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Old 01-19-2010, 11:21 PM   #1
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Default High Down Force Wings

Do some of the aftermarket wings help with keeping the front end up when in the air on a Losi T2.0. i have the LOSA 8130. Sometimes, I don't want to throttle on a big jump in mid air to keep the nose up.

Do you find that maybe a jconcepts or ofna wing help keep the nose up more in mid air. ie. JCI0113B or the PRO6023-03 or OFN40906
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Old 01-20-2010, 04:29 AM   #2
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Originally Posted by dnebout View Post
Do some of the aftermarket wings help with keeping the front end up when in the air on a Losi T2.0. i have the LOSA 8130. Sometimes, I don't want to throttle on a big jump in mid air to keep the nose up.

Do you find that maybe a jconcepts or ofna wing help keep the nose up more in mid air. ie. JCI0113B or the PRO6023-03 or OFN40906
Hmmm... aerodynamics principles say the best wing readily available is the stock wing for the Associated buggy.

Most wings have a "lip" on the bottom of the front. Most of the downforce actually comes from the BOTTOM of the wing if it has a proper shape- that lip trips the airflow and destroys that lift. The Associated wing doesn't have that lip- just a smooth shape. Much better aerodynamically. It is more like a wing and less like a parachute than the others. Does it have the most downforce? I don't know... you'd have to test it in a wind tunnel. Does it have the best lift-drag ratio? You bet!
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Old 01-20-2010, 05:21 AM   #3
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hay Dave I'm using the Jconcepts HD on my truggy right now
I like the way they look but I like the AE wings I have some
extras come see me and you can check one out if you like.
in fact I will be at the track to night
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Old 01-20-2010, 08:46 AM   #4
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hay Dave I'm using the Jconcepts HD on my truggy right now
I like the way they look but I like the AE wings I have some
extras come see me and you can check one out if you like.
in fact I will be at the track to night
Cool Cary. Maybe I can test it out. I may or may not make it tonight. Not sure yet.
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Old 01-20-2010, 08:56 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by DOMIT View Post
Hmmm... aerodynamics principles say the best wing readily available is the stock wing for the Associated buggy.

Most wings have a "lip" on the bottom of the front. Most of the downforce actually comes from the BOTTOM of the wing if it has a proper shape- that lip trips the airflow and destroys that lift. The Associated wing doesn't have that lip- just a smooth shape. Much better aerodynamically. It is more like a wing and less like a parachute than the others. Does it have the most downforce? I don't know... you'd have to test it in a wind tunnel. Does it have the best lift-drag ratio? You bet!
I'm a little confused. To have good down-force aren't you trying to minimize lift. If the lip on the front/bottom of a wing destroys lift, wouldn't that be a good wing to use? The associated doesn't have that lip, but is still good?

What kind of affect does the rear/top lip on a wing have? I would've thought that this is the part that causes the downforce.

Tx for your time Domit!!!
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Old 01-20-2010, 08:59 AM   #6
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each car comes with a wing wich has ben designed fot that car why would u change that?
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Old 01-20-2010, 09:05 AM   #7
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Does the shape of the wing really matter for this type of application? are the rc companies really testing them using CFD programs or even small model wind tunnels? I find it hard to believe that these companies are actually renting time on super computers and using the navier-stokes equations to determine the best possible shape. I am a mechanical engineering student and i have just completed my second semester of fluid mechanics and it seems to me that the wing shape in the case doesnt do anything other then protect the engine head when the car lands upside down.
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Old 01-20-2010, 09:08 AM   #8
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Anybody have a link to some information on wings and there affects?
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Old 01-20-2010, 09:11 AM   #9
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My Dad has taken in a couple of wings to his work (Sauber F1 windtunnel) and they have said that the Team Cobra Racing wing is better than the OFNA High Downforce one.
http://www.cobrarc.info/index.html

Thay have had a look at both and say that the lip as mentioned earlier is not good - a simple test we did was to dremmel it off on my friend's one and it did work; but not sure if that was phsycological or proper improvement.
I can notice the difference of the TCR one over the standard one, however I am yet to try it on my new car to compare to the Tamiya ones. However, the F1 engineers also said the fins along the elements help with straight line stability and the twin element design also helps channel the air to the correct place.

Just thought I would chime in, they currently have my complete car there to have a look at and try to improve the aerodynamics so will see what they come up with.

Scott
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Old 01-20-2010, 09:20 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by lazyboy12300 View Post
My Dad has taken in a couple of wings to his work (Sauber F1 windtunnel) and they have said that the Team Cobra Racing wing is better than the OFNA High Downforce one.
http://www.cobrarc.info/index.html

Thay have had a look at both and say that the lip as mentioned earlier is not good - a simple test we did was to dremmel it off on my friend's one and it did work; but not sure if that was phsycological or proper improvement.
I can notice the difference of the TCR one over the standard one, however I am yet to try it on my new car to compare to the Tamiya ones. However, the F1 engineers also said the fins along the elements help with straight line stability and the twin element design also helps channel the air to the correct place.

Just thought I would chime in, they currently have my complete car there to have a look at and try to improve the aerodynamics so will see what they come up with.

Scott
that's awesome! you should try different body styles too!
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Old 01-20-2010, 09:38 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by fievel View Post
Does the shape of the wing really matter for this type of application?
take off your wing and try to race it...the rear end will be VERY loose, I rember I broke a wing one time during a race and the car was very unstable with out the wing compared to with the wing on...

Ryan
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Old 01-20-2010, 10:06 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dnebout View Post
I'm a little confused. To have good down-force aren't you trying to minimize lift. If the lip on the front/bottom of a wing destroys lift, wouldn't that be a good wing to use? The associated doesn't have that lip, but is still good?

What kind of affect does the rear/top lip on a wing have? I would've thought that this is the part that causes the downforce.

Tx for your time Domit!!!
In this case, since the wing is inverted (as compared to an aircraft wing) lift would be in the downward direction, or downforce.

Without the lip, the airflow follows the curve of the wing surface, accelerating the airflow causing a pressure drop- or downforce.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fievel View Post
Does the shape of the wing really matter for this type of application?
Yes.

Quote:
are the rc companies really testing them using CFD programs or even small model wind tunnels?
I seriously doubt it.

Quote:
I find it hard to believe that these companies are actually renting time on super computers and using the navier-stokes equations to determine the best possible shape.
I do too. And the designs that they utilize would tend to support that skepticism.

Quote:
I am a mechanical engineering student and i have just completed my second semester of fluid mechanics and it seems to me that the wing shape in the case doesnt do anything other then protect the engine head when the car lands upside down.
While the designs of most are poor at very best... and yes, the wing does protect the engine head to some extent... here's a experiment for you: Take off the wing and drive your car. You'll be shocked how much difference it makes, especially over jumps and in high speed sweeping turns.

While ideally for the speed range and size a much different airfoil shape is indicated due to the very low reynolds numbers, a "real" airfoil or even a flat (as in constant thickness) curved plate is vastly superior to one that has a protrusion that trips the airflow at the leading edge. Ideally one would want a very thick, heavily cambered airfoil- but that would be heavy and expensive to produce.
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Old 01-20-2010, 10:24 AM   #13
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lazzyboy!!!!

hey where do i buy one of those wings i really want one
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Old 01-20-2010, 10:32 AM   #14
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lazzyboy!!!!

hey where do i buy one of those wings i really want one

Yeah really...where can you get the Cobra wing??
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Old 01-20-2010, 10:43 AM   #15
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Yeah really...where can you get the Cobra wing??
You might try contacting the former U.S. team manager Charlie Lineberger in NC. He was paid for dozens if not hundreds of them. I know he has almost $200 of MY money.
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