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Old 08-04-2008, 06:08 PM   #106
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PLEASE, your the biggest hack you redneck! lol . sup easy money?
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Old 08-04-2008, 09:35 PM   #107
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http://s272.photobucket.com/albums/j...t=f070b783.pbr

Plz watch this vid from the Manufactures Cup. Watch when the leaders come up to lap trafic how they move over and let them by. At one point you will see someone stop to let them by. If a pro driver will do this why souldn't us lower class guys do the same.
Three reasons for the courtesy shown in the vid: (my take on it anyway)

1. Itís a BIG race. Not a weekend spent at the hobby shop having a good time.

2. The announcer.

3. Driver courtesy. Itís a big race. Top two drivers are in a heated battle for FIRST place. It is close to the finish. Enuff of a battle that fractions of a second might determine the outcome. Courtesy might be shown at mid point of the race, but not like this. Could you imagine the thread that would get started if one of the lapped cars had determined the outcome.

4. Lets throw in a forth. Nobody wanted to be the bonehead that messed up the race for the top two because of some freak accident.

At local races the person doing the lapping should be good enuff to get around the person being lapped for the second, third, forth, etc. time. After all they did it the first time. Not saying that courtesy should not be shown by the person getting lapped.........it should, but the person doing the lapping should not blatantly run thru them. Unless they are blocking on purpose, in that case all bets are off.

Ed M.
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Old 08-04-2008, 10:07 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by bentgear View Post
Three reasons for the courtesy shown in the vid: (my take on it anyway)

1. Itís a BIG race. Not a weekend spent at the hobby shop having a good time.

2. The announcer.

3. Driver courtesy. Itís a big race. Top two drivers are in a heated battle for FIRST place. It is close to the finish. Enuff of a battle that fractions of a second might determine the outcome. Courtesy might be shown at mid point of the race, but not like this. Could you imagine the thread that would get started if one of the lapped cars had determined the outcome.

4. Lets throw in a forth. Nobody wanted to be the bonehead that messed up the race for the top two because of some freak accident.

At local races the person doing the lapping should be good enuff to get around the person being lapped for the second, third, forth, etc. time. After all they did it the first time. Not saying that courtesy should not be shown by the person getting lapped.........it should, but the person doing the lapping should not blatantly run thru them. Unless they are blocking on purpose, in that case all bets are off.

Ed M.
I agree with everything said here. I personally wouldn't care if it was the biggest IFMAR championship EVER, even if there were three cars battling and I was battling someone else for position, I am not going to get out of the way. And if you are a real racer, anyone would understand it that way.

Everything else in that quote said is truth, and should be seen as the way it is with racing
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Old 08-04-2008, 11:00 PM   #109
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I'm going to throw in an example.
last year at a big race I was leading the A-main final and came upon a lapper for at least the second time with each previous pass being a rough one so I go to pass him on the inside going into a tight hairpin and his chops me into the pipe. I catch him again in half a lap and the same thing happens. On the next try as I catch him I yell to him to give the leader some room and to stop racing me and the guy yells back even louder that I paid my entry fee just like you and blocks me for an entire lap as second closes the gap. The blocker races me the length of the front straightaway, AGAIN, so when we get to the previously mentioned hairpin I punt him off the track and he starts screaming foul and pitching a fit. I went on to win, he finished well down in the order.

So who's in the wrong?
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Old 08-05-2008, 12:18 AM   #110
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Good Example.
He's Definately in the wrong. He is right that everyone paid the entry fee, but if he's by himself, not racing anyone, and chops you multiple times and blocks you, then you have every right to use the, "bump and run" maneuver I certainly have MULTIPLE amounts of times. Him throwing a fit is part of the emotion in the life of racing (notice how I didn't mention 'Sport of racing')

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Old 08-05-2008, 12:24 AM   #111
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I agree with everything said here. I personally wouldn't care if it was the biggest IFMAR championship EVER, even if there were three cars battling and I was battling someone else for position, I am not going to get out of the way. And if you are a real racer, anyone would understand it that way.

Everything else in that quote said is truth, and should be seen as the way it is with racing

David,

Not sure if your just trying to stir up an argument with this statement.As it is clearly the opposite point of view to the majority of the thread. If this is really your point of view your just the guy that I could understand having a bad race day every weekend with the racers choping you up all the time ..................

I am a real racer and couldn't disagree with the way you think more. I also on occasion have bad a finial, once in awhile. If the leader catches me I move over, simple ............ If I catch back up he'll let me go for sure, So no loss and everyones happy

Rod
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Old 08-05-2008, 01:23 AM   #112
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David,

Not sure if your just trying to stir up an argument with this statement.As it is clearly the opposite point of view to the majority of the thread. If this is really your point of view your just the guy that I could understand having a bad race day every weekend with the racers choping you up all the time ..................

I am a real racer and couldn't disagree with the way you think more. I also on occasion have bad a finial, once in awhile. If the leader catches me I move over, simple ............ If I catch back up he'll let me go for sure, So no loss and everyones happy

Rod
How can you disagree more? If you race for a living, you would understand that paying over $300 for just fuel a night would be pretty pricey. If I'm going to pay to get into a race, even just the $75 for the Nitro Challenge at the Nitro-Pit, how can you just give it up like that and let them go by, IF you are racing for position. You need to remember that I understand what you are saying if you are racing by yourself and the leaders come up on you, then yes, have SOME common sense and get out of the way, because you are obviously not doing anything but trying to stay on the track and make up time somehow.

I am in NO way trying to start an argument, but for you to be a racer, and say that you would move over just because the leaders were tailing you not far behind, and you were racing 2 or more other racers for position, then by all means, please do, but honestly, I don't see it happening if racers are battling for that position.

This brings up the other scenario, which I would like you to explain, or anyone for that matter, because I'm curious, what if you were trying to move out of the way of a leader, and they still bump, or 'run' over you, and what if something broke on your car, would you be angry, or the happiest person at the track because you were getting out of the leaders' way but they don't care about your car?? Keep in mind an R/C shock kit costs about $20-$30 less than if you were to buy one for an actual stock car, or any other part for that matter, excluding engines and transmissions of course.

Just a question, and No, I don't try to start arguments, I try to make things make sense, not only to try to help others understand, but myself as well. I can still learn things although I've been doing this my whole life. There's always a learning part in the brain
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Old 08-05-2008, 05:19 AM   #113
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Not much Al, how you doing?

Me hack naaaaaaaaa
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Old 08-05-2008, 05:37 AM   #114
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I'm going to throw in an example.
last year at a big race I was leading the A-main final and came upon a lapper for at least the second time with each previous pass being a rough one so I go to pass him on the inside going into a tight hairpin and his chops me into the pipe. I catch him again in half a lap and the same thing happens. On the next try as I catch him I yell to him to give the leader some room and to stop racing me and the guy yells back even louder that I paid my entry fee just like you and blocks me for an entire lap as second closes the gap. The blocker races me the length of the front straightaway, AGAIN, so when we get to the previously mentioned hairpin I punt him off the track and he starts screaming foul and pitching a fit. I went on to win, he finished well down in the order.

So who's in the wrong?
Only question there is why did you wait so long?
lol
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Old 08-05-2008, 06:58 AM   #115
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i am uploading some good "example" video from our race last Sat....should be fun.
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Old 08-05-2008, 07:11 AM   #116
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Originally Posted by Merciless View Post
David,

Not sure if your just trying to stir up an argument with this statement.As it is clearly the opposite point of view to the majority of the thread. If this is really your point of view your just the guy that I could understand having a bad race day every weekend with the racers choping you up all the time ..................

I am a real racer and couldn't disagree with the way you think more. I also on occasion have bad a finial, once in awhile. If the leader catches me I move over, simple ............ If I catch back up he'll let me go for sure, So no loss and everyones happy

Rod
Is it your position that someone battling for 4th 5th or 6th place should just move over for the leaders even if it means losing a spot or two in their own battle?
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Old 08-05-2008, 07:27 AM   #117
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This brings up the other scenario, which I would like you to explain, or anyone for that matter, because I'm curious, what if you were trying to move out of the way of a leader, and they still bump, or 'run' over you, and what if something broke on your car, would you be angry, or the happiest person at the track because you were getting out of the leaders' way but they don't care about your car?? Keep in mind an R/C shock kit costs about $20-$30 less than if you were to buy one for an actual stock car, or any other part for that matter, excluding engines and transmissions of course.
I honestly can't say that I've ever run over a backmarker that was trying to get out of the way, then again there are ways to do it and places to do it and there are places not to do it, but it seems every time I've been accused of running someone over it's been because they raced me for a corner or chopped my line as I was attempting to go by them and had taken the line from them because I was faster or was going faster going into that corner.


The scenario I'd like to give back to you, because I'm curious about so many of the answers in this thread, is how would you feel about it if you were in position to to win a race and because of the actions of someone well back in the standings --- not running for a podium spot --- chopped you off into a pipe or barrier and something broke as a result of their action on your car and took you out of the race or left you with broken parts to replace?


I guess part of my concern about this discussion is that people are mentioning running for position or racing with someone else relative to when the leaders approach and not wanting to give way, and I wonder if they are actually running for a podium spot or are they just defending their right to position on the track that results in them running 7th or 8th. I'm not trying to be offensive, but running for a trophy spot is one thing but the other is something else entirely that doesn't really count in my book.
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Old 08-05-2008, 07:38 AM   #118
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I'm not saying I'm entitled to anything, stop interpreting it like that. I'm saying all drivers, sportsman, intermediate, expert, whatever skill level they are should give everybody the same respect they want to be treated with. That means if somebody in 14th is not willing to let the fast guys go, and will just hold up a three-way battle for the lead because the guy who's in 14th is still in the "race," then they've made their choice and I will make mine and treat them on the track the way they are treating me on the track.
Again, there are good points in what you say but I feel you let yourself down at the end.
This attitude of "an eye for an eye" does not work and is so dissopointing........... to me anyway.

If you do something, or are willing to do something wrong, bad, unsportsman like. Then your as bad as the 14th place guy who is intentionally trying to block you. Just because you have, what in your eyes is a good reason, does not entitle you to make that "choice" as you put it and move him out of the way.

It comes down to the type of person you are and the environment you were brought up in or live in now. If you are used to people doing bad or unkind things around you, or if were brought up to hit back if hit environment, then you may end up perceiving that a driver on the track is trying to block you when actually, they are panicking and do not know how or what to do with a three way fight for the lead right on his tale!

Yes, there are those who do this and want to keep you behind them. But if you've ever tried to do this. To on purposly block those behind you. It takes some skill !

People will be who they are. A tree is known by it's fruit. So if you take out another car with that intent. To move them out of the way, or to take them out the race...........for what ever reason you drum up inside of you.
It does not make it 'right', no matter what reason you state for your acts..........no matter how frustrated you are. You have still done wrong !

On the whole. I have seen some good manners on the race track over here in the states. Hopefully, we will not dwell too much on the bad things that happen and take notice of those who are well mannered and act in a sportsman like way.

One such case occured just this last week at a racetrack in Moline, Illinois. Thunderroad. I can't for the life of me remember the guys names in all this but in short it went a little like this.........

In the main. Guy B had qualified 5th and was catching the leader. This had taken most of the 20 minute final and there was about 5 mins left to race. He was on his tale. Neck and neck they raced. Great race! On the last lap, car B tried again to get around the leader and they tangled. B just took too much of a chance with no real opening there. B got away first and in the lead while car A had to wait for the marshall.
Car B then got around to the finnish loop and stopped. (Which was only two or three corners away) He let the previous leader, car A, through to win the race! He did not want to win due to his mystake.

Not quite on the subject of "backmarkers" but a good example of manners I feel.

Regards,
British Menace

P.S. Sorry for the long post
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Old 08-05-2008, 08:57 AM   #119
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Again, there are good points in what you say but I feel you let yourself down at the end.
This attitude of "an eye for an eye" does not work and is so dissopointing........... to me anyway.

If you do something, or are willing to do something wrong, bad, unsportsman like. Then your as bad as the 14th place guy who is intentionally trying to block you. Just because you have, what in your eyes is a good reason, does not entitle you to make that "choice" as you put it and move him out of the way.

It comes down to the type of person you are and the environment you were brought up in or live in now. If you are used to people doing bad or unkind things around you, or if were brought up to hit back if hit environment, then you may end up perceiving that a driver on the track is trying to block you when actually, they are panicking and do not know how or what to do with a three way fight for the lead right on his tale!

Yes, there are those who do this and want to keep you behind them. But if you've ever tried to do this. To on purposly block those behind you. It takes some skill !

People will be who they are. A tree is known by it's fruit. So if you take out another car with that intent. To move them out of the way, or to take them out the race...........for what ever reason you drum up inside of you.
It does not make it 'right', no matter what reason you state for your acts..........no matter how frustrated you are. You have still done wrong !
I don't know about the whole two wrongs don't make it right bit............

........and while I think I uderstand where you were going with what you are trying to say --- I want to relate it back to my rookie days when it felt as if a swam of bees were upon my butt when the leaders approached, and how it reminded me of warning my son for playing with a wasp nest if you're going to mess with them expect to get stung, and if you don't have enough sense to run or get out of their way expect to get what you have coming. Because at that point all the excuses or explanations in the world don't matter.
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Old 08-05-2008, 09:26 AM   #120
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This is going to start the whole arguement back up again, but oh well....


Most of what is posted in this thread is typical to the way most people think/act both on and off the track, the "it's all about me" attitude. I don't care that this is racing or not. THIS IS A HOBBY to 95%-100% of the people arguing on this thread, weather you admit it or not. NOBODY posting in this thread started out their first day on the track a 'pro' driver. All of you, me included, had to start somewhere. I find it pathetic how fast everyone forgets this fact. Would any of you stayed with the hobby if you were all punted, rubbed, pushed, drove thru, whatever you want to call it every time you entered the club races you all started at when you all were considered a back marker?

Who here could tune their first engine properly without help? Where did you all learn what this shock change, or that ride height adjustment would do? Everyone of us relied on experienced people to get where we got in this hobby. Some people needed more guidance than others i understand, but we all needed help at some point.

To everyone on here that disagrees that this is no more than a hobby...
How much money are you "fast" drivers earning both as the driver of the car, and for winning these races? I can pretty much answer that question for most everyone on here, myself included once again, and the answer is for the vast majority....a big fat zero for the first, and maybe a little plaque or a bowling type plastic trophy for the latter. .This is a hobby, nothing more.

I was raised as a small child to be courteous to others. Treat people the way you would like to be treated. As Blowpopracer stated before, even though some of you 'fast' drivers are undeserving, newer people look up to the faster, and the most experienced drivers. Do yourself, and this hobby a favor, and try to promote it instead of scare new people away due to the over-competitiveness.

Common sense rules.

I end my rant with this:

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."
- Albert Einstein

Lets all strive to not be the former, the idiots.
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