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Old 08-07-2008, 09:58 AM   #1
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Default Losi 8ight front hinge pin retainer trouble

Aside from several fuel tanks splitting at the seam (discussed in a separate thread already), the only other chronic problem I'm having with my Losi 8ight is the front hinge pin retainers consistently breaking. I started with the stock configuration (aluminum brace and plastic retainer), and the plastic retainer kept breaking. This allows the hinge pin to slide backward and then the front H-arm angles back enough to pop the drive shaft out. I upgraded to the Losi adjustable hinge pin braces that contain the small hinge pin retainer inserts, and now I continue to punch holes through the inserts. This happens in as little as 5 minutes of driving and usually on the right-hand back brace (front end of car). I replaced 2 of these retainer inserts at last Saturday's race, and it forced a DNF in my first heat and the A-main (while running 2nd). Anyone having this same problem?
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Old 08-07-2008, 10:08 AM   #2
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if you are pushing the pins threw the adjustable braces you are taking a bad crash! i havent had any come out on me and i have been running the car since day one. I did break one plastic cover, but it was well deserved.
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Old 08-07-2008, 10:14 AM   #3
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Yeah, I would expect stuff to break in a crash also, but I haven't crashed and the hinge pins are still pushing through the retainer inserts. Here's a potential theory; tell me what you think. My chassis is getting pretty worn down from the rough track surface and is thinner than in its stock form. Do you think that could be adding just enough flex to cause the font hinge pins to get "pinched" in between the two retainer inserts, thereby popping a hole in one or both? I can't imagine there would be that much flex in such a short distance between front and rear hinge pin braces on the front end of the car, but I can't think of anything else.
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Old 08-07-2008, 10:21 AM   #4
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I would imagine if being the hingepin is binding in the arm some and when the arem is twisting it is grinding on the insert pushing the pin threw. The only time i ever had a pin come threw a insert was in a very hard head on impact from someone jumping a pipe onto the stright.
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Old 08-07-2008, 12:33 PM   #5
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I broke a retainer the first race with the car and I didn't have any hard crashes all day. I don't like the design with the hingepins riding loose in the Al plate anyway b/c it's going to hollow out the plate and you'll have to replace. Both KHZ and M2C make aftermarket hinge pin plates. I just got my my new M2C rears yesterday, waiting on them to update the fronts and I'll pick those up too. The new M2C design uses floating captured hingepins, the older design (and the KHZ) plates use set screws on the hinge pins. Either of those would solve your issue also.
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Old 08-07-2008, 01:31 PM   #6
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If it were me, I would try reaming the holes in the suspension arms. Also, as a quick fix (I've snapped the stock retainers a couple times), I took a piece of fuel tubing, cut it to the length of the gap between the pivots on the h-arm, cut a slit down the length of it and zipped tied it around the hingepin.

It kept the hingepin in place for the rest of the race day. The following weekend, I cartwheeled on a hard landing and broke the plastic retainer, but that fuel tubing kept the pin in place just enough for me to finish the race. So it saved my hide twice so far. It's not pretty, but it seems to work.

My buggy uses KHZ and M2C braces, so it's a non-issue. The only thing I don't like about the M2C design is that the balls wear out over time and get sloppy and when your doing some "panic wrenching" in the pits, those balls like to fall out and disappear
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Old 08-07-2008, 02:15 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjtamu View Post
I broke a retainer the first race with the car and I didn't have any hard crashes all day. I don't like the design with the hingepins riding loose in the Al plate anyway b/c it's going to hollow out the plate and you'll have to replace. Both KHZ and M2C make aftermarket hinge pin plates. I just got my my new M2C rears yesterday, waiting on them to update the fronts and I'll pick those up too. The new M2C design uses floating captured hingepins, the older design (and the KHZ) plates use set screws on the hinge pins. Either of those would solve your issue also.
Thanks. I actually ordered the KHZ retainers on Monday and they should be delivered today. Although I don't like the idea of running the stock braces again (metal brace against metal hinge pin), I figured the hinge pins wouldn't be able to punch a hole in the alumuninum retainers.
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Old 08-07-2008, 02:19 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by K_B View Post
If it were me, I would try reaming the holes in the suspension arms. Also, as a quick fix (I've snapped the stock retainers a couple times), I took a piece of fuel tubing, cut it to the length of the gap between the pivots on the h-arm, cut a slit down the length of it and zipped tied it around the hingepin.

It kept the hingepin in place for the rest of the race day. The following weekend, I cartwheeled on a hard landing and broke the plastic retainer, but that fuel tubing kept the pin in place just enough for me to finish the race. So it saved my hide twice so far. It's not pretty, but it seems to work.

My buggy uses KHZ and M2C braces, so it's a non-issue. The only thing I don't like about the M2C design is that the balls wear out over time and get sloppy and when your doing some "panic wrenching" in the pits, those balls like to fall out and disappear
Oh my gosh, that quick fix is an awesome idea. I can't believe I didn't think of that too. I was planning on something similar though by milling a groove in the hinge pin, drilling a small hole in the H-arm and putting a set screw through the H-arm to hold the hinge pin in place. I ordered the KHZ retainers and they shold arrive today, but I may still do this little fix just for the piece of mind. I can't stand losing (or not even finishing) a race because of something other than my driving!
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Old 08-07-2008, 03:39 PM   #9
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Thanks. I actually ordered the KHZ retainers on Monday and they should be delivered today. Although I don't like the idea of running the stock braces again (metal brace against metal hinge pin), I figured the hinge pins wouldn't be able to punch a hole in the alumuninum retainers.
I think the KHZ plates use a set screw so there's no problem. The hingepin won't move in the plate so it won't get hollowed out and the hingepins are held in place by the set screw.

KB, there aren't any balls in the M2C rear toe system I got yesterday. This is the brand new one, just went up on the site late last week. The hingepins are tapered on each end and they ride in plastic inserts that you put in the toe plates. When the inserts wear out you just replace them.
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Old 08-07-2008, 06:58 PM   #10
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I stand corrected. Their new design is pretty frickin' slick
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Old 08-07-2008, 09:16 PM   #11
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a little confusing with all the inserts, dots n what not...but Mitch has always been on top of things.
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Old 08-07-2008, 09:40 PM   #12
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I stand corrected. Their new design is pretty frickin' slick
Looks great too, esp. with my name engraved on it, LOL. Once you get your hands on the parts and look at it the dot system is pretty easy to figure out. Just took a couple minutes of reading the instructions and looking at how the parts fit together for the light bulb to go on. Just finished overhauling bikes, so I can put the M2C system in tomorrow.
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Old 08-08-2008, 08:21 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjtamu View Post
I think the KHZ plates use a set screw so there's no problem. The hingepin won't move in the plate so it won't get hollowed out and the hingepins are held in place by the set screw.

KB, there aren't any balls in the M2C rear toe system I got yesterday. This is the brand new one, just went up on the site late last week. The hingepins are tapered on each end and they ride in plastic inserts that you put in the toe plates. When the inserts wear out you just replace them.
I got the KHZ retainers last night, and after looking them over, it appears that they take the place of the stock brace and cover, yes? Also, I see what you mean about the set screws holding the hinge pins from pivoting inside the retainer. This will cause the H-arms to pivot on stationary hinge pins, which should be better. I think I realized the problem I'm having now is due to the fact that the hinge pins are fitting tightly into the H-arms and therefore only pivoting inside the braces/retainers. I'm going to install the KHZ retainers tonight so I'm ready for Saturday's race. I'll let you guys know how it goes.
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Old 08-08-2008, 08:25 AM   #14
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Yeah the King headz plates take place of both of the stock plates...
Thay are awesome! I have both up front and the rear one in the back...
Sets screws do need to be lock-tite'd well cause they can pop out and dissappear on ya...
They are very tough too!
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Old 08-08-2008, 08:39 AM   #15
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Yeah the King headz plates take place of both of the stock plates...
Thay are awesome! I have both up front and the rear one in the back...
Sets screws do need to be lock-tite'd well cause they can pop out and dissappear on ya...
They are very tough too!
Sounds like I made the right choice. It's funny how many months of racing it takes to work the bugs out of a new brand of car and find/fix its weak spots. Now if my fuel tank splitting issues go away with the installation of the Mugen MBX5R tank I bought, I should actually be able to concentrate on driving this Saturday instead of worrying about what's going to break next on my car.
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