The Future of Nitro Engine Racing
02-05-2010, 10:25 AM
#16
I believe America's love for gas burning engines will never let this happen. Most of the guys who run nitro are also big Nascar and drag racing fans.
I think onroad and offroad nitro would take a bigger hit from rising property cost rather than greenhouse issues.
I think onroad and offroad nitro would take a bigger hit from rising property cost rather than greenhouse issues.
02-05-2010, 12:19 PM
#18
On-road nitro racing is dead here. Not sure that it will ever start up again. Too many obstacles at the moment.
IMO... As the old timers get tired and move onto other things, I don't think others will step up to the plate to bear the burden of dealing with running a nitro race - and I think this espectially true of parking lot tracks.
My bigger concern is an overall loss of interest in R/C in general. I think video games have a huge negative impact on many activities, including R/C. We have a permanent outdoor electric track and only about 12-15 racers show up for organized racing. That speaks volumes to me.
As hobby stores and tracks close, and people find better things to do with their free time and money, the opportunity for someone to revive racing is a bigger challenge these days than I think it was many years ago. Add nitro into the equation and I think it makes it even more challenging.
If some money fell from the sky into my lap, I would build a place to race nitro - even it was just a paved surface with a drivers stand and a bathroom. I would even give up racing and be the race director, just so that other could come and race.
As I've stated before in other posts: The world isn't nitro friendly.
IMO... As the old timers get tired and move onto other things, I don't think others will step up to the plate to bear the burden of dealing with running a nitro race - and I think this espectially true of parking lot tracks.
My bigger concern is an overall loss of interest in R/C in general. I think video games have a huge negative impact on many activities, including R/C. We have a permanent outdoor electric track and only about 12-15 racers show up for organized racing. That speaks volumes to me.
As hobby stores and tracks close, and people find better things to do with their free time and money, the opportunity for someone to revive racing is a bigger challenge these days than I think it was many years ago. Add nitro into the equation and I think it makes it even more challenging.
If some money fell from the sky into my lap, I would build a place to race nitro - even it was just a paved surface with a drivers stand and a bathroom. I would even give up racing and be the race director, just so that other could come and race.
As I've stated before in other posts: The world isn't nitro friendly.
02-05-2010, 01:22 PM
#19
Future if Nitro
I race all nitro on-road <1/10th 1/8th and DM1> and really have no desire to go over to electric.
One thing I have noticed at one of our local tracks is, quite a few of the drivers<even the top drivers> have slowed way down on their attendence in the on-road races whether it be club races, or full blown 110 to 130 driver entrance races.
I found out that they all jumped over to electric, and of course I asked them why, and their biggest reason was the cost.
By the time you qualify on a Sat. <3 rounds> then the actual race on Sunday you can easily go through 3 or even 4 sets of tires, and at baiscally $30.00 and up for a good set of 1/8th scale tires, $35.00 for a gallon of fuel, and then the track fees, multiply that times 2 for 2 classes, you can just about blow $150.00 to $200.00 for the weekend.
Their response was with electric and running brushless, you can cut that cost to much less than 1/2 of the cost for a weekend.
Out of 7 or 8 of the guys that jumped to electric, only about 3 or 4 still race with us on the weekends.
Given the fact that by the time you purchase your kit, engine, pipe/header, servos,receiver, tires, body, you can tie upwards of $1,500.00 in a decent 1/8th scale car, not to mention everything else you need<tire truer,back up parts, spare tires,bodies and such.
I run 4 different 1/8 scale cars<2 Mugen, 1 Evolva,1 Serpent> and the parts I have in stock to support these cars well exceeds $2,500.00.<just new parts>not to mention spare tires,pipes,bodies.
Of course that is the extreme side of it, but the cost to run and support any good nitro car<any scale> can get very costly.
I have NO desire to run electric, but I guess I can see why some of the drivers have dropped off of the nitro racing. It is very costly to support a car with everything you need for the year and support it with everything you may need.
I truly hope nitro on-road can make a strong comeback, but I dont think it will happen until the economy turns around.
This is a hobby, and people will take care of mortgages,car payments, and the costs to raise their families before they spend money on a hobby.
One thing I have noticed at one of our local tracks is, quite a few of the drivers<even the top drivers> have slowed way down on their attendence in the on-road races whether it be club races, or full blown 110 to 130 driver entrance races.
I found out that they all jumped over to electric, and of course I asked them why, and their biggest reason was the cost.
By the time you qualify on a Sat. <3 rounds> then the actual race on Sunday you can easily go through 3 or even 4 sets of tires, and at baiscally $30.00 and up for a good set of 1/8th scale tires, $35.00 for a gallon of fuel, and then the track fees, multiply that times 2 for 2 classes, you can just about blow $150.00 to $200.00 for the weekend.
Their response was with electric and running brushless, you can cut that cost to much less than 1/2 of the cost for a weekend.
Out of 7 or 8 of the guys that jumped to electric, only about 3 or 4 still race with us on the weekends.
Given the fact that by the time you purchase your kit, engine, pipe/header, servos,receiver, tires, body, you can tie upwards of $1,500.00 in a decent 1/8th scale car, not to mention everything else you need<tire truer,back up parts, spare tires,bodies and such.
I run 4 different 1/8 scale cars<2 Mugen, 1 Evolva,1 Serpent> and the parts I have in stock to support these cars well exceeds $2,500.00.<just new parts>not to mention spare tires,pipes,bodies.
Of course that is the extreme side of it, but the cost to run and support any good nitro car<any scale> can get very costly.
I have NO desire to run electric, but I guess I can see why some of the drivers have dropped off of the nitro racing. It is very costly to support a car with everything you need for the year and support it with everything you may need.
I truly hope nitro on-road can make a strong comeback, but I dont think it will happen until the economy turns around.
This is a hobby, and people will take care of mortgages,car payments, and the costs to raise their families before they spend money on a hobby.
02-05-2010, 01:26 PM
#20
When I got into this hobby, 2000mah batteries just came out.. but 1600's were the only "leagal" battery. At the local tracks, 1/3 of the field couldn't finish a 4 minute race... even though I prefer engines anyway... that was the deal breaker there!!
Now today.. someone new... run time isn't a factor??
But I do believe noise is the bigger factor. don't think emissions will be the downfall.
Now today.. someone new... run time isn't a factor??
But I do believe noise is the bigger factor. don't think emissions will be the downfall.
02-05-2010, 01:36 PM
#21
I thought of switching from 1/10 onroad to 1/8 onroad. And I could not justify the cost. Tires alone for 1/8 onroad would break me. If I shop around I can get a whole set (front and rear)of 1/10 scale tires for about $16.00.
1/10 scale cars use less fuel and the engines are cheaper. But I found the more you hang around some of the old timers; you slowly get good hookups on alot of parts,fuel and tires. But that does help your local Hobby shop.
1/10 scale cars use less fuel and the engines are cheaper. But I found the more you hang around some of the old timers; you slowly get good hookups on alot of parts,fuel and tires. But that does help your local Hobby shop.
02-05-2010, 03:05 PM
#22
I thought of switching from 1/10 onroad to 1/8 onroad. And I could not justify the cost. Tires alone for 1/8 onroad would break me. If I shop around I can get a whole set (front and rear)of 1/10 scale tires for about $16.00.
1/10 scale cars use less fuel and the engines are cheaper. But I found the more you hang around some of the old timers; you slowly get good hookups on alot of parts,fuel and tires. But that does help your local Hobby shop.
1/10 scale cars use less fuel and the engines are cheaper. But I found the more you hang around some of the old timers; you slowly get good hookups on alot of parts,fuel and tires. But that does help your local Hobby shop.
just the pros & cons I loved racing sedan but 1/8th is just more fun for me
02-05-2010, 04:11 PM
#23
Nitro onroad is the biggest part of our hobby hit right now, i run The gulf coast raceway in Houston Texas, we get 15 to 20 drivers on a club race! But on offroad we average about 50 to 60 and three weeks ago we had 115 entries for a club race! a quarter of the entries were electric! We mainly have a nitro following here! But it is different all over the country! I think the mess our country is in rite now is the biggest problem, when it comes to doing anything like this your EXTRA money is what pays for it, lets face it not one of us has to race rc cars, it is what we want to do! I think as the economy comes back or if it does to what it was 5 or 6 years ago is the cure for nitro or electric racing! Ive been racing for over 20 years, and attendance is down for both not just one! And also it will take a huge GROUP effort to rebuild all of our racing scenes through out the country! But i am a nitro guy! i think their will always be nitro powered rc cars! as their will always be electrics! Just my 2 cents!
02-05-2010, 06:11 PM
#24
In Holland the clubs are more under pressure with the environment, more people have issues with noise and strainge enough the rules about it are becomming more strickter by the day. If this goes on then soon there is a possibillity that clubs have to go to electric and maybe they can have gas engines for a few hours a day an all because some people are irritated by the noise or even worse: they think they are.....
02-05-2010, 06:28 PM
#25
I hope Nitro doesn't go away any time soon. Before R/C, i was (and still am) a huge fan of real cars. Ive been dragging and road racing Hondas, Nissans, and now Mitsubishis since highschool and nitro cars are kind of like a miniature version of those. Electric just doesnt do it for me.
And as far as battery power being green? I have to disagree completely when factoring in the production and disposal of the batteries themselves.
And as far as battery power being green? I have to disagree completely when factoring in the production and disposal of the batteries themselves.
02-06-2010, 06:38 PM
#26
Tech Regular
iTrader: (1)
Here in SoCal on-road Nitro racing has fallen away primarily due to the lack of suitable tracks. In an area known for it's high cost of real estate, and a less than tolerant public, it's hard to keep a proper nitro suitable permanent track open, much less get a new one created.
The electric cars don't require as much space to race and don't have the noise issues so it has become the bulk of on-road racing here.
I race both on-road Electric and Nitro (1/10th and 1/8 GT) but would like to do more Nitro racing as it's my first love. But it's not easy here. My local permanent track is too small for any 1/8 on-road and marginal for 1/10th Nitro. The club races Nitro off-road right next to it so noise isn't a problem, only getting enough interest from racers to make up a 1/10th Nitro class. I have the same problem with 1/8GT at other tracks, getting enough racers to show up to make a class.
Everybody talks about the high cost of Nitro racing but electric isn't cheap either. About the only difference is the cost of the fuel. The current price of competitive ESC/motor/battery combos easily equal the price of a good Nitro engine. The benefit electric racing has is the rubber tires last longer than foams. I wish they made high quality rubber tires for 1/10th Nitro cars, I hate foams, they are disposable tires.
The electric cars don't require as much space to race and don't have the noise issues so it has become the bulk of on-road racing here.
I race both on-road Electric and Nitro (1/10th and 1/8 GT) but would like to do more Nitro racing as it's my first love. But it's not easy here. My local permanent track is too small for any 1/8 on-road and marginal for 1/10th Nitro. The club races Nitro off-road right next to it so noise isn't a problem, only getting enough interest from racers to make up a 1/10th Nitro class. I have the same problem with 1/8GT at other tracks, getting enough racers to show up to make a class.
Everybody talks about the high cost of Nitro racing but electric isn't cheap either. About the only difference is the cost of the fuel. The current price of competitive ESC/motor/battery combos easily equal the price of a good Nitro engine. The benefit electric racing has is the rubber tires last longer than foams. I wish they made high quality rubber tires for 1/10th Nitro cars, I hate foams, they are disposable tires.
02-08-2010, 05:58 PM
#27
I'd have to agree with some of the others, it really is all dependant on the location and the current economy.
I've been doing nitro on-road and electric off-road for about 4 years (7 really but I dont count the last 3 due to college taking up my time). When i raced the parking lot track by my hobby store there were easy 20-30 racers, last year I visited and there were only about 12 but all but 2 ran nitro. I've been talking to the hobby store crew and it seems that this year they have a huge increase in both electric and nitro racers coming in to get there cars ready for the summers races again.
Who knows maybe both sports will gain a boost this year. I hope so cause I too am getting back into the swing of things
And I also think that the whole "Green" argument is just a convient word for people to use because they are simply -too inconvienced- by the sound of our fun... poor babies
I've been doing nitro on-road and electric off-road for about 4 years (7 really but I dont count the last 3 due to college taking up my time). When i raced the parking lot track by my hobby store there were easy 20-30 racers, last year I visited and there were only about 12 but all but 2 ran nitro. I've been talking to the hobby store crew and it seems that this year they have a huge increase in both electric and nitro racers coming in to get there cars ready for the summers races again.
Who knows maybe both sports will gain a boost this year. I hope so cause I too am getting back into the swing of things
And I also think that the whole "Green" argument is just a convient word for people to use because they are simply -too inconvienced- by the sound of our fun... poor babies
02-09-2010, 12:31 PM
#28
This has been a reallly good discussion on this subject. Many of you have highlighted some very insightful things in regards to why nitro onroad racing is declining. I, for one, know that nitro onroad will still be around; the question becomes in what capacity. I know our cars are noisy, but it can't be any worse than a gas lawnmower. I say this because I have heard of a few tracks over the years getting shut down or having to move due to residents living around the track complaining about the noise, yet they never seem to complain when you get a bunch of lawnmowers going at the same time cutting yards during the day.
I am a nitro guy and always will be one. I have electric onroad, offroad, and heli stuff that parallel my nitro onroad, offroad, and heli stuff. Electric stuff is fun, but nothing beats the sound and smell of nitro.
I am a nitro guy and always will be one. I have electric onroad, offroad, and heli stuff that parallel my nitro onroad, offroad, and heli stuff. Electric stuff is fun, but nothing beats the sound and smell of nitro.
02-09-2010, 12:59 PM
#29
Great discussion guys.
We, the on-road nitro racers can help by getting additional people interested in the sport. Invite them out to the track on a practice day or race day. Let them drive one of your older or spare cars. Provide your expert help so that they don't frustrated.
Purchasing a car plus all of the support equipment is a giant step in terms of cost for a new racer. But consider that older shaft drive car that some racers still have on the shelf, gathering dust, with the less powerful engine, may be just the thing a new racer needs to get their feet wet. They may even get hooked on the sport, now you've added a racer. What if 5 established racers tried this method twice a month? I am going to try this approach this season.
We, the on-road nitro racers can help by getting additional people interested in the sport. Invite them out to the track on a practice day or race day. Let them drive one of your older or spare cars. Provide your expert help so that they don't frustrated.
Purchasing a car plus all of the support equipment is a giant step in terms of cost for a new racer. But consider that older shaft drive car that some racers still have on the shelf, gathering dust, with the less powerful engine, may be just the thing a new racer needs to get their feet wet. They may even get hooked on the sport, now you've added a racer. What if 5 established racers tried this method twice a month? I am going to try this approach this season.
02-09-2010, 03:08 PM
#30
Great discussion guys.
We, the on-road nitro racers can help by getting additional people interested in the sport. Invite them out to the track on a practice day or race day. Let them drive one of your older or spare cars. Provide your expert help so that they don't frustrated.
Purchasing a car plus all of the support equipment is a giant step in terms of cost for a new racer. But consider that older shaft drive car that some racers still have on the shelf, gathering dust, with the less powerful engine, may be just the thing a new racer needs to get their feet wet. They may even get hooked on the sport, now you've added a racer. What if 5 established racers tried this method twice a month? I am going to try this approach this season.
We, the on-road nitro racers can help by getting additional people interested in the sport. Invite them out to the track on a practice day or race day. Let them drive one of your older or spare cars. Provide your expert help so that they don't frustrated.
Purchasing a car plus all of the support equipment is a giant step in terms of cost for a new racer. But consider that older shaft drive car that some racers still have on the shelf, gathering dust, with the less powerful engine, may be just the thing a new racer needs to get their feet wet. They may even get hooked on the sport, now you've added a racer. What if 5 established racers tried this method twice a month? I am going to try this approach this season.
