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Old 07-28-2008, 03:18 PM   #16
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So here is more food for thought.

Brushless prices are out of this world but China has halted nitromethane production due to the olympics. Gallon prices are as high as $40 in the US. How much longer can we afford these fuel prices?

What is the future of the truggy class?

Will we see a return of 1/10th nitro to offset fuel costs?

With the rising cost of land, what is the future of our favorite tracks.

Davidka is correct, we need more kids in the hobby. Most of the guys in this hobby started as kids. How many kids do you see at tracks now? everyone is above 18.

Last edited by rccarracer15; 07-28-2008 at 03:32 PM.
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Old 07-28-2008, 04:04 PM   #17
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we ALready pay 40$ a gallon.
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Old 07-28-2008, 04:21 PM   #18
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O wow, well I guess the end has come sooner than I thought.
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Old 07-28-2008, 04:51 PM   #19
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My buddy and I just got into the hobby after lusting after it for years as kids. We're both in our mid 30s now with plenty of the necessary money needed to get property outfitted. We opted for the noise and power of the nitro engine and 1/8th scale buggy seemed like the most popular class. We also made that choice because we were aware of the sometimes fickle nature of this hobby and wanted to be in the class where there was plenty of interest and support.

My cousin loaned me his Losi xxx-nt and although you can still find parts around there seems to be virtually no one at our local tracks still running 1/10 gas trucks. Not to mention pull starting an engine is a pain. Give me Traxxas easy start or a starter box thank you.

I'm not willing to prognosticate on the future of the hobby/sport because I'm so relativley new to it but I certainly hope 1/8th scale buggy stays around a while. I'm having a blast (and I've already had to deal with a blown v-spec - all part of the fun).
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Old 07-28-2008, 05:31 PM   #20
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One question I have for those chiming in on this topic: Who/what is it that causes classes to die-out from one short era to the next? More specifically; is it the magazines or LHS, who push new products on the masses, that cause the upturn in sales from one type of scale/class/propulsion to the next wave of each?
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Old 07-28-2008, 05:34 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rccarracer15 View Post
O wow, well I guess the end has come sooner than I thought.
For what it's worth, most aspects of this hobby have been inflation proof and some have even gotten cheaper. I have a bottle of AE 40wt silicone shock oil in my box. The price sticker has two lines, the bottom says $3.95, the top line says 5/87 (the date). Last time I bought shock it still cost $3.95. A good brushed mod motor costs $70, just like they did in 1987, batteries (sub C's) have gotten cheaper by about 50% and have gotten about 200% better. Good kits have always cost the same, tires, the same. In 20 years, the only things I can think of that have gotten more expensive are the tires (they don't last as long but they work twice as well) and now fuel. That's not to mention brushless and lipo and the benefits they bring.

Every one of the items I have listed have stayed the same price yet are light years better than the ones they replaced from years before. I don't believe cost is the issue but the hobby could do with a resurgence of a "stock" class that uses Lipo and brushless. That way a racer knows that they have power equal to others in the class with only one battery.

So here's what I think would be a great class:
1. An electric 1/8 4wd truck built to look scale, presumably on a 1/8th buggy's platform (strong, proven). This platform really became popular because 1/8 can run on surfaces that are not as groomed as 1/10 cars require and well, they're cool.
2. A sensored brushless system with somewhat less power than current nitro setups. Less power makes for easier driving, less need for HUGE tracks, no need for commercial earth moving equipment to build obstacles. A lower powered system would allow long, reliable run time with fairly basic 4s lipo batteries and only one battery would be needed.
3. a spec tire. Lets say Proline knuckles in XTR compound. This tire will wear like iron, work on dirt, pavement, gravel (nothing really works on gravel but..) or whatever else was available to make a track with. Traction wouldn't be a real issue with the 4wd and lower power.

We're probably very close to seeing the big brands come out with RTR brushless vehicles. With a class like this we'd see great reliability for racers, interesting looking vehicles that new racers would identify with and since they're electric, racing could happen in places where people could discover it.


Edit:
"One question I have for those chiming in on this topic: Who/what is it that causes classes to die-out from one short era to the next? More specifically; is it the magazines or LHS, who push new products on the masses, that cause the upturn in sales from one type of scale/class/propulsion to the next wave of each?"

I think its loss of perceived value. Most classes become reduced to "wallet racing". This is especially prevalent in on road racing. TC revived it in the early 90's but it's now the worst of the classes regarding cost. Too much power, too many expensive and disposable items. Current stock racing is almost the worst because all of the equipment is tuned to run within an inch of it's life. The fix is to make rules that do away with tires that are 1sec. per lap faster but only last two runs, use BL/Lipo so a racer has good power all season without having to buy new batteries every 6 weeks. It's starting to happen. There's a 1/8 on road class that uses buggy style chassis and a cheap engine, there's a 1/10 TC class that uses 4 cell and a stock motor with vintage style bodied and HPI rubber tires that will last forever.
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Old 07-28-2008, 08:44 PM   #22
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Quote:
The fix is to make rules that do away with tires that are 1sec. per lap faster but only last two runs, use BL/Lipo so a racer has good power all season without having to buy new batteries every 6 weeks. It's starting to happen. There's a 1/8 on road class that uses buggy style chassis and a cheap engine, there's a 1/10 TC class that uses 4 cell and a stock motor with vintage style bodied and HPI rubber tires that will last forever.
One addition to above. Lock the rules for the class or classes down tight for a minimum of one year. Allow only minimal changes for the following year/years. Damn the manufacturers, damn the "but I want to run this widget", LOCK IT DOWN.

Spec classes will work, but not if the rules keep changing every week/month.

Racing around here has fallen off, but it does every year untill folks get used to the heat.

Just my 2 cents, put a $2 with it and get a cup of coffee.

Ed M.
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Old 07-29-2008, 01:15 PM   #23
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Over the past few years I've noticed...

A good example of racing thats going away, is the 1/8th on-road. The decline is mostly due to pricing just being way too high. Of course all the factory guys can run all day for cheap. For your average joe racer its $100.00 to run your car for one practice day, and even more to race. That kind of cost will kill any race class.

1/8th scale nitro offroad is next in line to see drop offs, mostly due to prices on everything creeping up, like fuel, tires etc... At the local tracks around here, we have seen a drop off to the tune of 30-40 racers vs last year at this time. If the manufactures and shops keep passing the added cost on to the consumer without eating a little bit of it, we will be forced to be more choosy about what races to run, or worse... quit. Over time this can and will lead to total melt down as we see happening in the on-road 1/8th. I think the manufacturers need to do everything they can to stop raising prices, and the shops need to stop getting greedy by raising prices every time they get a chance. This price gouging stuff can slow the whole industry. Manufacturers and shops are in a much better position to help stop the bleeding. The racers I know are just plain tapped out broke, and aren't showing up to buy the $40 nitro anymore.

My $.02
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Old 07-29-2008, 01:38 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inside_Line View Post
Over the past few years I've noticed...

A good example of racing thats going away, is the 1/8th on-road. The decline is mostly due to pricing just being way too high. Of course all the factory guys can run all day for cheap. For your average joe racer its $100.00 to run your car for one practice day, and even more to race. That kind of cost will kill any race class.

1/8th scale nitro offroad is next in line to see drop offs, mostly due to prices on everything creeping up, like fuel, tires etc... At the local tracks around here, we have seen a drop off to the tune of 30-40 racers vs last year at this time. If the manufactures and shops keep passing the added cost on to the consumer without eating a little bit of it, we will be forced to be more choosy about what races to run, or worse... quit. Over time this can and will lead to total melt down as we see happening in the on-road 1/8th. I think the manufacturers need to do everything they can to stop raising prices, and the shops need to stop getting greedy by raising prices every time they get a chance. This price gouging stuff can slow the whole industry. Manufacturers and shops are in a much better position to help stop the bleeding. The racers I know are just plain tapped out broke, and aren't showing up to buy the $40 nitro anymore.

My $.02

Nicelly put....

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Old 07-29-2008, 01:47 PM   #25
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The costs are not directly affecting offroad in my opinion, I really think it's the cost of everything else in the hobbiest's life that is making it harder to justify spending their money on the hobby. Hobby shops are not gouging us, believe me. If you knew how little money they make on many of the items they sell to us (epsecially the big ticket stuff like kits, radio gear and engines/fuel) you'd wonder why they even bothered with R/C at all. From a business standpoint you (a store) would be better off selling just about anything else.
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Old 07-29-2008, 05:59 PM   #26
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i just dont see nitro racing going away anytime soon..
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Old 07-29-2008, 06:28 PM   #27
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I think its doing great it has matured. The evolution of it is slow, but it appears to me that we are gaining to the point we will be able to be recognized for the sport and recreation of it. We are cloaked by the hobby of it.

We have an organizing body and with all the interviews and vids being produced I think we are just on the edge of our goal. And that's to "NOT" be playing with toys.
My hats off to the people behind the scenes getting it done with out the help of all the cry babies setting things back.

I would love to see a franchise facility that could support a full out venue from on and off road indoors and out. Maybe one very 100 miles or so.
Managed and operated as a business governed by a organizing body. Friday Saturday and Sunday races.

The truth is we are not ready for such a facility, it would take the maturity of racers that in a large setting week after week could over come and except controversies at a mature level.

For now it appears we are better to represent RC racing as smaller groups of racers. A birds of a feather flock together kind of facility.
And only gather at large events.

Slowly but surely.
We are so much greater than a hobby.
Knowing the difference from Hobby vs. Racing is the beginning.
http://www.answers.com/topic/hobby
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Old 07-29-2008, 10:53 PM   #28
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Some great points, i will use them to try and convnce my girlfriend to stop calling it my toy car...


Seriously... yeah, hobby morphing into sport. If ESPN can televise poker as a sport, i would be less suprised to see the ROAR nationals.
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Old 07-30-2008, 07:24 AM   #29
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Some great points, i will use them to try and convnce my girlfriend to stop calling it my toy car...


Seriously... yeah, hobby morphing into sport. If ESPN can televise poker as a sport, i would be less suprised to see the ROAR nationals.
Amen to that

I think the popularity of the sport is about to explode.
Just watch corr racing and check out the national traxas commerical. If more tracks do a spec class for the slash thats all it would take for people of all ages to get involved, as long as the old racers there make a little effort to talk to the new people and let them know how great the sport is.
Who doesn't want to have fun?
Isnt that what its all about?

I started racing a couple years ago after job stress was about to drive me crazy, I went to the lhs and got a 18t from a friends suggestion to bash around with. He saw a flyer one day at the hobby shop for a race, so we had to check it out. One race I was hooked and these were just off road minis. So now i race 1/8 scale buggy and chance i get and love it.

Race directors if you want to grow the sport advertise a race as much as possible even if its just slapping up a few flyers. Some way to get to non racers, or people who dont even know this sport exists.

There are some tracks here in alabama who are doing a free slash spec class to get more people out to the track, and other tracks who have a $5 novice run what you brung 3-5 min races for the first timmers.


So there are ways to do this great sport without spending a pile of money to be able to compete and have fun.


more people = more fun
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Old 07-30-2008, 07:46 AM   #30
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It's completely un-important to get RC racing televised. What will grow the hobby is internal growth, more people doing it in more places. Right now its not important if people watch, its important that people participate.

We went through the same phase in mountain bike racing when the race organizers started trying to get more TV exposure and all the motivations went the wrong way. Races were being held in crappy parks (to be close to cities/spectators) instead of the incredible venues that were used before (Rocky mountains, Pacific Northwest, etc..). The sport was always supposed to be for the participants, not spectators. It's healing now.
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