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Old 02-07-2012, 07:00 PM   #31
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JQ you say on that page that you will be editing your 'what to do guide' so it fits on one or two pages. Have you done this yet and if so where can we get it.
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Old 02-07-2012, 11:15 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by 1/8scale4life View Post
Dia
This is just my 2 cents worth, but hope this helps
Tires are important, good idea to look at the local fast guys and see what they use.
Once you build your ride with the kits basic set up, you take it out to the track and it does not perform to what you would like, I usually follow these basic steps:


If going into a turn, you give it gas and the rear end slides around, losing traction, shorten the wheel base, put the rear hub carriers all the way forward.

If you come into a turn and you give it gas and the car does not want to turn, but just pushes and wants to go straight then you need a longer wheel base, put the rear hub carriers all the way back.

If you are going into a jump and the back end kicks up I usually add more rear ride height until it stops doing that.

If the car has no traction and is difficult to control, too much power, I usually go up a tooth on my clutch bell.

These are relatively easy set up changes that help dial into the tracks sweet spot. This is were I usually start and then I get into the fine tuning of my set up, camber, shock oil, diff oils, pistons, springs etc…..

This may not work for everyone and I am sure fellow racers will have differing opinions, but this is what works for me.
1/8scale4life Thank you for your reply.
I don't wish to be offensive but most replies missed the point of this thread. I'm not seeking answers to personal setup problems. I used myself as an example to illustrate why such a guide would be usefull to many readers. Instead of one posting his particular problem ,asking for sugestions,receiving a few and implementing some of them by trial and error, after having a bad race, he COULD HAVE this guide in his pit box to help him out, by identifying the most similar case to his own and giving him the steps needed in an order from the most to the least effective. Giving the reasoning of each step would be IDEAL, because that will EDUCATE racers of all levels. He could also have saved his Race Day if he had help when actually needed and learn by others experience and knowlledge.
Thanks for reading.
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Old 02-08-2012, 02:43 AM   #33
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This is the best explanation I have read in normal language:

http://users.telenet.be/elvo/




A well written in depth guide from a pro would be a great thing. Probably a good money maker for a racing company as well.

I find it odd that Huddy are the only ones that have really done anything.

As a sport, it's hard to penetrate, incredibly frustrating and a steep as hell learning curve, it's in the companies selling race gears interest to help get people rolling.

That's not to say pretty much all their guys are always willing to give advice, but you know...
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Old 02-08-2012, 07:18 AM   #34
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[QUOTE=IanWright;10295952]This is the best explanation I have read in normal language:

http://users.telenet.be/elvo/

[QUOTE]

That's a great link, one of the best guides i've ever seen.

The fact is there is no set-up change that will gain you a lap. Until you have the correct tires for the conditions, you can make all the subtle suspension changes you want but it is probably not going to make any noticable difference. If you are convinced that you have the best tires for your car and the track, then you can start fine tuning the set-up to make the tires work better for that particular track.

Generally for "club" races I don't change a whole lot set-up wise because I feel track time and tire testing is more important in a limited time.

The best advice I can give is this. Go into your racing with a plan. If it's a new track to you, research what others are running for tires. That will cut down on trying every tire in your box. If you know the track, don't try to reinvent the wheel, if I-Beams were good last time, more than likely they will be the best tire this time. obviously conditions can be a factor but you get the point.

Get some complete spares. By that I mean get a complete extra center diff and a front diff is a good thing too. That way if you feel you need to change you can just drop in the change. It's a pricey deal but build up a complete set of spare shocks, built up with different oils and/or pistons. This goes back to the planning phase, if you go to the track with 5/7/2 diff set-up, having your spare center diff built up with 5000 is a good plan

Finally, the hardest part, you as a driver have to learn to diagnose your car. Nobody else can do it for you. If you have basic understanding of what set-up changes do what. You have to learn how to apply them. Break the corners down into three segments. enterance, middle and exit. If you feel the car is not turning well, try to pinpoint where it is most offensive. Break the track down into sections as well. If it's really good through the flat, smooth chicane but horrible through the rough, off-camber section, I'd probably work on getting the car better in it's worst sections, everything has to be a compromise.
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Old 02-08-2012, 11:08 AM   #35
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Excellent. I myself am not a newbie or professional, but mediocore and would still like to learn the thigns that happen to RC cars on a non regular basis.
Ill be reviewing the site and this thread.

Thanks
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Old 02-08-2012, 01:19 PM   #36
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Learning to build your car is the first thing that ANYONE should learn. I can rebuild the front and center diff in 5 mins. (done it on race day) the rear takes few more mins because of shimming.

I just printed out the Hudy book and keep it in my box. You can read and ask online all you want, but if your not at the track practicing what you learned on YOUR vehicle, it defeats the purpose of learning it.

The biggest tip Ive learned with 1/8th Scale set up is tires...... Before I change anything, I go through tires.
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Old 02-08-2012, 07:09 PM   #37
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wow, well where does one start....????
there is a tough one....???
but if unknown to "Level of Capacity of Driving Skill"......
i would say JQ had a good baseline for looking to what to do....
the HUDY Manual is a good place for some basic ideas on what to do as well...
but Tires would be the first to do....
and the starting set up for your "Particular car or truck"

from there "Practice"...
by getting to know what the car or truck will do...???
most of the Manufactures go through a good deal of evaluation of there
cars to help make them "Neutral"........
then after driving your car for a good 10 minutes...
first practice not crashing.
i know easier said than done but really...practice "Not crashing"
even if it means not Making a jump etc. roll the jump etc.
but maintain a constant pace......
may seem slow but 99% of the time the one that doesnt crash...."Wins" more so in the early stages of the learning
curves of driving r/c cars.....
once you have the "Occasional crash" but not often...then start addressing
what can i do to go faster...????
trying different "Throttle settings" like letting off "Sooner"
or slowy rolling the throttle on "Exit"
someone could have the "Perfect Set Up" but if they are on the gas
the "Instant" the car is comming into a corner..??? could be loose
"No matter who drives it".......
as well many drivers have come to me asking where they could get more
"Power to the car" even when there car has a Nova21-4BTTS !!!
and 99% of the time they have "Too Much Power"
like in real drag racing and "On-Road" a clutch will play a big part.
a hard "Snappy Clutch" on a "Slick track" may not be a good ticket
for example for a driver "Starting out" or even for an "Experianced One"
all drivers have there "Prefferences"
for me as an "Example" i use standard 3 shoe configuration and a 1.0 spring
to "Start" but thats for me......

also a well tuned motor will make all the difference as well...
the "Little things" i think i can best say is what to look for...????
first the learning curve....i know sounds funny..???
and i have known guys for "YEARS"
and some just do not get the "Throttle Thing"
but once you hit it...it's like ...."Oh Ahhh now i get it".......
99.99999999% are bra-bra-bra-bra....30,000 times a second !!!!

and fast ones are ...B.......rr...........rrr......aaa....ppp!!!!!
rolling onto the throttle........
same applies for the "Electric" if not more cause the power is "Instant" !!!!

and "Slow is Fast".........most for example will overshoot a corner...
like a real car if "Entering too fast" the car will "Push" because
it's comming in too fast for the "General Physics" to work "Properly"
propper EPA adjustments to your car will help as well

but as where to really give a good advice for set ups...???
with over 6 Billion people you'll find 12 Trillion set ups....LOL
but i would start as i do with many that come to me....

first "Tires for the track at Hand" this will be the biggest.

then start with the Manufactures set up for the Car your Using.

"Practice" getting around the track if even "Slow"
and even if everyone is Trippling a jump try "Doubling" it instead.....

try "Concentraiting Rolling the Throttle" instead of what i call
"Light Switch Throttle Responce"
(the 30,000 times a second bliping the throttle)

can also take notice in this "Listen" dont watch as much but "Listen"
to the "Fast Guys"......then Watch where there throttling on the track...

the little things i think can help the most.......
maybe this helped..?? maybe made it worse...??
but i hope it helped some........



but, your "Average" neutral set up be something like 5-5-3 for diffs.
but run baseline settings of car first.....Droop,shock settings,toe,camber etc.

1 to 2 deg of toe out.....
2 deg camber front and rear......
stock settings for your shocks......
need the car less wild..?? (depending on Driver) go 5 to 10 lbs
higher in front shock oils...for "Example" 35 or 40 in front and a 30 or a 27.5
in the rears...
run track....practice throttle..........
if steering is like if you look at the wheel it turns...(best i can discribe?)
go little less toe out......and add a little camber....
wont make as "Aggressive Entering Corner" but with added Camber
can maintain steering in the Middle.......
but this is dependant on "Driver".......
and Chassis ride height level front and rear....for "Example"
and depends on car kit your using...?? but say 27mm front and 27mm rear.

and basics for diffs...need less steering on entering go a little higher in front diff.
say a 7-5-3 this will help on exit steering...so when you stab the throttle
wher the car is "Pointing" that's where it's going......
rasing the center diff will also increase steering
giving the car even more of a 4wd effect...lighter oils are best when a track
is Rutty(holes going Down)
going up say 7 to 10 would be when there is a good amount of traction
and you would want the car to "Rotate" for Example......
but there is allot more.....all most too much to list...???

here is a video of an example of "Slow is Fast"
hope some of all this can help....


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVmLK...7&feature=plcp
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Old 02-09-2012, 07:46 PM   #38
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I just changed class and after a year or so out, so I feel like a n00b.

One of the things i am having issues with in a new class is not actually knowing how much is in set up and how much is in driving. I have been messing with set up but have no real comparison to how the car should drive.

The easy answer is "drive fast guys car" but the problem starts with they probably use a different transmitter with settings suiting them.


It's hard to start out racing, it's easy to forget... I know I had.


(Answer is now I can get a reasonable lap time out of it, I am going to drive the crap out of it before messing again.)
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Old 02-10-2012, 04:47 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IanWright View Post
I just changed class and after a year or so out, so I feel like a n00b.

One of the things i am having issues with in a new class is not actually knowing how much is in set up and how much is in driving. I have been messing with set up but have no real comparison to how the car should drive.

The easy answer is "drive fast guys car" but the problem starts with they probably use a different transmitter with settings suiting them.


It's hard to start out racing, it's easy to forget... I know I had.


(Answer is now I can get a reasonable lap time out of it, I am going to drive the crap out of it before messing again.)
When the car is easy for you to drive around the track at race pace and is predictable, that is your setup. Following the fast guy setup isn't necessarily the best thing for a normal driver to do. They need the car to be more planted and react slightly slower than a world champion's setup.
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Old 02-10-2012, 05:04 AM   #40
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I kind of identify with Ian. I don't race all that seriously.. But when I read for ex. the RC8.2 thread, and people are talking about diff oil changes of 1,000 making these huge differences, or half a degree of this, shock pistons that, etc.., one, I'm kind of put off by the obsessiveness of the details of it, and two, I'm kind of skeptical - at least, for a more Joe Average kind of racer who's not sponsored and never will be and who just wants to have fun but still compete against people more or less at his own level.. So yeah, where's the line between constantly nit-picking the details to get some theoretically "perfect" setup, and just adapting to the car as is once you throw it on the track..(unless of course something is obviously way off..)?..
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Old 02-10-2012, 12:40 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by Racerx336 View Post
When the car is easy for you to drive around the track at race pace and is predictable, that is your setup. Following the fast guy setup isn't necessarily the best thing for a normal driver to do. They need the car to be more planted and react slightly slower than a world champion's setup.
Very true, I tried a couple of quick guys setups, was good and better in alot of ways but had to make a couple of changes to settle it down a bit, as you said make it more predictable.
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Old 02-10-2012, 01:13 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by 1BLADE1 View Post
and i have known guys for "YEARS"
and some just do not get the "Throttle Thing"
but once you hit it...it's like ...."Oh Ahhh now i get it".......
99.99999999% are bra-bra-bra-bra....30,000 times a second !!!!

and fast ones are ...B.......rr...........rrr......aaa....ppp!!!!!
rolling onto the throttle........
same applies for the "Electric" if not more cause the power is "Instant" !!!!


try "Concentraiting Rolling the Throttle" instead of what i call
"Light Switch Throttle Responce"
(the 30,000 times a second bliping the throttle)

can also take notice in this "Listen" dont watch as much but "Listen"
to the "Fast Guys"......then Watch where there throttling on the track...
One of the quick guys at my track pointed this out to me,rolling the throttle also said to slow down a bit, the following week I took heed of what he said and my lap times tumbled, knocked about 3sec off a lap, not to mention alot more consistant in lap times too,I think it was a combo of my better throttle control and also starting to get my car dialed with a couple of setup changes.
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Old 02-11-2012, 12:58 PM   #43
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Short and simple: Most racers over drive their cars. Slow down!

Our business tutors drivers, sets up cars, builds and maintains them for our customers.

The very first lesson is to make our students drive laps with cones in the corner. The cones are situated to where the car they are driving will barely fit through (Car and a half width) between the cone and the pipe at the natural apex. . This causes the driver to slow down way before they normally do and "control" the car through the corner. This promotes, brake control, throttle control, concentration and of course steering control.

Most drivers in 1/8 after 20 laps or so will improve their lap time by 2 seconds!
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