost level that does NOT make for faster lap
times than the next one lower. That’s the motor’s breaking point for that
gear/boost/AMTS level. Back down the boost or the AMTSS to the next lower
setting.
2) Same process for punch – too much, and the motor will turn into a dog in the
infield – back the punch down to a higher setting, or decrease AMTS.
3) For large sweeping tracks where you can actually use a little boost in the infield,
experiment with #13 and 14 to find the right values to give you a little kick where
you want it, but NOT where you don’t want it.

WARNING:
Speed Passion Supercharger software is designed for most brands of stock motors which
have low natural timing advance on the motor itself, or allow the user to select a motor
advance level less than 10deg. The software works best when the ESC software alone
provides all or most of the timing advance for normal running, and extra advance at
higher RPMs to increase motor Kv and top speed.
Stock motors with very high natural advance levels (LRP X series, Ballistic, and possibly
others) may easily be "over advanced" to an extreme degree, show low speed and
power, and be damaged quickly when run with Supercharger software. Check with your
motor manufacturer for it's natural advance levels and extra advance suitability before
using with Supercharger ESC software.

Basic starting settings for 17.5 motor:
FDR: 6.0-6.5 Md/large tracks. 5.75-6.25 Very large tracks.
(raise FDR further for very high traction carpet, or very tight technical tracks)
1) 1
2) Personal preference
3) Personal preference
4) 8
DRRS works along with the Supercharger boost level setting. Higher DRRS (more
punch) is traded for reduced top speed. The bigger and more open your track, the less
DRRS you’ll want in order to get max top speed on the straight. The shorter and
tighter the track, you’ll want more DRRS to keep the punch up, but at the expense of
top end on the straight.
5) Personal Preference
6) Personal Preference
7) Personal preference – most use 1
8) Personal preference – most use 1
9) 7
Timing advance is a very critical setting that affects all parameters of performance. If
a motor is given “too much” advance, it will have poor punch, poor speed, and
overheat quickly. When it is given “just right” advance, it will have best top speed,
best punch, and will run cool. When it is given “lower than optimal” advance, it will
lack punch and top speed, and run cool. The higher the turn of motor, the higher the
“just right” advance is. 17.5t in most cases “likes” high advance, while mod motors
8.5t and lower will tolerate decreasingly lower advance levels the lower the turns of
motor. The load state of the motor also effects how much advance it “likes”. Under
heavy load (accelerating hard out of a slow corner) it “likes” lower advance. Running
under low load (high RPM down the straight) it “likes” higher advance. This is the
basic model for “extra advance” ESCs – allowing higher advance to be shown to the
motor during low load and high rpm states.
The AMTS setting is linked to the Supercharger setting in that a “total advance” is
shown to the motor when the Supercharger is engaged. That total advance is the sum
of the AMTS setting, the physical advance on the motor, and the Supercharger level
setting. Again, even though the motor is in the low load and high rpm state where it
“likes” high advance, the cumulative total of these three advance settings may be high
enough that the top speed is not optimal, and the motor is overheated.
Given the above, if you are not seeing the expected top speed performance, even
though it seems like the wrong way, the first thing to do is lower the physical motor
advance, or the AMTS setting so that the “just right” overall advance setting will
yield top speed.
AMTS is also in effect (combined with physical motor advance) when the
Supercharger is not active (low rpm/high load). Generally 17.5 “likes” a total of about
20deg in this state (depending on track surface grip and how tight the track is). But
please see the #15 setting for yet another timing advance linked option in the overall
chain of maximizing performance for the best understanding.
10) Personal preference
11) Place for future options – this setting does nothing right now.
12) 7
This is the overall Supercharger boost level. As above in the AMTS section, this is a
combination of motor, AMTS, and Supercharger settings, so set them as a team for
the desired top speed operation, and use #15 along with them to optimize punch.
13) Personal preference/gearing dependent. Most team testers have settled on setting
1, but use the setup procedures guide above to find the best setting for your track
size and driving style.
14) Again, personal preference/gearing dependent. Use the setup procedures to find
the best setting for your track. Most of the team drivers fall between setting 2 and
4 so far
15) 3
This is the final setting controlling advance before the Supercharger engages. As
we’ve seen above, high AMTS settings may be useful to maximize top speed, but
most testers have found a lack of punch when top speed settings are optimized. This
setting artificially retards the AMTS setting at high load/low RPM states to help the
motor stay cool, and gain back punch from being “over advanced”. The higher the
setting #, the less advance is being shown to the motor before the Supercharger
engages, and therefore the cooler the motor will run, and likely to have more punch as
well.

Basic starting settings for 13.5 motor:
FDR: 6.75-7.5 Md/large tracks. 6.25-7.0 Very large tracks.
(raise FDR further for very high traction carpet, or very tight technical tracks)
1) 1
2) Personal preference
3) Personal preference
4) 7
DRRS works along with the Supercharger boost level setting. Higher DRRS (more
punch) is traded for reduced top speed. The bigger and more open your track, the less
DRRS you’ll want in order to get max top speed on the straight. The shorter and
tighter the track, you’ll want more DRRS to keep the punch up, but at the expense of
top end on the straight.
5) Personal Preference
6) Personal Preference
7) Personal preference – most use 1
8) Personal preference – most use 1
9) 6
Timing advance is a very critical setting that affects all parameters of performance. If
a motor is given “too much” advance, it will have poor punch, poor speed, and
overheat quickly. When it is given “just right” advance, it will have best top speed,
best punch, and will run cool. When it is given “lower than optimal” advance, it will
lack punch and top speed, and run cool. The higher the turn of motor, the higher the
“just right” advance is. 13.5t in most cases “likes” medium/high advance, while mod
motors 8.5t and lower will tolerate decreasingly lower advance levels the lower the
turns of motor. The load state of the motor also effects how much advance it “likes”.
Under heavy load (accelerating hard out of a slow corner) it “likes” lower advance.
Running under low load (high RPM down the straight) it “likes” higher advance. This
is the basic model for “extra advance” ESCs – allowing higher advance to be shown
to the motor during low load and high rpm states.
The AMTS setting is linked to the Supercharger setting in that a “total advance” is
shown to the motor when the Supercharger is engaged. That total advance is the sum
of the AMTS setting, the physical advance on the motor, and the Supercharger level
setting. Again, even though the motor is in the low load and high rpm state where it
“likes” high advance, the cumulative total of these three advance settings may be high
enough that the top speed is not optimal, and the motor is overheated.
Given the above, if you are not seeing the expected top speed performance, even
though it seems like the wrong way, the first thing to do is lower the physical motor
advance, or the AMTS setting so that the “just right” overall advance setting will
yield top speed.
AMTS is also in effect (combined with physical motor advance) when the
Supercharger is not active (low rpm/high load). Generally 13.5 “likes” a total of about
15deg in this state (depending on track surface grip and how tight the track is). But
please see the #15 setting for yet another timing advance linked option in the overall
chain of maximizing performance for the best understanding.
10) Personal preference
11) Place for future options – this setting does nothing right now.
12) 7
This is the overall Supercharger boost level. As above in the AMTS section, this is a
combination of motor, AMTS, and Supercharger settings, so set them as a team for
the desired top speed operation, and use #15 along with them to optimize punch.
13) Personal preference/gearing dependent. Most team testers have settled on setting
1, but use the setup procedures guide above to find the best setting for your track
size and driving style.
14) Again, personal preference/gearing dependent. Use the setup procedures to find
the best setting for your track. Most of the team drivers fall between setting 2 and
4 so far
15) 4
This is the final setting controlling advance before the Supercharger engages. As we’ve
seen above, high AMTS settings may be useful to maximize top speed, but most testers
have found a lack of punch when top speed settings are optimized. This setting artificially
retards the AMTS setting at high load/low RPM states to help the motor stay cool, and
gain back punch from being “over advanced”. The higher the setting #, the less advance
is being shown to the motor before the Supercharger engages, and therefore the cooler the
motor will run, and likely to have more punch as well.

Basic starting settings for 10.5 motor:
FDR: 7.75-8.75 Md/large tracks. 7.0-8.0 Very large tracks.
(raise FDR further for very high traction carpet, or very tight technical tracks)
1) 1
2) Personal preference
3) Personal preference
4) 7
DRRS works along with the Supercharger boost level setting. Higher DRRS (more
punch) is traded for reduced top speed. The bigger and more open your track, the less
DRRS you’ll want in order to get max top speed on the straight. The shorter and
tighter the track, you’ll want more DRRS to keep the punch up, but at the expense of
top end on the straight.
5) Personal Preference
6) Personal Preference
7) Personal preference – most use 1
8) Personal preference – most use 1
9) 4
Timing advance is a very critical setting that affects all parameters of performance. If
a motor is given “too much” advance, it will have poor punch, poor speed, and
overheat quickly. When it is given “just right” advance, it will have best top speed,
best punch, and will run cool. When it is given “lower than optimal” advance, it will
lack punch and top speed, and run cool. The higher the turn of motor, the higher the
“just right” advance is. 10.5t in most cases “likes” medium advance, while mod
motors 8.5t and lower will tolerate decreasingly lower advance levels the lower the
turns of motor. The load state of the motor also effects how much advance it “likes”.
Under heavy load (accelerating hard out of a slow corner) it “likes” lower advance.
Running under low load (high RPM down the straight) it “likes” higher advance. This
is the basic model for “extra advance” ESCs – allowing higher advance to be shown
to the motor during low load and high rpm states.
The AMTS setting is linked to the Supercharger setting in that a “total advance” is
shown to the motor when the Supercharger is engaged. That total advance is the sum
of the AMTS setting, the physical advance on the motor, and the Supercharger level setting.
Again, even though the motor is in the low load and high rpm state where it
“likes” high advance, the cumulative total of these three advance settings may be high
enough that the top speed is not optimal, and the motor is overheated.
Given the above, if you are not seeing the expected top speed performance, even
though it seems like the wrong way, the first thing to do is lower the physical motor
advance, or the AMTS setting so that the “just right” overall advance setting will yield top speed.
AMTS is also in effect (combined with physical motor advance) when the
Supercharger is not active (low rpm/high load). Generally 10.5 “likes” a total of about
10deg in this state (depending on track surface grip and how tight the track is). But
please see the #15 setting for yet another timing advance linked option in the overall
chain of maximizing performance for the best understanding.
10) Personal preference
11) Place for future options – this setting does nothing right now.
12) 3
This is the overall Supercharger boost level. As above in the AMTS section, this is a
combination of motor, AMTS, and Supercharger settings, so set them as a team for
the desired top speed operation, and use #15 along with them to optimize punch.
13) Personal preference/gearing dependent. Most team testers have settled on setting
1, but use the setup procedures guide above to find the best setting for your track
size and driving style.
14) Again, personal preference/gearing dependent. Use the setup procedures to find
the best setting for your track. Most of the team drivers fall between setting 2 and
4 so far
15) 6
This is the final setting controlling advance before the Supercharger engages. As we’ve
seen above, high AMTS settings may be useful to maximize top speed, but most testers
have found a lack of punch when top speed settings are optimized. This setting artificially
retards the AMTS setting at high load/low RPM states to help the motor stay cool, and
gain back punch from being “over advanced”. The higher the setting #, the less advance
is being shown to the motor before the Supercharger engages, and therefore the cooler the
motor will run, and likely to have more punch as well.
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Last edited by chinaman; 12-13-2010 at 10:15 AM.
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Old 12-13-2010, 10:39 AM   #1919
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That guide won't help as its very outdated and was from SP when they didn't understand the software. The only guide to trust is the one on the hobbywing website
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Old 12-13-2010, 12:43 PM   #1920
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please could someone suggest a good motor as i keep killing lrp x 12's because of the amount of timing the motors have even when you put the -10 degree plug in. running 17.5 and 13.5 stock. tried the factory settings on the speedo and the motor came off at 170 degrees c.
Now that's 1 dead motor
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