ROAR 2006 'Open' Fuel Nationals Sidebar Discussion
10-13-2006, 06:35 PM
#1
ROAR 2006 'Open' Fuel Nationals Sidebar Discussion
I’ve been offline for the past 10 days and was anxiously looking forward to the reviewing the results of this race. The level of controversy about the start is pretty much off the charts, so it’s only natural that I have something to say about it. 
Since my comments go well beyond the race itself, I decided to create a seperate thread on it.
First, my congrats to the winners. I’ll have to get onto SGrid some time this weekend to checkout the pics and the videos.
A-Main start: Bad starts are all a part of racing. We all know this. At club races or at something as big as the Nationals, as Luke W pointed out, “sh*t happens". I think it’s good that we talk about it, so that everyone can learn from the experience and reduce the likelihood of bad starts in future races. Eliminate it entirely? Good luck. About the closest thing to a clean start that I can think of are the race gates at horse races – but I’m sure that’s not perfect either.
Rules: Race directors need to enforce the ground rules laid down for an event. Period. Failure to do so lessens the quality of an event and starts to reek of favoritism and unfairness. I wasn't at this event, so I cannot make any statements about how well the rules were enforced. This is only a general comment made based on what other posted.
Video: The ability to review video is a great thing, but the bottom line is, it’s not part of the rules. Bad starts, rough driving, pit violations and more, are all up for this level of scrutiny. Is this what we really want? Are we willing to pay for this level of officiating at National events? I don’t think so. For this level of officiating, I think an entry fee of $250-500 would not be out of the question.
Taking R/C “seriously”: Just because someone doesn’t derive an income from racing cars, does not make them any less serious than those who do. I hate the fact that people continue to make this distinction. That’s messed up. If a person can derive some type of income from racing Nitro R/C cars, more power to them. I’m sure all of us would like to be in this position. But people who do derive an income from racing, qualify/race with people who do not derive any income from racing and like everyone, fall under a racing organization that IMO, is more oriented toward hobby level enthusiast versus “professional” racers. I’m sure a lot of people will disagree with this statement, but it’s how I see it at the moment. I admit that I have to give this more thought.
Some people seem to be implying, that for those that take this hobby "more seriously", a different set of rules or level of rule enforcement needs to be in effect.
Many of us only have a ROAR membership because it’s required to race – and the reason we need it is because of the liability insurance. The rules are a good thing and provide a foundation under which we can all race at a competitive level. As stated in the rules, the race director has a lot of leeway over how a race is run. The ROAR Race Management Team thing is an interesting concept – but it’s like combing the three braches of the U.S. government into one governing body. Who do you appeal to when the rules, officiating and final decisions are all made by the same entity?
We all have our reasons for racing, but at the end of the day, we either walk away happy or unhappy, winners or not winners, fulfilled or unfulfilled. I’m pretty sure that the majority of us want a clean fair race, in which everyone complies by the rules and the rules are strictly enforced. But that’s an ideal that can never be fully attained and we all have to live with a certain amount of imperfection and disappointment. For some, the consequences of racing under these conditions is far greater and unacceptable when things go wrong than for others. At the moment, that’s just the way it is.
The bottom line is: Can anything be done to make things better?
Since my comments go well beyond the race itself, I decided to create a seperate thread on it. First, my congrats to the winners. I’ll have to get onto SGrid some time this weekend to checkout the pics and the videos.
A-Main start: Bad starts are all a part of racing. We all know this. At club races or at something as big as the Nationals, as Luke W pointed out, “sh*t happens". I think it’s good that we talk about it, so that everyone can learn from the experience and reduce the likelihood of bad starts in future races. Eliminate it entirely? Good luck. About the closest thing to a clean start that I can think of are the race gates at horse races – but I’m sure that’s not perfect either.
Rules: Race directors need to enforce the ground rules laid down for an event. Period. Failure to do so lessens the quality of an event and starts to reek of favoritism and unfairness. I wasn't at this event, so I cannot make any statements about how well the rules were enforced. This is only a general comment made based on what other posted.
Video: The ability to review video is a great thing, but the bottom line is, it’s not part of the rules. Bad starts, rough driving, pit violations and more, are all up for this level of scrutiny. Is this what we really want? Are we willing to pay for this level of officiating at National events? I don’t think so. For this level of officiating, I think an entry fee of $250-500 would not be out of the question.
Taking R/C “seriously”: Just because someone doesn’t derive an income from racing cars, does not make them any less serious than those who do. I hate the fact that people continue to make this distinction. That’s messed up. If a person can derive some type of income from racing Nitro R/C cars, more power to them. I’m sure all of us would like to be in this position. But people who do derive an income from racing, qualify/race with people who do not derive any income from racing and like everyone, fall under a racing organization that IMO, is more oriented toward hobby level enthusiast versus “professional” racers. I’m sure a lot of people will disagree with this statement, but it’s how I see it at the moment. I admit that I have to give this more thought.
Some people seem to be implying, that for those that take this hobby "more seriously", a different set of rules or level of rule enforcement needs to be in effect. Many of us only have a ROAR membership because it’s required to race – and the reason we need it is because of the liability insurance. The rules are a good thing and provide a foundation under which we can all race at a competitive level. As stated in the rules, the race director has a lot of leeway over how a race is run. The ROAR Race Management Team thing is an interesting concept – but it’s like combing the three braches of the U.S. government into one governing body. Who do you appeal to when the rules, officiating and final decisions are all made by the same entity?
We all have our reasons for racing, but at the end of the day, we either walk away happy or unhappy, winners or not winners, fulfilled or unfulfilled. I’m pretty sure that the majority of us want a clean fair race, in which everyone complies by the rules and the rules are strictly enforced. But that’s an ideal that can never be fully attained and we all have to live with a certain amount of imperfection and disappointment. For some, the consequences of racing under these conditions is far greater and unacceptable when things go wrong than for others. At the moment, that’s just the way it is.
The bottom line is: Can anything be done to make things better?
10-14-2006, 05:26 PM
#3
Tech Adept
rmd: yeah the start of the race wasn't as good as it could've been. Many mistakes were made everyone invovled from Jarrod to Cyrul. We all know these happen from r/c racing to F1, it's almost unavoidable. I don't think, even with more officiating, it can be much better.
The biggest problem I've heard that no one seems to be bothered about is the inforcement of the rules set forth to all ROAR members. I do believe Nationals should be held to a higher standard than even a Regional race. There should be no way a driver with dq'd car should be allowed to bump up to the next main. It happened. Not only did this driver not make weight but he also drove his car without a muffler for at least the last minute of his main (enough to cost him the bump up position). The ROAR president allowed him to go on anyways because of a minor communication mess up (even though both the tech and the race director saw the violation). My point is the rules weren't enforced strictly enough to make it fair for everyone from Burch to the last place driver.
The biggest problem I've heard that no one seems to be bothered about is the inforcement of the rules set forth to all ROAR members. I do believe Nationals should be held to a higher standard than even a Regional race. There should be no way a driver with dq'd car should be allowed to bump up to the next main. It happened. Not only did this driver not make weight but he also drove his car without a muffler for at least the last minute of his main (enough to cost him the bump up position). The ROAR president allowed him to go on anyways because of a minor communication mess up (even though both the tech and the race director saw the violation). My point is the rules weren't enforced strictly enough to make it fair for everyone from Burch to the last place driver.
10-15-2006, 07:41 AM
#4
Seems like the the last few years there is always some kind of controversy at the ROAR Nats. Doesn't matter if it's fuel or electric. How mant times have you heard the race director say in the drivers meeting "if you don't corner marshall your race I'm going to dock you a lap" blah blah blah!!! Does it ever happent? Very rarely. More the exception than the rule. Officials have to start calling violations even if it angers their friends fellow racers. You have to be fair or you'll be caled on it and it will be on the inetrnet the next day like it is now. The centerpiece of conversations should not be the controversies but rather how good the race was or how well run and organized the race was. You can't please all of the people all of the time but it sure seems like you can piss all of them off all of the time!!!
10-15-2006, 07:59 AM
#5
hmm
as far as turn marshall what should be done is when you turn your car into tech after your race you should get a orange vest with the appropriate # so there is no excuse that i was out there didnt you see me thats just my 1 penny fix 
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