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Old 07-14-2010, 08:50 AM   #1
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Default Is it the engine or is it the clutch??

When I first put my 1/8 scale buggy on the track it has a lot of snap/punch on the low end but once its warmed up after a few laps the snap/punch is not like it was its a lot milder. I'm running the Werks B5 and the Jammin red aluminum clutch shoes and the 1.1 springs that came with the clutch shoes. The motor has a little over a half gallon through it so I'm thinking that maybe its the clutch??
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Old 07-14-2010, 09:00 AM   #2
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is your tune good? maybe the low end is to lean and its lean bogging?
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Old 07-14-2010, 09:06 AM   #3
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1.1 springs dont last long, your lucky usually they break.... replace with 1.0, if they dont have enough stall for your liking, lighten the shoes by drilling or dremel
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Old 07-14-2010, 09:15 AM   #4
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Default So true

Both of those answers are correct. It could be your engine loosing power with being lean on bottom or top, but mostly bottom. and 1.1 clutch springs are causing the clutch to heat up. 1.0 springs are the ticket....Great answers guys.....
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Old 07-14-2010, 09:22 AM   #5
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Tony is right. And the B5 has a ton of bottom so 1.0 springs are the highest stall you probably want. The shoes can be getting hot and not grabbing. But that is not your only issue I think.

Odds are pretty high it's your tune like Tallyram said. It is easy to get the bottom too lean especially if you are tuning it cold. Take it out and warm it till like you said, you don't have bottom snap and then bring her in a fatten/rich the bottom 2 hours. if it's better then you are going the right direction, and might even need more. Could also be reverse of that and be too fat which means doing the same thing in reverse to lean it some.

check If your clutch bell is discoloring due to heat as well.

There's a Great B5 tuning guide in the B5 thread. And the Company owner (Werks/Ron) is always on there to help people.

Good Luck.
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Old 07-14-2010, 09:37 AM   #6
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i used to run 1.0 springs then i switched to 1.1 but i am going back to 1.0 cause they didnt give me any trouble
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Old 07-14-2010, 10:24 AM   #7
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the red shoes are jammins lightest shoe... so 1.1 springs is to much.. i think its your clucth heating up because of slipping to much.. i normally run the silver jammin shoes with 1.1 springs and they work great..
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Old 07-14-2010, 12:17 PM   #8
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Thanks everyone for the tips/advice!

I'm definetly not an expert but I don't ever try to tune a cold engine. I just pulled the clutch the other day and everything looked okay. I don't have the springs/clutch in front of me so I'm assuming the black springs are the 1.0(softer)?

I have noticed that sometimes when the fuel is getting a little low in tank and I go through this double double section and when I land on the back side of the first set and burp the throttle to get over the next set it initially bogs a little so maybe my LS is to lean or is that just the results of a low fuel level in the tank because when I have a full tank or even a 1/4 tank it does not do it?
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Old 07-14-2010, 01:05 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by engr673 View Post
Thanks everyone for the tips/advice!

I'm definetly not an expert but I don't ever try to tune a cold engine. I just pulled the clutch the other day and everything looked okay. I don't have the springs/clutch in front of me so I'm assuming the black springs are the 1.0(softer)?

I have noticed that sometimes when the fuel is getting a little low in tank and I go through this double double section and when I land on the back side of the first set and burp the throttle to get over the next set it initially bogs a little so maybe my LS is to lean or is that just the results of a low fuel level in the tank because when I have a full tank or even a 1/4 tank it does not do it?
Exactly. When the tank gets low the engine runs a little leaner, that's why it's important to tune just a bit on the rich side to account for the changing tune as the tank gets low. The bottom end is usually changed in very small increments. So just give it an hour on bottom or even 1/2 hour. If it feels like it's loading up or going to stall, you might try leaving the bottom alone and richen the top just to try it out. Sometimes the lean top can heat the engine up and so when you need the power at the end of a tank it's loosing bottom end punch. Try both ways....then you will know.....
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Old 07-14-2010, 07:16 PM   #10
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One your engine is still very new, which is going to make a little harder to tune BUT to take out all the guess work. Change the clutch and richen all needles and and start over. Once you've done that run your can for a little bit and tune from there. A little work but I'd rather do the work than buy a new B5.

Hopefully you have some idea of how to tune a motor which 95% of us DONT and two try and listen for a slipping clutch. "Sounds like metal vibrating very slight" Your going to have to develop an ear for it, much like a well tuned motor.
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Old 07-14-2010, 08:07 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 99problems View Post
One your engine is still very new. which is going to make a little harder to tune BUT to take out all the guess work. Change the clutch and richen all needles and and start over. Once you've done that run your can for a little bit and tune from there. A little work but I'd rather do the work than buy a new B5.

Hopefully you have some idea of how to tune a motor which 95% of us DONT and two try and listen for a slipping clutch. "Sounds like metal vibrating very slight" Your going to have to develop an ear for it, much like a well tuned motor.
+1 and off the topic hows the new track workin for ya
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Old 07-14-2010, 08:22 PM   #12
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Ur tune is off when it gets warm it leans out go back to factory settings and start back over and 1.0 springs will help just as mentioned before. give that a try and let us now how it goes.
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Old 07-14-2010, 09:24 PM   #13
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Uh.... After reading the post I'm curious. I have an RTR RC8T with the stock .28 motor. I'm noticing my top end really isn't where it needs to be. (not that this motor will be great) I have the stock shoes and springs and the engine seems to rev well but doesn't "pull" on top. Well I had noticed that the bell has heat discoloration. I didn't know if it should or not. (still new) From what I'm hearing I'm assuming my clutch is just slipping. If this is the case what spring/shoe setup should I use? Also, I'm saving for a B5 now. Is there a setup I could use for both?? If not what should I get for when my B5 comes? I'm not too worried about this motor... just want it to last till my B5 gets here hopefully!

On a side note: I was wondering what that weird sound I kept hearing was.... Sounded just like you said... vibrating metal.....

Cheap parts that work well please. Work is slow and I'm having enough bad luck as it is with these things!
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Old 07-14-2010, 09:43 PM   #14
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If your clutch bell is discoloured, then your clutch is certainly slipping under load. I run the 4 shoe M2C clutch with 1.0 springs, and soft shoes, and the shoes will last 4 gallons with little maintenance. I used to run hard shoes, but with my Clockworks modded mills, a hard shoe would initially slip before the shoes grabbed, leaving slag on the bell, and causing the hard shoes to wear faster than the soft shoes I currently run. A soft shoe will slip less, and wear better if you have a high-power mill.
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Old 07-14-2010, 10:11 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Do-Over View Post
Uh.... After reading the post I'm curious. I have an RTR RC8T with the stock .28 motor. I'm noticing my top end really isn't where it needs to be. (not that this motor will be great) I have the stock shoes and springs and the engine seems to rev well but doesn't "pull" on top. Well I had noticed that the bell has heat discoloration. I didn't know if it should or not. (still new) From what I'm hearing I'm assuming my clutch is just slipping. If this is the case what spring/shoe setup should I use? Also, I'm saving for a B5 now. Is there a setup I could use for both?? If not what should I get for when my B5 comes? I'm not too worried about this motor... just want it to last till my B5 gets here hopefully!

On a side note: I was wondering what that weird sound I kept hearing was.... Sounded just like you said... vibrating metal.....

Cheap parts that work well please. Work is slow and I'm having enough bad luck as it is with these things!
The AE clutch is one of my all time favorite clutches..... I ran alum shoes and 1.0 springs and it was dialed..... just alittle spendy was my only complaint. If you have a RTR its most likely got carbon shoes in there (which you probably wore out breaking the engine in)

replace them

also if your center diff out out of oil or light on oil it will blow all your power out the front tires, watch them next time your at the track, that will make it feel lazy accelerating also
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