GOOD FUEL
01-27-2007, 09:06 AM
#91
Tech Master
iTrader: (47)
It's not local...but close enough. About 125KM's away. I'm always there for business plus our local racing club does bulk fuel orders.
We haven't been able to get O'Donnell for a long time. Reason I've been told is because their packaging does not have French on it. Nazi government here. One LHS is now going to bring it in...may only be short lived. No idea.
Byrons and Sidewinder are (were) the two biggest here. Werks was unavailable until now. Many of the local racers are making the move to Werks this season. People are experimenting...which is a great idea.
We haven't been able to get O'Donnell for a long time. Reason I've been told is because their packaging does not have French on it. Nazi government here. One LHS is now going to bring it in...may only be short lived. No idea.
Byrons and Sidewinder are (were) the two biggest here. Werks was unavailable until now. Many of the local racers are making the move to Werks this season. People are experimenting...which is a great idea.
01-27-2007, 09:11 AM
#92
Maybe you could just stock up on the stuff. 
Hey Ron, Have you had a chance to take a look at my second set of questions yet? I know some of them are newbie questions, but it will help make the info I posted at my Web site more complete. Getting the info from an authoritative source is always a good thing.
Thanks,
Rainer
Hey Ron, Have you had a chance to take a look at my second set of questions yet? I know some of them are newbie questions, but it will help make the info I posted at my Web site more complete. Getting the info from an authoritative source is always a good thing.
Thanks,
Rainer
Last edited by rmdhawaii; 01-27-2007 at 10:29 AM.
01-27-2007, 04:50 PM
#93
Spoke with my LHS today and they are willing to bring in some Werks Racing Fuel for me. They need to call the distributor on Monday, to see if they can get me one gallon each of the 30% and 20% or if I have to buy it by the case, one case of 20%. Unfortunately, the store just ordered a whole pallet of fuel, so it's going to cost me quite a bit just to ship in my order. Estimate for shipping was about $50.00. I was told that it should take about 3 weeks to come in - just in time for me to test it a race before our championship race in March. 
I'm really looking forward to trying this fuel. Should be awesome! 
I'm really looking forward to trying this fuel. Should be awesome!
01-27-2007, 05:45 PM
#94
Rainer, regarding your questions:
If you don't mind, I've come up with a few more questions:
1. At what temperature should the fuel be stored?
2. What are some of the consequences of storing the fuel at temperatures outside of this range? i.e. higher or lower; How about refrigerated?
***Both of these kind of go together so I'll answere it as one. For long term storage you want to keep fuel in a cool, dry area. Perferably in an area that is out of direct sunlight (UV radiation) and that maintains a stable temperature i.e not cold in the evening and hot in the afternoon (like a metal shed). As mentioned you want to avoid dramatic temp changes especialy after opening the bottle. The reason being is that the air inside of the bottle will form condensation. Would also recomend that you keep your fuel out of the refrigerator lol!
3. What's the shelf life of the fuel once it's been opened? Is there some point at which it's just best to buy a new batch?
**Honestly if you squeeze all of the air out of the bottle, cap it well and store in a stable temperature out of direct sun light it should keep for quite a while.
4. How long can the fuel be stored unopened?
** Unotpended especialy when indution sealed as we do it should be virtualy indefinately. Just try to minimize the exposure to UV Radiation (direct sun light) especialy for transparent bottles and this can have adverse effects on the fuel and specificaly on the lubrincants.
5. Some people route their fuel lines over the pipe and around the engine. Is this a bad idea or does it really matter?
** You see a lot of long fuel lines etc. in off-road. Is it bad, not realy but it will change the tune of the engines so you have to keep this in mind when changing fuel line lenghts. Also it is more sucseptable to pin holes etc. that can cause tuning issues. Personaly if you are looking to increase run time our bring your tank capacity up to the max. allowed I would recomend that you add a fuel filter (remove the internal filter) or two. This is what we usualy do in off-road.
6. Some people have stated that its a bad idea to switch from running a higher nitro percentage to a lower nitro percentage, but its okay to switch from a lower to higher nitro percentage. What are your thoughts on this?
** This is one of the biggest miths around. Along the same lines as the old "once you break in an engine with a certain nitro percentage you have to keep on using it for the duration of the life of the engine". When I hear this my responce is allways metal has no memory so how can it make a difference? You can switch nitro percentages either up or down without any problems. Just keep in mind that you will have to re-tune your engine anytime you do this. (to be safe allways richen the needles a couple of hours prior to doing this, switch fuel and then tune from there). Also you have to keep in mind what nitro percentage the combustion chamber is shimmed for as you may have to add a head shim to reduce the compression ratio. Usualy .12's are shimmed for 20% and .21's are shimmed for 25% or 30% from the factory.
Hope this helps!
If you don't mind, I've come up with a few more questions:
1. At what temperature should the fuel be stored?
2. What are some of the consequences of storing the fuel at temperatures outside of this range? i.e. higher or lower; How about refrigerated?
***Both of these kind of go together so I'll answere it as one. For long term storage you want to keep fuel in a cool, dry area. Perferably in an area that is out of direct sunlight (UV radiation) and that maintains a stable temperature i.e not cold in the evening and hot in the afternoon (like a metal shed). As mentioned you want to avoid dramatic temp changes especialy after opening the bottle. The reason being is that the air inside of the bottle will form condensation. Would also recomend that you keep your fuel out of the refrigerator lol!
3. What's the shelf life of the fuel once it's been opened? Is there some point at which it's just best to buy a new batch?
**Honestly if you squeeze all of the air out of the bottle, cap it well and store in a stable temperature out of direct sun light it should keep for quite a while.
4. How long can the fuel be stored unopened?
** Unotpended especialy when indution sealed as we do it should be virtualy indefinately. Just try to minimize the exposure to UV Radiation (direct sun light) especialy for transparent bottles and this can have adverse effects on the fuel and specificaly on the lubrincants.
5. Some people route their fuel lines over the pipe and around the engine. Is this a bad idea or does it really matter?
** You see a lot of long fuel lines etc. in off-road. Is it bad, not realy but it will change the tune of the engines so you have to keep this in mind when changing fuel line lenghts. Also it is more sucseptable to pin holes etc. that can cause tuning issues. Personaly if you are looking to increase run time our bring your tank capacity up to the max. allowed I would recomend that you add a fuel filter (remove the internal filter) or two. This is what we usualy do in off-road.
6. Some people have stated that its a bad idea to switch from running a higher nitro percentage to a lower nitro percentage, but its okay to switch from a lower to higher nitro percentage. What are your thoughts on this?
** This is one of the biggest miths around. Along the same lines as the old "once you break in an engine with a certain nitro percentage you have to keep on using it for the duration of the life of the engine". When I hear this my responce is allways metal has no memory so how can it make a difference? You can switch nitro percentages either up or down without any problems. Just keep in mind that you will have to re-tune your engine anytime you do this. (to be safe allways richen the needles a couple of hours prior to doing this, switch fuel and then tune from there). Also you have to keep in mind what nitro percentage the combustion chamber is shimmed for as you may have to add a head shim to reduce the compression ratio. Usualy .12's are shimmed for 20% and .21's are shimmed for 25% or 30% from the factory.
Hope this helps!
01-27-2007, 07:21 PM
#95
Ron ~ Excellent! Thanks for responding to my questions once again. I'm sure a lot of people will benefit from this info.
01-27-2007, 10:14 PM
#97
Suna, I'm not sure if I'm understanding what you are asking when you say "Have you seen (or heard of) any performance issues in long term high altitude use? ". Are you asking with our fuel, fuel in general or just as far as running an engine? If this is in regards to using fuel in high altitudes, frankly how would this affect the fuel? It will affect the set up of your engine though. Higher altitudes=thinner air. This means that for optimum performance with any engine you will probably want drop the deck height a bit plus you will obviously run leaner needle setting than at say sea level. If you are not familiar with adjusting deckheight it's probably best if you not do this as if you set it incorrectly you can and probably will quickly destroy your engine.
01-28-2007, 01:33 AM
#99
Tech Master
iTrader: (47)
Originally Posted by Werks
Suna, I'm not sure if I'm understanding what you are asking when you say "Have you seen (or heard of) any performance issues in long term high altitude use? ". Are you asking with our fuel, fuel in general or just as far as running an engine? If this is in regards to using fuel in high altitudes, frankly how would this affect the fuel? It will affect the set up of your engine though. Higher altitudes=thinner air. This means that for optimum performance with any engine you will probably want drop the deck height a bit plus you will obviously run leaner needle setting than at say sea level. If you are not familiar with adjusting deckheight it's probably best if you not do this as if you set it incorrectly you can and probably will quickly destroy your engine.
01-28-2007, 01:55 AM
#100
Originally Posted by SUNA
Due to our climate and high altitude fuels with a high level of castor oil tend to gum up engines. I cannot find any info on Werks' blend so I thought I would ask you.
01-28-2007, 10:38 AM
#101
Tech Master
iTrader: (47)
Most people switched to Sidewinder and the problem seemed to go away. Then there became some incidents with Sidewinder...or maybe Rossi motors. Motors were blowing like crazy...all Rossi's...all on Sidewinder. Bad batch of fuel...bad engines...who knows. So a lot of racers are going to try Werks this year.
01-28-2007, 11:27 AM
#102
Suna, I think that might have more to do with the temperatures that you guys have over there but honestly I'm not sure as we have not had any problems. We did however have to go back and change the labels to add French as you mentioned, to be able to sell up there lol!
01-29-2007, 12:56 PM
#104
Hi Ron
I believe the term is "hygroscopic".
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/hygroscopic
Great responses Ron. I know you are my friend but I am glad to see somebody in this business finally stand up and answer questions with such candor. To the real men of r/c... we salute you
Originally Posted by Werks
Because methanol is hydroscopic and basically will suck moisture out of the air.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/hygroscopic
Great responses Ron. I know you are my friend but I am glad to see somebody in this business finally stand up and answer questions with such candor. To the real men of r/c... we salute you
Last edited by fraz; 01-29-2007 at 03:27 PM.
01-31-2007, 03:45 PM
#105
My LHS got back to me today, that the actual cost of bringing in a case of fuel is going to be $138.00 USD just for the shipping. 
Because this is a special run, it's costing me more than it normally would - and the LHS is not going to be ordering fuel for another 3-4 months. I know the fuel is probably going to be worth it, but I really have to think twice if I want to spend $240 on four gallons of fuel. 
Because this is a special run, it's costing me more than it normally would - and the LHS is not going to be ordering fuel for another 3-4 months. I know the fuel is probably going to be worth it, but I really have to think twice if I want to spend $240 on four gallons of fuel.
Last edited by rmdhawaii; 01-31-2007 at 04:09 PM.