R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Nitro Off-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 04-09-2010, 11:54 AM   #316
Tech Elite
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 2,854
Trader Rating: 19 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pdmustgt View Post
IF it wasn't a gain in performance then why the push going to it. Why the change to the cab forward design and testing that show slight gain in track times??????????????????? Theres a reason why Losi used this designed with the 2.0 buggy
I am sure the body helps in "theory" but off road is far from precise racing like touring cars for instance. Claiming anyone thing is shaving a tenth or two off lap times in off road is a very specious argument as there are way too many variables that come in to play - traction, wind, jumps, other racers, weather, etc.

The reality is that these bodies aren't going to be the difference between Joe Racer being in the A main or pulling up the rear in the E main, nor are they really going to change anything for the top drivers.

We aren't talking cab forward bodies versus using a Slash body or a School Bus body.
__________________
Cars I've Owned: Tekno EB48 & SCT410, AE 8.2e, AE SC10 4x4, MBX6e Tekno V4, Xray 808e, Xray 8Te, Losi 810e, Losi SCTE 4x4, Losi 22, Hot Bodies Ve8, Losi 8te, and plenty of Traxxas

Sponsors: Visa, Mastercard, Amex, and my wife's bank account.
Edumakated is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2010, 12:30 PM   #317
Tech Champion
 
JAMMINKRAZY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Posts: 6,575
Trader Rating: 17 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by allan42r View Post
bahaaa. i hear roar is going to ban some of the drivers because they are getting to fat and they dont look like a race car driver.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shuming View Post
NO NO NO - they will be required to race in a racing suit. And the fat drivers that cant fit into a ROAR approved suit will be DQed.....
Hahahahahaha

Sounds like ROAR to me.
__________________
-Koby Kubrin-
Thanks to my Sponsors:
Serpent America | Team Novarossi | Desoto Racing | Race AKA | Ridgeway Bodies
JAMMINKRAZY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2010, 12:56 PM   #318
Tech Addict
 
mattozx6rr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 583
Trader Rating: 15 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pdmustgt View Post
IF it wasn't a gain in performance then why the push going to it. Why the change to the cab forward design and testing that show slight gain in track times??????????????????? Theres a reason why Losi used this designed with the 2.0 buggy
I run both bodies old and new on my mbx5t. only difference is my motor runs about 5 degrees cooler with the punisher due to better airflow to the motor.
If you want to equate that to faster lap times than fine do it but the proofs in the pudding, my times are no better either way. Cab forward is my favorite body to run. looks more like a truck minus the number plackards on the side which were stupid and ugly anyway IMO. When was the last time you went to a race and a spectator actually said "wow those look real"?...........never for me. They are more impressed by how fast the truggys are and the rediculous air they are capable of getting. Judging from where the truggy class is going in real off road, none of the current bodies let alone the truggys available should qualify as "realistic".

Yes I have a roar card but only because a few of the tracks I run at require it for insurance purposes. I Have not and will not run in a roar sanctioned event as I dont personally agree with some of the rules. So in the end It may or may not matter what I think but I share my opinion anyways, take it or leave it.
__________________
1 X MBX6T plus 21-4c
Twisted Bones R/C apparel
mattozx6rr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2010, 01:06 PM   #319
Tech Addict
 
mattozx6rr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 583
Trader Rating: 15 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pdmustgt View Post
IF it wasn't a gain in performance then why the push going to it. Why the change to the cab forward design and testing that show slight gain in track times??????????????????? Theres a reason why Losi used this designed with the 2.0 buggy
I run both bodies old and new on my mbx5t. only difference is my motor runs about 5 degrees cooler with the punisher due to better airflow to the motor.
If you want to equate that to faster lap times than fine do it but the proofs in the pudding, my times are no better either way. Cab forward is my favorite body to run. looks more like a truck minus the number plackards on the side which were stupid and ugly anyway IMO. When was the last time you went to a race and a spectator actually said "wow those look real"?...........never for me. They are more impressed by how fast the truggys are and the rediculous air they are capable of getting. Judging from where the truggy class is going in real off road, none of the current bodies let alone the truggys available should qualify as "realistic".

Yes I have a roar card but only because a few of the tracks I run at require it for insurance purposes. I Have not and will not run in a roar sanctioned event as I dont personally agree with some of the rules. So in the end It may or may not matter what I think but I share my opinion anyways, take it or leave it.
__________________
1 X MBX6T plus 21-4c
Twisted Bones R/C apparel
mattozx6rr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2010, 10:58 PM   #320
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 855
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Edumakated View Post
I am sure the body helps in "theory" but off road is far from precise racing like touring cars for instance. Claiming anyone thing is shaving a tenth or two off lap times in off road is a very specious argument as there are way too many variables that come in to play - traction, wind, jumps, other racers, weather, etc.

The reality is that these bodies aren't going to be the difference between Joe Racer being in the A main or pulling up the rear in the E main, nor are they really going to change anything for the top drivers.

We aren't talking cab forward bodies versus using a Slash body or a School Bus body.
The god of R/C speaks again.

Are you joking who in there right mind is say it that it made me so much faster I went from E main to winning A mains get real. This just like everytime poeple changes car brand I went from B to A main now. How do you know what the difference in lap times? I also understand so many things come in play in lap times. I do take what is said with grain of salt. But I do see with cab forward design helps with down force in the front should add more steering in the front.
pdmustgt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2010, 11:25 PM   #321
Tech Prophet
 
tc5 man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: levittown pa
Posts: 16,873
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pdmustgt View Post
The god of R/C speaks again.

Are you joking who in there right mind is say it that it made me so much faster I went from E main to winning A mains get real. This just like everytime poeple changes car brand I went from B to A main now. How do you know what the difference in lap times? I also understand so many things come in play in lap times. I do take what is said with grain of salt. But I do see with cab forward design helps with down force in the front should add more steering in the front.




with the foward cab design i can see, how that would add more steering but will you see it in your, lap times no not really lol. thats why i think its funny that roar is having that rule. and no i dont race at roar events.
tc5 man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2010, 10:22 AM   #322
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sheboygan Falls, WI
Posts: 1,372
Trader Rating: 9 (91%+)
Default

I think prolone should get a coach builder to build a full size version of a buggy with a bulldog body, then they should have maifield drive it to the nats and park it in front of prolines booth for the week.

Most of you complaining here dont get it and alot of you just dont like the body, so what, I dont like the cowboys but I dont think they should be banned from the nfl.

As for the stament, r4ead it closely, think about it, read it agian and see what it really says,

"Too many manufacturers have exercised too must creative license regarding the aforementioned"

too many companys have become to creative now tell me do you really want somebody to tell companys that they cannot be to creative? If thats the case set a standard one make body and get it over with.
interplanet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2010, 11:16 AM   #323
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 203
Default

its going to be a battle between ROAR and manufactures. Lets see who wins - the companies that WE buy everything from OR roar.



Pro-Line; a company with an enviable racing pedigree, countless national titles, wins and World Championships confirm the company's long term dedication to 1/8 buggy racing. In recent times though PL have had more of a fight on their hands; their classic rival JConcepts has always kept them on their toes - with hindsight a beneficial rivalry for both. But since the arrival of AKA and Losi's own tyres, PL have seen their market strength threatened; the low point, a disappointing buggy result at the 2009 ROAR Nats put in harsh light when compared with the all Pro-Line ROAR final just 2 years earlier. In particular Losi's apparent tyre advance was impressive in such a short space of time, perhaps prompting the infamous, "The nationals would be the last race the Losi team used other brand tyres." - ok so this has backfired a bit and in recent events the Losi boys have seen their results improve on non in-house rubber.

Case in point Neo2010; Adam Drake and Mike Truhe attended to much success and used Pro-Line tyres throughout the event, they tested a few other tyres but settled for Revolvers for the main event; handing Pro-Line a 1,2,3,4 finish and contributing to 8 out of 15 finalists on PL rubber. Eventual winner Yannick Aigoin used the new Procircuit tyres through quali but won the event on Pro-Lines. What is perhaps more telling though is Ryan Maifield's decision to opt for PL tyres a few times during the event; he did run JConcepts the majority of the qualifying but PL for the final; ever the fair racer Ryan was open and honest about it, likewise his Silver State win; possibly having seen team mate Ryan Cavalieri win back to back events with the same equipment albeit different tyres and engine could play an important factor. One should recognise that some tyre brands, compounds and treads work better than others depending on the conditions; looking forward to the Worlds in November PL are in a great position with bags of knowledge about the track from the likes of Hara, and if we make a loose comparison between the Neo2010 track and Pattaya, the track surface in terms of hardness (like tarmac - super hard packed) could bode well for PL come November...

The Body-gate Debate


Pro-Line first unveiled their 'Bulldog' style buggy body on March 11th, see article, less than two weeks later, ROAR (the N.American governing body) came down very hard on this new style 'cab forward' buggy body (see article) - and again clarified their ruling a few days ago (see article). There are a few things to get out of the way first; the bodies below have all existed prior to the ROAR ruling, but ROAR specify, "Buggy and truck bodies used in ROAR-sanctioned events should resemble those used in full scale off-road and stadium racing. Sedans, out-of-scale truck, and van bodies are prohibited.. Perhaps the catalyst for the movement of the cab forwards was the Losi; body revisions have seen a more pronounced windshield/cab area - Original Losi 8ight body, 8ight 2.0 body and now the EU edition body - its fair to say there a trend can be seen.


Clockwise from top: The bodies of the 8ight 2.0 EU, GS CLX, Team Durango DNX408 and new LRP buggy.

We do wonder what benefit there is to gain from rendering the new style bodies illegal on the grounds that they do not fall within the spirit of a decades-old rule in the rulebook. One point of debate is 1/8 buggy has boomed in the last decade, why not let it develop further without restraint but within guidelines. Sadly though there may be further factors hidden under the murky waters; not so long ago there was the dispute Pro-Line had with ROAR over legality of wider tyres, could this have laid some of the groundwork and motivated ROAR to move so quickly after the bodys introduction ? What will ROAR make of JConcepts' radical stealth fighter style body ? going for the sharp angular line approach one wonders how ROAR will react. Understandably the companies whose bodies are under scrutiny have kept quiet on the matter, opting not to comment and inflame the situation.

We do get the feeling this matter is far from over, and may turn quite messy, in fact rumours reached us that a similar incident to this flared up when Losi introduced their 8ight body a couple of years ago; talk of nationals boycotts etc seem an overreaction and at this point that story is hearsay but there is an cheeky old saying; where there's smoke, there's fire... This issue has the potential to damage the relationships between some companies and ROAR, possibly even alienate them which is not a good thing for the hobby.
__________________
I'm not sponsored so it does not matter what I put here.
Shuming is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2010, 11:46 AM   #324
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sheboygan Falls, WI
Posts: 1,372
Trader Rating: 9 (91%+)
Default

that was a good read, where was it from?
interplanet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2010, 11:48 AM   #325
Tech Elite
 
kgombe's Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,177
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Default

neo buggy
kgombe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2010, 12:22 PM   #326
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sheboygan Falls, WI
Posts: 1,372
Trader Rating: 9 (91%+)
Default

front page heh! dont know how I missed that. not the quickest in the world.

No matter what companys all across the board have spent alot of time and effort on these bodies, the proline is just the one being brought to the forefront. The manufacturers are not going to stop now just because roar outlaws them for there races, infact so far I can only see this hurting roar, and most importantly our hobby.



Also I hope its not the case but more and more it seems like ROAR is making Proline the whipping dog out of a vendetta, what a shame.
interplanet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2010, 12:30 PM   #327
Tech Master
 
Bigedmond's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,837
Trader Rating: 18 (100%+)
Default

Here is Levi Jacksons Bulldog Buggy right before his Amain at this past weekends JBRL. the Body is really nice, Proline knocked it out of the park.
Attached Thumbnails
ROAR new body rules-img_0153%5B1%5D.jpg   ROAR new body rules-img_0154%5B1%5D.jpg  
Bigedmond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2010, 12:45 PM   #328
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sheboygan Falls, WI
Posts: 1,372
Trader Rating: 9 (91%+)
Default

In the "spirit" of fairness, and I use spirit lightly here, this is a list of other designs that should be banned from roar competion as well, for being cab forward or to far off the mark.

losi 8ight 2.0
losi 8ight-e 2.0
losi 8ight 2.0 eu
Hot Bodies VE-8
Team Durango DNX408
the new lrp
proline slipstream 8ight-e
proline bulldog RC8
proline bulldog D8
bitty design losi 8ight
jc concepts punisher shells, right now its only a prototype for the rc8 but you know they are going to make it for alot of other cars as well, same goes for the bulldog
jc concepts illusion hot bodies ve8
bitty design fighter 8ight

now again I am not for the rules that roar has imposed, but some of you that are might want to take a look at that list and see if your body is on there
interplanet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2010, 12:56 PM   #329
Tech Prophet
 
tc5 man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: levittown pa
Posts: 16,873
Default

boy im glad that i dont go to roar events, just because of a rule like this lol.
but hey at club races its, a free for all on what bodies you can run.

but i do agree that i doesnt help, the public image of our sport with the companies and roar urging.
tc5 man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2010, 12:59 PM   #330
Tech Elite
 
kgombe's Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,177
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Default

how is the DNX and the Ve8 cab forward.. they are just very low profile bodies...

you forgot 1... the GS storm CLX or the TQ evo... that body is a cab forward... as a matter of fact... very similar to the bulldog
kgombe is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
ROAR 4wd SCT rules posted OWTKAST cpt Electric Off-Road 724 03-04-2010 04:33 AM
Where are the ROAR New Approvals? bvoltz Electric On-Road 201 11-23-2006 09:35 AM
ROAR On Road Rules Discussion TimPotter Chat Lounge 126 03-21-2006 02:19 PM
New Body from Protoform "NEMESIS" Bon Ramat Electric On-Road 45 06-30-2004 03:38 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 09:54 AM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net