R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Nitro Off-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 05-04-2012, 02:02 PM   #16
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: cincinnati ohio
Posts: 880
Trader Rating: 93 (100%+)
Default Pick-em

I own both. I race both. If I had to keep only one it would be the K-car. The mugen is very good at times but the Mp9 is good all the time.
latemodel13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2012, 02:16 PM   #17
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 123
Default Kyosho overpriced - quality not as good as mugen

Just read the threads. to me it sucks that to buy a tki3 you have to pay 30%!!! more than the next highest priced car mugen - here the yen/dollar exchange rate might be justied as an explanation of why Japanese cars cost more. - more on that later.
In truggy the strr is 27% higher in price than the next highest priced offering (losi)
in 1/10 4wd the laser is 15 % more than the shumacher cat! This car is made in the uk where the sterling trades higher relative to the dollar (unlike the yen which is not on par with the usd) - so what is kyoshos excuse there? They cannot claim 8 1/10 4wd wc's can they?
In 1/10 buggy you can expect to pay either 17% more for a kyosho (versus the 22) or 6% less because kyosho offers two pricepoints in that class.
No competetive 1/10 truck... No competetive sedan no competetive 1/8 onroad...at least as listed by amain hobbies.
It is abundantly clear that the mp9 is kyoshos cash cow. They can bank on the fact that people will pay more because it is seen as a winning car. In it's fourth iteration now the mp9 still suffers from reliability issues - read the threads... It is almost voodoo to bring it up over there (kyosho threads)
you would think that a quality car and r&d program as they claim would have eliminated many of these issues years ago.
In short you are being fleeced by kyosho pricewise ( I have a tki2) yes it is good but what kyosho is doing is tantamount to associated charging 500 dollars for a b4 because it has won more championships than any car ( kyoshos wins combined btw)
get the mugen. Just my two cents... Verify the percentages at amain yourself if you do not believe me.
talbotbid011 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2012, 07:51 PM   #18
Tech Regular
 
BlueStreakOne's Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Palm Beach Gardens, FL
Posts: 479
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Just curious, does the mugen also come with titanium screws?
__________________
Sometimes u r the bug and sometimes I'm the windshield....
BlueStreakOne is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2012, 07:25 AM   #19
Tech Master
 
jzemaxx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: North Alabama
Posts: 1,586
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Default

Ive also owned both the mbx6 and the tki2. Handd down the tki2 is a much better car. Does everything better. As far as arms breaking, none so far on the tki2 wc arms. The mbx6 i broke quite a few arms which are known to be a weak link on the car anyhow. Other then that both cars are solid. The mp9 is a car that has been refined over many years. Partly why AE ,HB...etc are all copying the car.
__________________
Kyosho MP9 TKi2 Tekin
Kyosho MP9 TKi2/3 Novarossi BTT
jzemaxx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2012, 08:50 AM   #20
Tech Master
 
offroad dude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,843
Trader Rating: 25 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jzemaxx View Post
Ive also owned both the mbx6 and the tki2. Handd down the tki2 is a much better car. Does everything better. As far as arms breaking, none so far on the tki2 wc arms. The mbx6 i broke quite a few arms which are known to be a weak link on the car anyhow. Other then that both cars are solid. The mp9 is a car that has been refined over many years. Partly why AE ,HB...etc are all copying the car.
+1 on the TKI2/3. Most people on here bash the K car because of the cost. Most people are pissed because they can't afford it or just because they think it cost too much. Hands down its the most refined car on the market and is a great car, but on the other hand don't believe other cars aren't capable.

Just buy what you really want and don't worry about price or what other people say because at the end of the day, it's your money and this is just a hobby..
offroad dude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-2012, 07:06 PM   #21
Tech Master
 
8drenlnjunkE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Kennesaw, GA
Posts: 1,487
Trader Rating: 13 (100%+)
Default

I drive a mugen and my buddy drive a kyosho. My mugen seems more forgiving to mistakes, however I believe the k-car drives better. He has broken more parts then I have ( just fluke accidents). The main difference is parts availability and price. He has had to wait on back ordered parts a few times. K-car is a handling machine, it's just turns. I was a second or more faster each lap then with my own car. Check with you lhs to see if they carry either cars parts. No matter which car you choose you cant go wrong
8drenlnjunkE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-2012, 07:50 PM   #22
Tech Master
 
hookem34's Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Texas.....Y'all!
Posts: 1,793
Trader Rating: 17 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by offroad dude View Post
Just buy what you really want and don't worry about price or what other people say because at the end of the day, it's your money and this is just a hobby..
Amen brother!
__________________
Dan Culver
Companies I stand behind with my hard earned cash:
KyoshoClockwork Racing EnginesPT Racing OilsJet Lube ☆ Futaba ☆ Competition Heat ☆ Revolve RCNovarossiBuku PowerBones Motorsports
hookem34 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-2012, 08:31 PM   #23
Tech Master
 
captain america's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,425
Trader Rating: 9 (100%+)
Default

Both platforms are top-caliber. I've had them both and either one is capable of bringing home the bacon, regardless of what anyone says. What will make the difference?

-Your ability to set the car up (fine-tuning, adjustments, etc)
-Your driving technique (or lack thereof.)

Both cars have their little quirks, some people find the Moog more forgiving in its overall performance envelope, some find the K-Car more planted... All depends on your driving technique. Maintenance is about the same on either car. Any car will break if you hit something hard enough at the wrong angle, so just buy the one that speaks to you and drive it til the wheels fall off!
captain america is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-25-2012, 09:48 PM   #24
Tech Master
 
foampervert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,367
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Send a message via MSN to foampervert
Default Why get so emo?

Quote:
Originally Posted by talbotbid011 View Post
Just read the threads. to me it sucks that to buy a tki3 you have to pay 30%!!! more than the next highest priced car mugen - here the yen/dollar exchange rate might be justied as an explanation of why Japanese cars cost more. - more on that later.
In truggy the strr is 27% higher in price than the next highest priced offering (losi)
in 1/10 4wd the laser is 15 % more than the shumacher cat! This car is made in the uk where the sterling trades higher relative to the dollar (unlike the yen which is not on par with the usd) - so what is kyoshos excuse there? They cannot claim 8 1/10 4wd wc's can they?
In 1/10 buggy you can expect to pay either 17% more for a kyosho (versus the 22) or 6% less because kyosho offers two pricepoints in that class.
No competetive 1/10 truck... No competetive sedan no competetive 1/8 onroad...at least as listed by amain hobbies.
It is abundantly clear that the mp9 is kyoshos cash cow. They can bank on the fact that people will pay more because it is seen as a winning car. In it's fourth iteration now the mp9 still suffers from reliability issues - read the threads... It is almost voodoo to bring it up over there (kyosho threads)
you would think that a quality car and r&d program as they claim would have eliminated many of these issues years ago.
In short you are being fleeced by kyosho pricewise ( I have a tki2) yes it is good but what kyosho is doing is tantamount to associated charging 500 dollars for a b4 because it has won more championships than any car ( kyoshos wins combined btw)
get the mugen. Just my two cents... Verify the percentages at amain yourself if you do not believe me.
The author of this thread would like a comparison of 2 products, the reasons behind them are conjecture(in your case).

Sure, the mp9 is costlier then the mugen. If the author wanted a mp9, I'm sure it's because he can already afford it and agrees with the pricing.

Why would you go into "kyosho is fleecing people or ripping them
off" and all that? It's a product, they made it, they believe the price is commensurate with equitable quality (in design, parts or manufacture... Or whatever), and they sell it as is.
And people agree with it and buy it.
It's not like kyosho is the only buggy maker and is forcing everyone to buy it at an elevated price (that's fleecing). Consumers have a choice! I don't like to get personal and the threads should reflect constructive advice, but this sounds like you really want a kyosho and you're angry it's out of your comfort level.

Both cars are great! I've driven mugen before and I agree with the durability thing. I like the kyosho (I have 2, and it was painfully ex) and enjoy it immensely too (the build was flawless) it runs great!

I'd say mp9, if cost is not a concern cos you won't regret it. Get a mbx6 if you don't want to spend so much but still have a brilliant car.

-Alexander
__________________
During heats, i use durex for both front and rear, with Hard inserts.

Sorex, i meant Sorex.
foampervert is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2012, 01:09 PM   #25
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 123
Default I have a Kyosho sir

A
Quote:
Originally Posted by foampervert View Post
The author of this thread would like a comparison of 2 products, the reasons behind them are conjecture(in your case).

Sure, the mp9 is costlier then the mugen. If the author wanted a mp9, I'm sure it's because he can already afford it and agrees with the pricing.

Why would you go into "kyosho is fleecing people or ripping them
off" and all that? It's a product, they made it, they believe the price is commensurate with equitable quality (in design, parts or manufacture... Or whatever), and they sell it as is.
And people agree with it and buy it.
It's not like kyosho is the only buggy maker and is forcing everyone to buy it at an elevated price (that's fleecing). Consumers have a choice! I don't like to get personal and the threads should reflect constructive advice, but this sounds like you really want a kyosho and you're angry it's out of your comfort level.

Both cars are great! I've driven mugen before and I agree with the durability thing. I like the kyosho (I have 2, and it was painfully ex) and enjoy it immensely too (the build was flawless) it runs great!

I'd say mp9, if cost is not a concern cos you won't regret it. Get a mbx6 if you don't want to spend so much but still have a brilliant car.

-Alexander
Alex I have a Kyosho. My points are valid. I have made quite a bit of money as a mechanical engineer. I have an understanding of manufacturing processes.that you might also have - or not. If you did understand economies of scale then it would be clear to you that Kyosho is using their pedigree to manipulate the price. We see it all the time...you name it from nike shoes to oakley glasses the perception of the product dictates what comsumers are willimg to pay regardless of measurable performance differences.

One cannot isolate the dollar yen exchange as the reason why Kyoshos are more expensive because if that was the case then the Mugens pricing would be comparable to the Kyosho...but they manage to sell it at a price point closer to the the rest of the offerings in this respective class.

It is the responses of people like you that I have chosen to stop talking about Kyoshos because any critisism is not met objectively...instead what you have to offer is "I am pissed because I really want one but cant afford it".

Maybe it is your head (the one that should be doing the majority of your thinking) that should be contained within the Durex...
talbotbid011 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2012, 08:56 PM   #26
Tech Elite
 
merdith6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Brazoria, TX
Posts: 2,350
Trader Rating: 3 (100%+)
Default Ha

you are right.

Kyosho 1/8th buggies have hovered around a grand since the Vanning back in the 80's. Always great cars, but never worth that much money.

I do remember I managed to pick up a 7.5 and a 777 for great prices, but since the mp9 they are back up there with the turbo inferno prices.

I love Kyosho but when the mp9 came out I was like wow, eat it Kyosoho. I switched to the XRay and then the Mugen turns out to have the best price to performance ratio although not cheap you don't feel robbed every time you buy an axle or a wing. I try to save money any way i can and ebay is awesome for Mugen owners.

On the flip side I can't deny the Kyosho is a super ride, I have had their buggies since the original inferno, through the 777. Never had a big issue with any of them other than lousy setups out of the box, and some creative hacking, and the shocks still wear off the anodizing inside the shocks, there's a tough R & D problem.

I do find it funny that MP-9 racers need to hack a hole in the bottom of a 900 dollar car to clear the flywheel, and cut out the engine mounting holes to get the bell to align with the spur., that's priceless. I see not much has changed since I left. Hot bodies should send them the extra 300 dollars from stealing their designs.

Bottom line. if I was a pro driver that got free cars to race and all the support parts i would race the snot out of the kyosho, but If I'm paying for it like I do, no chance in hell. I'll stick with Mugen or Xray, simply less stuff to deal with and the clutchbell magically aligns with the spur and never hits the chassis. It's amazing. The shocks never wear out on the inside. It's magic.
__________________
Mad Dog drives a Mugen MBX-7, Novarossi engines, Clockwork Racing, Futaba radio, AKA/Proline Tires
merdith6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2012, 12:41 AM   #27
Tech Master
 
foampervert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,367
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Send a message via MSN to foampervert
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by talbotbid011 View Post
A

Alex I have a Kyosho. My points are valid. I have made quite a bit of money as a mechanical engineer. I have an understanding of manufacturing processes.that you might also have - or not. If you did understand economies of scale then it would be clear to you that Kyosho is using their pedigree to manipulate the price. We see it all the time...you name it from nike shoes to oakley glasses the perception of the product dictates what comsumers are willimg to pay regardless of measurable performance differences.

One cannot isolate the dollar yen exchange as the reason why Kyoshos are more expensive because if that was the case then the Mugens pricing would be comparable to the Kyosho...but they manage to sell it at a price point closer to the the rest of the offerings in this respective class.

It is the responses of people like you that I have chosen to stop talking about Kyoshos because any critisism is not met objectively...instead what you have to offer is "I am pissed because I really want one but cant afford it".

Maybe it is your head (the one that should be doing the majority of your thinking) that should be contained within the Durex...
I don't mean as a personal jibe, and I do actually know understand how marketing, manufacturing(I am also a mechanical engineer) and economic forces work.

What I'm saying is: kyosho has placed a product out in the market at a certain price point because of whatever reason they care to give (or whatever they think they can get away with). However, they are NOT forcing people to drive their cars! One can choose (freely) to purchase a kyosho, or not.
Also, I have absolutely no issues with people who drive other makes! My believe is that drivers make the race, the car helps.
On this note, I'll just say that anyone who has bought a kyosho, does so with the FULL knowledge that they are paying a premium, and are willing to. Not because they are forced to.
Kyosho drivers can't help if drivers of other makes, make an issue with our choices, can we? Just cos we choose Kyosho, we're either fanboys, or idiots or elitist asses? C'mon now.
If the author of this thread bought a mbx6, I'd say "go going! Welcome to off-road! Don't matter which buggy you choose, is all good?"
Let's try to keep the threads positive and helpful, in this case... To help the author make a decision on buggy makes. Negative comments just seem to make people seem bitter about their chosen hobby.

-Alexander
__________________
During heats, i use durex for both front and rear, with Hard inserts.

Sorex, i meant Sorex.
foampervert is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2012, 02:57 AM   #28
Tech Addict
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 554
Default

From someone who's driven both, I hope I can put my spin on it.

The Mugen is a bit sturdier than the mp9, however i was always chasing setup. You look at 5 of the best mugen drivers setups and you will find all of them are completely different from one another, which tells me even them guys haven't quite found the dialled base setup.
Kyosho, on the other hand has basically 90% of the cars setup remaining the same from all pro drivers from track to track. Myself, I change ride height and camber from track to track and the car just works and is fast but easy to drive.
__________________
Kev Lewis,
I'd like to thank my personal Sponsors :-AKA Tyres Australia, Ryper Hobbies and Just Hobbies
The Gear :- Associated RC8 B3 powered by OS Engines
Soapy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2012, 03:50 AM   #29
Tech Elite
 
Zerodefect's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Underground, Ohio
Posts: 4,304
Default

It may be wise to also add the Xray XB9 to this conversation.

I just finished building one. They fixed all the bugs the 808 had. Better shocks, way more suspension travel, adjustabe hinge pin bulkheads, and olde fashioned normal reliable pinion gears. (the direct pinions were sweet and light, but fragile and hard to shim)

RTR mine weighs 7.0 pounds.
Zerodefect is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2012, 04:53 AM   #30
Tech Elite
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Canada
Posts: 2,176
Default

Jared Tebo has been very good for Kyosho. Win on Sunday Sell on Monday.

Both are very good and can win any race. It's the guy setting it up and driving it. Could you see Jared Tebo driving a Mugen. It would be a interesting topic to see how this conversation would look like.

Personally I would just get the Mugen and take the money you didn"t spend and take my wife out for dinner.

The Kyosho is a dynamite car.
__________________
Team Associated, JConcepts, M2C Racing, Big Pimpin Paints
Chris Reilly is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 04:22 PM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net