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Old 08-03-2010, 03:29 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by zixxer View Post
bart no offense but did you even read my post ? i think it went something like this ...get the arm as close as you can by adjusting the linkage ...then use the subtrim to dial it in ...if you are running the subtrim at 30 points then something else is not adjusted right ....which is why people run 30 points of subtrim ...they dont have there linkage set right ...im not about going back and fourth about it ..there is a right way and a wrong way to do it ....30 points of subtrim is the wrong way ...im sure there are instances when there is no other options ...but im quite sure if you were to ask the top drivers of these cars ...they would probably say that 30 points of sub trim is way to much and is obviously masking another adjustment thats out of whack ...like i say just my opinion and im sure there would be cases where it might be justified ...but not in my world
I agree with zixxer on this. I adjust the rod that connects
to the servo, instead of using the radio. I even did this before
I owned a set-up station. If my trim and sub-trim isn't set to
zero, I'm not happy with my set-up.
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Old 08-03-2010, 03:29 PM   #47
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Ok lets illustrate this.

This is how i want it to look: []=

This is how the servo arm looks due to the spline not being 100% perfect: // of course not at such an extreme angle but you get the point. If i move it one spline down it looks like this: \\ which is obviously not where i want it either. The only way to get it perfect at 90 degrees from the servo is to use subtrim.

No amount of linkage adjustment will get my servo horn at 90 degrees because it does not control the servo angle, it controls the relation of the servo horn to the servo saver and thus the throw of my steering. What i was asking is it ok to have it off center and adjust the linkage to compensate for the servo arm being off center.

The only way to get the servo horn to be perfectly centered is subtrim. Or you can open up the servo and adjust the gears, but to me this doesn't seem like a great idea. So its either use subtrim to center the horn or adjust the gears of the servo, there is no other way to get the servo horn at 90 degrees.

This topic has gotten way too complicated for what originally started out as a fairly simple question. I have found my answer: Use subtrim unless you want to open up the servo and adjust the gears.
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Old 08-03-2010, 03:32 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by rageworks View Post
I agree with zixxer on this. I adjust the rod that connects
to the servo, instead of using the radio. I even did this before
I owned a set-up station. If my trim and sub-trim isn't set to
zero, I'm not happy with my set-up.
If this is the case then you are either running with the servo arm not at 90 degrees (or have a perfect servo arm) or you manually adjusted the gears inside the servo to accomplish the perfect servo arm angle. Theres no other way around it. You either have a perfect servo (wether by chance or by force) or you don't have your servo arm at a perfect 90 degrees from the servo. Otherwise you have no choice but to use subtrim.
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Old 08-03-2010, 03:38 PM   #49
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subtrim is for centering your horn to the servo(KO setup guide) ,while all settings are 0, of coarse you try to get as close to 90 degrees as possible and dont want to go over board but it is only 1 spline, one way or the other, depending on the horn and servo brands, then linkage is for making horn parallel to servo saver,(look at any manual it will say the horn and saver should be parallel) , slightly off 90 degrees can be 20-30 points one way or the other and wont affect your total throws
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Old 08-03-2010, 03:38 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwm2 View Post
Ok lets illustrate this.

This is how i want it to look: []=

This is how the servo arm looks due to the spline not being 100% perfect: // of course not at such an extreme angle but you get the point. If i move it one spline down it looks like this: \\ which is obviously not where i want it either. The only way to get it perfect at 90 degrees from the servo is to use subtrim.

No amount of linkage adjustment will get my servo horn at 90 degrees because it does not control the servo angle, it controls the relation of the servo horn to the servo saver and thus the throw of my steering. What i was asking is it ok to have it off center and adjust the linkage to compensate for the servo arm being off center.

The only way to get the servo horn to be perfectly centered is subtrim. Or you can open up the servo and adjust the gears, but to me this doesn't seem like a great idea. So its either use subtrim to center the horn or adjust the gears of the servo, there is no other way to get the servo horn at 90 degrees.

This topic has gotten way too complicated for what originally started out as a fairly simple question. I have found my answer: Use subtrim unless you want to open up the servo and adjust the gears.
You must have missed Zixxers and my posts. It is simple.
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Old 08-03-2010, 03:58 PM   #51
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I understand your question as ive thought about this quite a bit too. As far as torque at certain sub trim levels vs 0 I came to the conclusion that a servo is simply an electric motor spinning gears, there is no internal mechanical limits inside the servo itself therefore wherever its at via subtrim is going to produce equal power no matter where the gears inside are positioned
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Old 08-03-2010, 04:47 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by neobart View Post
I use both subtrim and adjust the linkages. Subtrim doesn't affect the the EPA settings, that's the beauty of it, normal trim does however. I put my steering horn on as close 90 degrees as possible and then adjust it to 90 with subtrim, then I adjust the linkage to get my wheels centered while making sure the two steering arms are equal length. Last step is adjusting the EPA, I hold the steering at full lock and add EPA till the servo starts buzzing, then back off till it doesn't buzz anymore. This gives me the most amount of steering without overworking the servo.
Bingo. This is almost exactly the method I use.

Also, a servo will develop full torque, evenly from lock to lock.
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Old 08-03-2010, 05:12 PM   #53
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we can't be done with this!

This thread is still shorter than the "how to stop your engine" one

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Old 08-03-2010, 05:29 PM   #54
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I agree with everybody
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Old 08-03-2010, 05:35 PM   #55
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You must have missed Zixxers and my posts. It is simple.
+1
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Old 08-03-2010, 05:36 PM   #56
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I agree with everybody

my man thats what im talking about ..everybody will have a different opinion this threads got legs son
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Old 08-03-2010, 05:38 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by jwm2 View Post
Ok lets illustrate this.

This is how i want it to look: []=

This is how the servo arm looks due to the spline not being 100% perfect: // of course not at such an extreme angle but you get the point. If i move it one spline down it looks like this: \\ which is obviously not where i want it either. The only way to get it perfect at 90 degrees from the servo is to use subtrim.

No amount of linkage adjustment will get my servo horn at 90 degrees because it does not control the servo angle, it controls the relation of the servo horn to the servo saver and thus the throw of my steering. What i was asking is it ok to have it off center and adjust the linkage to compensate for the servo arm being off center.

The only way to get the servo horn to be perfectly centered is subtrim. Or you can open up the servo and adjust the gears, but to me this doesn't seem like a great idea. So its either use subtrim to center the horn or adjust the gears of the servo, there is no other way to get the servo horn at 90 degrees.

This topic has gotten way too complicated for what originally started out as a fairly simple question. I have found my answer: Use subtrim unless you want to open up the servo and adjust the gears.
nope your not gettin off that easy ...adjust the linkage as good as you can get it ...then use subtrim to fine tune it like you want
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Old 08-03-2010, 07:26 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by zixxer View Post
nope your not gettin off that easy ...adjust the linkage as good as you can get it ...then use subtrim to fine tune it like you want
LOL. Done and done. Linkages are perfect, servo is perfect, spline is perfect and servo arm is perfect. You should have just told me that in the beginning
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Old 08-03-2010, 08:01 PM   #59
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On the AE models....after your mechanical adjustments are spent...use subtrim to assure your first linkage hits the servo body both fore and aft at full tilt.

Back 'er down a tad from there with EPA and that's all you get.

This really isn't rocket science, gentlemen...

Your main trim is best kept at zero...you adjust steering center with a WRENCH.

Last edited by cordarrow; 08-04-2010 at 10:20 AM. Reason: added content
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Old 01-31-2011, 08:17 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by zixxer View Post
i would be willing to bet that anyone here that races on a regular basis will tell you that if you are using 30 points of sub trim you are way off ...whats your sub trim at 40 everybody has there own opinion ..but i dont know anyone that races that suggests to use 30+points on your subtrim ...im just sayin
Just depends on servo splines and radio resolution, my futabas take a 10 steps to center and my jr's take 43 steps on a m11x, again 23 vs 25 spline and the sub trim is there to center the horn to the servo and then you fine tune your linkage, and all cars are different.
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