R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Nitro Off-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 07-20-2009, 09:05 AM   #1
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 816
Trader Rating: 27 (100%+)
Default Please explain exhaust pipes to me

Hey guys. Can I please get some input on exhaust pipes and differences between them?

I know it all has to do with controlling the flow, but what types of pipes/headers are good for what engines?

I have a picco 28 and read that 086 is a good pipe for it, I also read that its a good pipe for a JP 21, which is a higher rpm motor, so how does that work? Is it because the 086 is free flowing so it allows the motors to open up?

longer/bigger pipe would be for more low end torque and vise versa? round header for high RPM and square header for low end?

Thanks

also, what do the numbers mean? there is an ofna 086 and dynamite 086, but they perform differently.. what's up with that?
spawn_x is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 10:56 AM   #2
Tech Adept
 
chunk t's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Elgin, IL
Posts: 225
Default

"Pipes" as most hobbists call them are pretty straight forward. This is a REALLY generalized explanation.

There are two components:
1. the header - the constant diameter tube that joins the resonance chamber (aka: pipe) to the block.
2. the pipe - technically a wave resonance chamber.

The tuned exhaust system is an attempt to control the positive wave of expanding exhaust gases and the trailing negative wave of cooling gases as they leave the exhaust port and are reflected back. The header length is matched to the transfer/boost port timing to aid in "scavanging"(negative wave). The pipe's length is matched to the exhaust port timing for "packing"(positive wave). The combined header & pipe length are matched to the RPM range you want the pipe to "come-on". Generally speaking longer is for low RPM grunt, shorter is for punch at the top-end. The shape & length of the cones at the front & back of the pipe (divergent & convergent cones) control the effective RPM range available and how abrupt the power comes on.

Like I said, this is a hack explanation, but essentially what is going on.

As to pipe/header recomendations. two buggies with the same engine may require different pipes based on needle setting, nitro % & gearing, so what works for one driver may not be the optimal choice for your set-up.
__________________
chuck "chunk" thomas
.......
1:10, 2-wd Stadium Trucks
B-Mod Tunnels
.......
If ignorance is bliss... I must be in heaven!
chunk t is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 03:12 PM   #3
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: upstate ny
Posts: 103
Send a message via Yahoo to phoenix357
Default

Here you go all you need to know

Pipe, in-line, ofna
086 polished
part #10056
1/8 off-road-TOP END

according to OFNA's website and the advertisement I am looking at.

Pipe, in-line, ofna
053 polished
part #10077
1/8 off-road-MIDRANGE

Pipe, in-line, ofna
063 polished
part #10057
1/8 off-road-BOTTOM END

Pipe, in-line, ofna/picco
069 polished
part #51910
1/8 off-road-BOTTOM END

__________________________________________________ ________

The 'suggested' perfomance of a given pipe is just a general guildline. It's not set in stone. Even within a give pipe there are single chamber, duel chamber and baffled or non baffled variations. You could have 4 versions of a .053 pipe and each will have different charictaistics. The biggest and most common mistake that folks make about pipes is thinking that a given pipe will change the performace curve of a given engine. Sadly they are right in the wrong direction.

Any given engine has it's own performance curves. Some engines are lowend and some are highend. Some are in between there somewhere. Generally a 3-4 port engine will be a lowend, high torque engine. An 8-11 port engine will generally be a highend low torque engine. "torque" always refering to the bottom end. Where the problems come in is most rookies believe that if they are suffering lowend performance with their engine then putting a "lowend" pipe on will fix it. Wrong. Putting a lowend pipe on a highend engine just chokes the highend range of the engines powerband. So now you have an engine that stinks all around. Many will argue with that remark stating, "I put a .*** on my engine and it really made it come alive!" Usually what they don't say is 'after I retuned the engine to run with the pipe I stuck on it'.

Proper way of matching a pipe/engine is to choose a pipe that makes the most of what the engine has to offer. Highend engine/ highend pipe. Lowend engine/lowend pipe. Match the pipe to the engine so that the engine makes the greatest power in it's natural power band. Once you've have done that then adjust the clutchs and gearing to take full advantage of the full power of the engine.
Don't try to MAKE the engine fit the clutch/gearing of the vehical.

__________________________________________________ __________


Since micro 2 stoke engines don't have any valves they use tuned pipes to simulate a valve. Each time the piston uncovers the exaust port the exaust pressure leaves the combustion chamber travels down the header into the pipe, through the pipe to the end of the pipe. Since the stinger is much smaller than the engine's exaust port then not all of the exaust pressure is relieved. This remaining exaust "pulse" then rebounds backward up through the pipe to the exaust port openning.

Timing is critical for max performance but in effect if everything is correct then that rebounding exaust pulse should reach the exaust port right about the same time as the piston is on it's way back up on it's compression stroke. When that happens then for a moment the rebound pressure is equal to the intake pressure so the exaust port simulates being closed. Now the critical part is if the engine is designed to have earlier or later compression timing then that exaust pulse will either be early or late. If it's early then the incomming fresh fuel/air charge will be short and some of the exuast gases will bounce back into the chamber. You will get a hotter less powerful power stroke. If the rebound pulse is late then some of the incomming charge will pass right through the engine and be wasted and the combustion chamber will be overly cooled by too much new fuel and no preburned fuel to help pre-heat the next charge.

Again, timing is critical to get maximum performance. Any micro engine will run with any pipe or muffler. Or even without one. But they will NOT run correctly or make power well.

So, if you have an engine that is designed to make it's max power in the topend range and you stick a lowend pipe on it then the rebounding pressure pulse is going to be late and out of time when the engine gets up into the high rpm range. Yet since the engine is designed for topend performance then a lowend pipe will not change the natural design of the engine. The engine will tend to always run rich on the topend so you lean it out. That improves the bottom end which gives the impression of improved performance. But the engine will not be making it's peak power ever.

As for the pipe shape. Yes the shape of the "convergance cone and the far end and the "divergance" cone and the near end (the header outlet is the referance point) has a marked affect on the amount of pressure that the return pulse generates. But again you really want to try to enhance the strongest points of the engine and then gear to the engine. Often if you are unlucky you may have to try 4-5 different pipes to find the one that makes the most of the engine. If you are real lucky you run into someone that has already found the optimum combo for your brand of engine and they save you a lot of trial and error. Or you pick a brand that has a matched combo already like OS or RB.
phoenix357 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
High Performance Nitro MassiveMods Australian Racing 1318 03-12-2009 03:52 PM
Exhaust frustration, explain this please.. ryanroma Nitro Off-Road 6 11-24-2008 05:30 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 02:36 PM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net