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Old 03-11-2009, 10:20 AM   #1
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Exclamation Endless Clutch Problem: HELP!

I just purchased an used Jammin' X1CRT with Werks TL21B7 ProC and got issues on the clutch, the issues are:
1. On long distance straight track run, after I released the throttle (no braking), the clutch won't disengage (act like engine brake on 1/1 car) and leads to engine stalls.
2. My clutchbell bearing always shot after only 1 hour of run.
3. This issue occured on both of my new plastic (1mm springs) and aluminum (1.1mm springs) clutchshoes and bearings.

Currently I run OFNA's red alum clutch shoes with 1.1 springs, use 2 shims after flywheel nut and one after outer CB bearing and no endplay, the CB runs freely. Previous setup was 1 shim after flywheel nut and the rest is same as above (still got issues!)

Please...please help...I don't want to waste my weekend spending time at the pit.

Thans in advance. pardon my english.
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Old 03-11-2009, 10:40 AM   #2
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On issue 1; Maybe your idle needs to come down? Or, on aluminum shoes, file the edges back(make them look like new), especially the end, where the shoe tapers down to en edge, file that back to give yourself a ~1.5mm flat edge,then chamfer all of the other edges, also clear out the slot that the long end of the spring slides into, you don't want any bind in there, the spring should be able to slide back and forth in that slot freely.

Use a shim on the flywheel pegs, behind the shoes. When you go to put it back together, put one shoe on, then pull it back slightly, it should snap right back into place. if it does not, your clutch springs are most likely too old and have gone weak. Check to see if the spring mates up to the clutch nut at a funny angle, that could cause a bind(this is a more common issue with 1.1 springs), if that is an issue, find a different clutch nut.

On issue 2; This is pretty average

On issue 3; This leads me to believe that your clutch springs are weak, or perhaps you are just shimming you clutch bell too tightly(you want a small tick of play, or at least the bell should spin freely, sometimes there is virtually no play and the bell spins free)
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Old 03-11-2009, 10:54 AM   #3
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Ok, here is a little pic I just drew up.

#1, keep this slot clear of mushroomed material, you want the spring to be able to slide freely in this slot to keep it from binding and causing issues.

#2, keep this 45 degree angle maintained, after running, the shoes begin to "mushroom over", material hangs off wider than the rest of the shoe, and can bind on the flywheel, this is why you must maintain this angle and put a shim on the flywheel post before putting the shoes on. Mushrooming will happen with alum. shoes, this just gives you a few more minutes before the mushrooming effects start causing problems.

#3, Notice the slight flat spot? This needs to be maintained as well, when that edge gets down to a sharp state, it can cause the clutch to stay engaged. File at a 90 degree angle to the underside of the shoe(just like it looks in the pic)

#4, The post hole can sometimes be a tight fit on the flywheel post. Put the shoes on the posts and check to see if they will "flop" around under their own weight, If there is any kind of bind, check the condition of the flywheel posts, if they check out, then you will have to find a drill bit the same size as the posts, and ream out the shoe. Try fitting agian, if it still binds, then you will have to use a drill bit just a tick larger.
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Old 03-11-2009, 11:05 AM   #4
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could be one of several issues, or a combination of things.

Engine dying problem means something is draging the clutch bell. Usually its cause by broken clutch springs, or a hung up shoe. but you also need to check a few other things if you still have problems. Are the clutch shoe pins in the flywheel loose or bent? Do they stick out more than 1mm farther than the clutch shoe? Is it the wrong clutch bell? Some have a large champher inside, and if the shoes are riding on the champhered part it puts a lot of forward force on the bell, uneven shoe wear, overheated bearings and clutch parts, etc, etc.... You said you shim the bell with no end play. Well there should be just a little end play in it when cold. Have a good look at your clutch nut and flywheel as well. You may see signs of rubbing or stange wear marks that could point you in the right direction.

Gear mesh could be a issue. Chassis flex can cause the mesh to change drasticly when running. Check the stiffeners. Check that the moror mount is not cracked or loose. Also check your gear alignment.

chances are that if you fix the clutch draging issue, your bearing problems will get better. On the bearings, do you oil them or run them as is? Oil works better than factory grease most of the time. You still need to inspect, clean and re-oil, or replace them after about every 10 tanks. Ceramics might hold up better, but I'm not really sure if it's worth the extra cost.
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Old 03-11-2009, 11:21 AM   #5
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Thanks BIG RE for being helpful, what I don't understand is all of the parts are 100% new (CB, CB bearings, clutchshoe and springs)..and the problem started since the first run, I did put shims on the flywheel pegs under the clutchshoes, test the spring return etc.

After reading your post, i suspect the problem are on both flywheel or flywheel nut...because yes it took a bit of hammering to put the shoes on the posts...and I'm not sure what to do with the flywheel nut except get a new one. Do u think the first owner gave me the wrong flywheel or flywheel nut? And do you think a pair of fresh (cheap $1) bearings shot in just one hour is pretty average? Sorry I am new to truggy but never experienced this on my t-maxx...
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Old 03-11-2009, 11:27 AM   #6
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It is very possible that you got the wrong clutch nut with it. Try to get the correct one. I have had clutch setups that just refuse to work with 1.1 springs, I don't know why the companies cant get it to work right. Maybe your answer lies in running the 1.0's on the aluminum shoes, can't hurt to try, and if you are new to truggy, you probably don't need all the response of 1.1's.

With CB bearings, I just run ProTek bearings from A-main, I change them out before my main. I run my main (20-25 normally), then a couple tanks of practice at the next race, and I can usually run both heats with no issue. So, yeah, about an hour.
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Old 03-11-2009, 11:35 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG RE View Post
It is very possible that you got the wrong clutch nut with it. Try to get the correct one. I have had clutch setups that just refuse to work with 1.1 springs, I don't know why the companies cant get it to work right. Maybe your answer lies in running the 1.0's on the aluminum shoes, can't hurt to try, and if you are new to truggy, you probably don't need all the response of 1.1's.

With CB bearings, I just run ProTek bearings from A-main, I change them out before my main. I run my main (20-25 normally), then a couple tanks of practice at the next race, and I can usually run both heats with no issue. So, yeah, about an hour.
why truggy don't need all the response of 1.1's? what do u think about acer bearings? are they good? The reason is they offered free shipping worlwide
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Old 03-11-2009, 11:39 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Krawl View Post
Thanks BIG RE for being helpful, what I don't understand is all of the parts are 100% new (CB, CB bearings, clutchshoe and springs)..and the problem started since the first run, I did put shims on the flywheel pegs under the clutchshoes, test the spring return etc.

After reading your post, i suspect the problem are on both flywheel or flywheel nut...because yes it took a bit of hammering to put the shoes on the posts...and I'm not sure what to do with the flywheel nut except get a new one. Do u think the first owner gave me the wrong flywheel or flywheel nut? And do you think a pair of fresh (cheap $1) bearings shot in just one hour is pretty average? Sorry I am new to truggy but never experienced this on my t-maxx...
you have the wrong flywheel bro the post dia. is bigger than the holes in the clutch shoes when you set your clutch up make sure you tighten flywheel on the shaft very good using flywheel locking tool , put just a drop of loctite 242 (medium blue) on the shaft threads before you install the nut , put the .5mm washers underneath each clutch shoe that ofna gives you , make sure each shoe springs back properly after it is installed , clean your cb bearings out with motorspray , heat with heat gun and re-oil with a full synthetic gear oil (one drop) while bearing is hot , shim the clutch bell as far towards the flywheel as possible without rubbing the flywheel and fill the front with shims leaving only .1mm of play , i suggest using the kyosho 5mm shim pack , comes with .1 , .2 , .3mm shims

happy motorin' ,
monty
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Old 03-11-2009, 11:42 AM   #9
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and use avid yellow seal revolution 5x10x4mm clutch bell bearings or tko's new ones
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Old 03-11-2009, 11:52 AM   #10
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Thanks guys, I will check and try to solve the problem based on what u guys just said and post the results...thanks again...
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Old 03-11-2009, 11:56 AM   #11
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Quote:
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Thanks guys, I will check and try to solve the problem based on what u guys just said and post the results...thanks again...
you have the wrong flywheel , 95% sure . there are two different sizes , i believe 2.0mm and 2.2 mm
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Old 03-11-2009, 12:02 PM   #12
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Quote:
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you have the wrong flywheel , 95% sure . there are two different sizes , i believe 2.0mm and 2.2 mm
is that measurement for flywheel post diameter or outer flywheel diameter?
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Old 03-11-2009, 12:05 PM   #13
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Quote:
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is that measurement for flywheel post diameter or outer flywheel diameter?
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Old 03-11-2009, 12:20 PM   #14
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Hope you're right mr.monty... thanks bro...
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Old 03-11-2009, 12:29 PM   #15
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as far as i know...ofna flywheels are all the same....ive never heard of this 2.2 versus 2.0 thing.....there are different diameter ofna flywheels...but as far as i know the pin diam is all the same......here's a little chart from Mitch at M2C's site on what pin diam's fit which shoes.

he difference is the pin size of the flywheel it self. We have 5 different style clutch shoes.

Our clutch shoe styles are Mugen style, Kyosho style, Jammin style, Associated Style and the Losi 8ight style.

Here is a chart of the type of clutch shoes you should order.

Mugen flywheel = Mugen style clutch shoes

Xray flywheel = Mugen style clutch shoes

Kyosho flywheel = Kyosho style clutch shoes

Jammin flywheel = Jammin style clutch shoes

Hot Bodies flywheel = Mugen style clutch shoes

Cen flywheel = Mugen style clutch shoes

Ofna flywheel = Mugen style

RMV flywheel = Mugen style clutch shoes
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