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Old 10-30-2009, 08:58 PM   #121
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Originally Posted by DogboneS View Post
Is the Motonica P8C available online?
Not at this time, but if you want one, please shoot me an email at info@motonica-usa.com
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Old 10-30-2009, 09:57 PM   #122
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..........WRONG.........
I agree, I think rules (ROAR or otherwise) should not favor or be created for one manufacturer. I will try to get a copy of the rules used in Italy and France and post them here. If the P8C is anything like the P81, then it will be a fine quality car with good handling and performance. I am sure the other 2wd pan cars are good too. The more, the merrier.
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Old 10-30-2009, 10:17 PM   #123
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Not at this time, but if you want one, please shoot me an email at info@motonica-usa.com
Garen,.curious as to what the Motonica pan car would cost??.....street price???...........
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Old 10-30-2009, 10:21 PM   #124
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Originally Posted by Taylorm View Post
.solid rear axle......
.3-port motors......
off road-type clutch....no centax......
.single speed..........
.bodies.....up for debate..........all=CHEAP.......
I agree with all the key points you mention except the lack of a diff, I was around when we ran 2wd pan cars with solid axles, I also remember the conversion to diffs. Night and day difference in terms of driveabilty!! Believe me, we want diffs with 2wd!!

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Old 10-30-2009, 10:48 PM   #125
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..........WRONG.........
My statement of a single chassis rule at the birth of a North American class would only establish a solid foundation to build from and create a common parts inventory/availability on a broader scale: not to cause outrage. OK

The possible inclusion of the “vintage” pan cars in existence in North America would help growth & spark interest. This would also add a “resurgence” appeal to the class image; thus recreating a “nostalgic vibe” within racers that could also stimulate growth.

Once a viable “dealer network” to supply wide-scale pan car products to the market you wish to attract to your new class exist & prosper, other new chassis could easily be added to your established class.

All of what I’ve written regarding the positive growth of your “1/8 Pan Car” class is based on the fact that “you… the consumer” is building the class, with little if any financial investment from the actual manufacturer’s to the growth of your class.

If Garren’s company are willing to undergo the investment needed to supply products that would establish this new class for North Americans to enjoy, shouldn’t we support their efforts for taking the risk?

All I’m saying is… if you’re trying to build an Army, they all should wear the same uniform in “Basic Training”.

Garren, if the class grows in a unified fashon, you bring the cars in and Ipanema will try to help too. You have our support.

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Old 10-31-2009, 01:08 AM   #126
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I think at least initially it will be a nearly 1 car class since Garen seems to be the only one interested in bringing a car into this country. So it will be Motonicas against the occasional RC250 or other vintage car. If it takes off, then I'm sure other cars will start to show up.
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Old 10-31-2009, 01:32 AM   #127
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Garen,.curious as to what the Motonica pan car would cost??.....street price???...........
Mid $400's +/-, but if there is enough interest I can try to get better pricing from Italy. On the European websites I have seen it listed in the mid 400's but in Euro's. I have seen the DXF car listed well into the 500 Euro's, the BRX car even higher. There was one more car mentioned in this thread, but I could not find much info on it.
All the cars have a flat chassis, solid suspension, a rear diff of some sort (ball or gear, or the option of either in the case of the P8C), and for the most part a similar layout. I am sure some are 'better' than others, but based on photos alone it does not look like one is significantly better than the other, and while I appreciate the support should I/Motonica invest in this class, I think it's best to allow the racer to choose which car to race with, provided it fits within whatever rules are decided upon. Current Motonica owners can attest to the support and service provided, and any 2wd customer will get the same support.

Page 74 of the ROAR rulebook has rules in place for a 1/8th on road nitro pan class. Based on the ideas presented in this thread, the current rules might need some tweaking. Specifically whether the class should be 2wd or 4wd and whether independent rear suspension should be allowed. Also, it reads .21 engine only, no mention of ports, etc. Any thoughts?
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Old 10-31-2009, 01:47 AM   #128
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I do have one concern. Single speed could be a problem. There are a few really long 1/8th tracks around now but you are still going to want some gear to get through the infield. That could really play havoc on rods, especially if people start modding these things to turn high rpms.
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Old 10-31-2009, 02:04 AM   #129
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I don't know about the other cars, but the stock gearing on the P8C is 19/47, with 20T and 48T pulleys. You have the option of going up or down on the pinion and down on the spur. Don't forget you probably won't carry as much speed entering and exiting the straights. These cars probably weigh 200-300 grams less than our 4wd cars, so even though they are geared a bit high for infield use, there isn't as much weight to push around.
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Old 10-31-2009, 05:13 AM   #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garen View Post
I don't know about the other cars, but the stock gearing on the P8C is 19/47, with 20T and 48T pulleys. You have the option of going up or down on the pinion and down on the spur. Don't forget you probably won't carry as much speed entering and exiting the straights. These cars probably weigh 200-300 grams less than our 4wd cars, so even though they are geared a bit high for infield use, there isn't as much weight to push around.
Speaking from experience from running pan cars and 2wd suspension cars in the past, single speed gear ratios of between 5.00 to 5.7 to 1 worked fine
even on a relatively long track. The 2-speeds were developed in the mid 1980's for the 4wd cars that came out. The extra drag of drive train and pulling the front wheels was causing problems getting off the corners and overheating the engines was a problem from the extra drag.

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Old 10-31-2009, 05:35 AM   #131
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I had brief correspondence with Wrc about their car and is was 410 euro (around 600 usd) plus shipping from Italy...I did not pursue it further as i thought the cost was to high to try to import.

Seems like the motonica kit is most bang for the buck in mid 400$.

Engine wise I can talk a bit more with Joaquin @ serpent/novarossi to check on availability and price.

Now the important part.....who is willing to purchase a kit?

Can we get a couple of tracks to support running this class? Should we get a list going to get idea of interest and the area people are located?

Copy and paste your name if your interested.

Euro 2wd Pan Car Class/Series:

Jamie Gonzalez-Connecticut
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Old 10-31-2009, 06:24 AM   #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by senna555 View Post
I had brief correspondence with Wrc about their car and is was 410 euro (around 600 usd) plus shipping from Italy...I did not pursue it further as i thought the cost was to high to try to import.

Seems like the motonica kit is most bang for the buck in mid 400$.

Engine wise I can talk a bit more with Joaquin @ serpent/novarossi to check on availability and price.

Now the important part.....who is willing to purchase a kit?

Can we get a couple of tracks to support running this class? Should we get a list going to get idea of interest and the area people are located?

Copy and paste your name if your interested.

Euro 2wd Pan Car Class/Series:

Jamie Gonzalez-Connecticut
I will have a Motonica P8.0C come springtime to race at COTROLFREAKZ , even if it means running in the 4WD OPEN class -- Dave Toth
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Old 10-31-2009, 08:50 AM   #133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by senna555 View Post
Can we get a couple of tracks to support running this class? Should we get a list going to get idea of interest and the area people are located?

Copy and paste your name if your interested.

Euro 2wd Pan Car Class/Series:

Jamie Gonzalez-Connecticut
..........I'm ready to run my RC250 next spring here in toledo (along with my 1/8 4WD).......but don't want to take time from other classes........we usually get done with our day somewhere about 6PM........maybe to add one more class we will need to start our qualifying a little earlier and cut back qualifying rounds to 2 qualifiers........we run 1/8 open, 1/8 masters, sedan and GT........i don't want to have to stay too late on Sundays.......there has to be a way to fit it in.........when i had my RC250 at the track last year most of the guys thought it was pretty cool........
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Old 10-31-2009, 03:03 PM   #134
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http://www.motonica.com/en/products/P8F_46 other options....4WD pan......

http://www.motonica.com/en/products/P8C_12 or 2WD
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Old 11-01-2009, 03:37 PM   #135
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The P8F (4wd version) is not out yet. When it does become available, there will be an upgrade kit to go from P8C to P8F. I will get a P8C myself and unless it drives horribly I think I will stick to the 2wd version. I think the appeal of simplicity is greater than any performance gain of 4wd.
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