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Old 07-15-2008, 06:54 AM   #16
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it just doesnt seem right to me to have brushless 1/8 scales.. i dont know why i just have alot of trouble watching them at my track. maybe i just love the smells and sounds of nitro to much!!
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Old 07-15-2008, 06:59 AM   #17
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I also love the sound and smell of nitro's. Real men drive nitro's, leave the electrics for women and children.
IM 14 and i love the smell of nitro, i have 5 cars,
2 Truggys:
Thunder Tiger ST-1
Caster RACING K8T

3 Buggys:
Thunder Tiger EB4 S2 PRO RTR (in pieces)
Hyper 7 PCR Pro kit
Hyper 7 pro (one of the first ORIGINAL PRO'S)

and i hate electric, you need something screaming, you need a piston and the thought in the back of your head "This could blow up" lol

Like if us nitro guys have a runaway? our heart starts pounding like hell and we get worried coz all you can hear is an engine screaming at top RPM's

But if an electric car has a runaway, who cares lol, with nitro engines we have to worry about replacing a $300+ engine, and ive seen heaps of electric runaways and, ive never seen one blow up, or "Burn out" lol

Just my 2c

and what are you running (nitro %) if its gone up, simply go down in nitro% i run 15%nitro, and thats plenty of power for me.

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Old 07-15-2008, 09:07 AM   #18
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The smell and sound of nitro definitely is fun at the track and gives a sense of realism. However, that smell and sound probably stunts the growth of the hobby too. It ain't so cool when you live in an area where the neighbors are going to have a problem with the noise and smell.

I converted to 1/8 electric because I like the durability of the 1/8 cars, but there is no way I can run a nitro in my area without inconveniencing my neighbors.

However, realize that although the nitro sounds cool, it can't hold a candle to electric performance. Electric is just flat out faster and accelerates 2x's as fast as a nitro. Electric gives the ability to clear jumps with short run ups that would be just a pipe dream with a nitro.

The run times have also improved. Most of us can go 15 minutes straight and even 20 minutes depending on setup. Lipo batteries are actually coming down in price. I never pay more than 100 bucks for 4s & 5s 5000 lipos now (you just gotta know where to shop). The cars for the most part are maintenance free, the batteries last about 250 cycles or so reliably which means a couple of years for most racers. The reality is that you can get a race spec electric 1/8 for the same amount as a race spec 1/8 nitro.

Personally, I think 1/8 electric will help the hobby grow because it will make it easier for larger tracks to open in more populated areas since noise pollution won't be a factor.

Nitro ain't going anywhere, but at the end of the day it is antiquated technology. Beyond making a cool sound and smoke, there really is no other nitro advantage anymore.
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Old 07-15-2008, 06:27 PM   #19
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At the track I go to we just run the brushless with the nitro. I guess it would be nice to have a separate class where it would just be electrics. The price of nitro was a factor in converting to electric, but it sure wasn't the only one. I just don't like having to tune everytime you want to run and not to mention the noise, smell, oily mess... Yeah as you can tell, I don't like nitro very much. I'm all for having a class for brushless buggies and truggies.

Let me know if you need any help with your conversion. What buggy are you converting? Most of them are pretty easy to convert.
You don't like to tune and tinker? Electric will not end that. Not by a long shot. The electric guys at my track NEVER stop tinkering. There is so much stuff with picking out a nice system and then programming it to suit your track and get the most usuable power without overheating the thing that you may never be satisfied. Nitro is actually a lot EASIER. Good luck though, hope you've got someone good to guide you!
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Old 07-15-2008, 06:30 PM   #20
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No problem, you should be able to find everything you need from http://www.rc-monster.com/rcm.php or http://www.rcproductdesigns.com/. You'll need a motor mount, battery tray, esc, motor, and battery to get going. I would recommend at least a 4 cell lipo setup, but you can go higher and do a 6 cell lipo setup (that's what I'm running). If you go the 4 cell route, you can use a mamba max esc with a bec, but if you decide to run 6 cells you'll have to use something like the mamba monster. Also, the simplest setup is to use motor braking, the motor will provide more than enough braking strength.

Let me know if you have any more questions.
AND a charger
AND a power supply
AND a LiPo sack
AND...
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Old 07-15-2008, 07:00 PM   #21
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I'm a big Nitro fan. Tinkering, the sound, the smell is what I enjoy about this part of the hobby. I like that on any given race day, just about anyone can win. There are so many factors that determine who wins.

With that said, I'm a fan of brushless/lipo as well.

I've converted an RC8 to brushless/lipo and have a brushless/lipo E-Revo. For me its just another aspect of RC racing.....
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Old 07-15-2008, 07:07 PM   #22
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Think will still stick with nitro buggy, just love the sound , smell and last the power ha ha
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Old 07-16-2008, 03:15 AM   #23
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I own and run both. I like both for different reasons. The biggest thing I like about nitro is actually pit strategy and the longer mains. Oddly enough many other nitro guys hate pitting. Last weekend I went racing and each 1/8th buggy qualifier started out with 10 cars each. By the end of a 10-minute qualifier only 4-6 cars were left. Guys either flamed out on the track, underestimated their pit strategy, flamed out while pitting, or just broke because they could not make the 10 minutes (5 minute heats are too easy...LOL ). The sound is very cool and helps with driving your car since you can hear what the motor is doing. I can do without the smoke and nausiating smell though. I keep my cars pretty clean and all it takes is one sloppy pit guy and you have a huge mess.....LOL I won't stop running nitro though.

But with that said, 1/8th electric is also a lot of fun. Most folks like speed and the 1/8th electric conversions are down right sickly fast. Most that post saying they will never run 1/8th electric have probably never driven one. All it usually takes is 2-3 laps with one and I guarantee most would not be able to wipe the smile off their face (If you could have only seen factory Mugen driver Bobby Tillman drive my E-MBX5R at Silver State. He loved it). The speed, acceleration and jumping power is phenomenal.

Cost is about the same to build either but long term costs are cheaper with the electric car. There is a some tuning involved but for most the electric would be easier. Right now the class is not that big so you'll likely see them both ran together. But within the next year or so the electric 1/8th class is going to grow and should have a class of its own with rules and all.
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Old 07-16-2008, 08:57 AM   #24
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I own and run both. I like both for different reasons. The biggest thing I like about nitro is actually pit strategy and the longer mains. Oddly enough many other nitro guys hate pitting. Last weekend I went racing and each 1/8th buggy qualifier started out with 10 cars each. By the end of a 10-minute qualifier only 4-6 cars were left. Guys either flamed out on the track, underestimated their pit strategy, flamed out while pitting, or just broke because they could not make the 10 minutes (5 minute heats are too easy...LOL ). The sound is very cool and helps with driving your car since you can hear what the motor is doing. I can do without the smoke and nausiating smell though. I keep my cars pretty clean and all it takes is one sloppy pit guy and you have a huge mess.....LOL I won't stop running nitro though.

But with that said, 1/8th electric is also a lot of fun. Most folks like speed and the 1/8th electric conversions are down right sickly fast. Most that post saying they will never run 1/8th electric have probably never driven one. All it usually takes is 2-3 laps with one and I guarantee most would not be able to wipe the smile off their face (If you could have only seen factory Mugen driver Bobby Tillman drive my E-MBX5R at Silver State. He loved it). The speed, acceleration and jumping power is phenomenal.

Cost is about the same to build either but long term costs are cheaper with the electric car. There is a some tuning involved but for most the electric would be easier. Right now the class is not that big so you'll likely see them both ran together. But within the next year or so the electric 1/8th class is going to grow and should have a class of its own with rules and all.
Good points. I never said I hated them. I just don't want one becuase they seem like a hassle at this point. When they become something that each manf. offers as an out of the box kit and they are really booming in a few years who knows. I'll always keep a nitro I hope but like you said the instant power has got to be a blast. I go out to turn marshall more often now becuase I want to check out the electrics up close. One more guy at our track got one and now I've got a couple of offers to take a few laps with one if I want. I'm sure it's going to be fun but I've got so much into nitro and that is what I know I still would have much more fun with nitro than learn something new that has it's own problems to figure out. Even though I know about electronics the way that you need to figure out so much to setup an electric system properly seems like a huge hassle to me. I think it takes all of the fun out of it for some reason and I don't want any part of it. Nitro is phycially so much simpler I love it!
First comment I've seen about long term cost. I've always wondered how much the electric keeps costing you. Because nitro NEVER stops costing you with pitson/sleeves and fuel.
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Old 07-16-2008, 01:52 PM   #25
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I dont understand why people dont like Brushless.. Less maintenence, one less thing to worry about tuning (engine) no clutches to rebuild, more time to focus on suspension tuning, lighter then their nitro bretheren

I like the sound and smell out of nitro, but brushless kicks the crap out of it.
coming from someone who has had both..
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Old 07-16-2008, 02:09 PM   #26
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SORRY FOR THE LONG POST BUT ITS THE HONEST OPINION OF SOMEONE VERY NEW TO 8TH SCALE OFFROAD WHO HAS TRIED BOTH

I actually bought my first RC8 a couple months ago fully intending to convert it to electric, but was given a motor and starter box to try nitro. Ive tried both and in my opinion they are not comparable.

I would agree with everything the electric guys are saying until I get up to the drivers stand
I absolutly HATE almost everything about NITRO
I hate that something as stupid as fuel tubing or a clutch spring or a bad starter box motor can ruin your race day
I HATE FLAMMING out,
I hate charging 3 batteries for something that doesnt even run on batteries, I hate buying fuel all the time,
I hate not being certain that I will be able to start my car, and I hate the mess and maintenance.
I think its environmentally harmful, and I think it is way way more work than electric.

But despite all this - I only wanna race nitro now

The only way I can describe it really is with video games. You know how Gran Turismo or Metal Gear Solid, or Counter strike is really really difficult when you first start playing - ( for me almost to the point where the game isnt fun). And then you go and get the cheater code that gets you all the cars or all the guns. You can go and win all the races and blow everyone away and thats fun but to me it gets boring after like 5 games and you realize that the hardness of the game was actually the whole point.
I feel like thats how I see nitro now. Im new to it, and its really hard and annoying. Electric was like this giant brushless cheater code that allowed me to clear any jump without having a runup - smoke any car down the straight and never flame out or do maintenance. But somehow this cheater code made it instantly boring.

It would belike saying "you know we could post much faster lap times and make the carsmore durable if we took all the jumps out of the track" - but the jumps are the whole point to the racing. To me Nitro makes racing much more dificult the same way Jumps do, but just like jumps they are an end in themselves and are the whole point. I cant describe but there is something about burning gallons of nitromethane with you right index finger that makes it ridiculously fun
I didnt expect this at all - and Im in no way trying to rag on electric. I still think its the future and I still think that on paper its WAY WAY better than nitro

Ill probably end up converting to electric at some point
But I was very surprised that despite my affinity for electric I didnt like it when I compared it to nitro - but again just my opinion
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Old 07-16-2008, 02:18 PM   #27
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You have to love the women and children comment, (no face for ignorance), I felt the same way about nitro forever, I hated the noise, the smell, the racers, and how messy they are. I have been racing electrics for a long time and just recently came across an Mbx5t and so far I love it!!! Unless you run both it is hard to have appreciation for the other. Back to the original post, I personally would love to see more EL8th scale, when the conversions becaome cheaper I believe more people will convert.
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Old 07-16-2008, 03:48 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wstuart View Post
SORRY FOR THE LONG POST BUT ITS THE HONEST OPINION OF SOMEONE VERY NEW TO 8TH SCALE OFFROAD WHO HAS TRIED BOTH

I actually bought my first RC8 a couple months ago fully intending to convert it to electric, but was given a motor and starter box to try nitro. Ive tried both and in my opinion they are not comparable.

I would agree with everything the electric guys are saying until I get up to the drivers stand
I absolutly HATE almost everything about NITRO
I hate that something as stupid as fuel tubing or a clutch spring or a bad starter box motor can ruin your race day
I HATE FLAMMING out,
I hate charging 3 batteries for something that doesnt even run on batteries, I hate buying fuel all the time,
I hate not being certain that I will be able to start my car, and I hate the mess and maintenance.
I think its environmentally harmful, and I think it is way way more work than electric.

But despite all this - I only wanna race nitro now

The only way I can describe it really is with video games. You know how Gran Turismo or Metal Gear Solid, or Counter strike is really really difficult when you first start playing - ( for me almost to the point where the game isnt fun). And then you go and get the cheater code that gets you all the cars or all the guns. You can go and win all the races and blow everyone away and thats fun but to me it gets boring after like 5 games and you realize that the hardness of the game was actually the whole point.
I feel like thats how I see nitro now. Im new to it, and its really hard and annoying. Electric was like this giant brushless cheater code that allowed me to clear any jump without having a runup - smoke any car down the straight and never flame out or do maintenance. But somehow this cheater code made it instantly boring.

It would belike saying "you know we could post much faster lap times and make the carsmore durable if we took all the jumps out of the track" - but the jumps are the whole point to the racing. To me Nitro makes racing much more dificult the same way Jumps do, but just like jumps they are an end in themselves and are the whole point. I cant describe but there is something about burning gallons of nitromethane with you right index finger that makes it ridiculously fun
I didnt expect this at all - and Im in no way trying to rag on electric. I still think its the future and I still think that on paper its WAY WAY better than nitro

Ill probably end up converting to electric at some point
But I was very surprised that despite my affinity for electric I didnt like it when I compared it to nitro - but again just my opinion

Great post. The great thing about Nitro is it is tough, it's a huge learning curve to get good and at some point you wont worry about being able to start your car... the right engine and learning to tune... pressing down the glowstart and your engine suddenly idling away first time is hugely satisfying


I am actually curious... the reason i don't fancy electric is the way the tech jumps, and with that the cost... brushless, cells, chargers... i stopped racing 1/10th when i was younger just as the whole pulse charger thing happened (Just after i went thermal) and cells where getting expensive and so on... to the point where to compete you had to spend a LOT of cash... i don't understand liPo too much much but from what i gather it looks promising in terms of cost but when it becomes a class it's going to get competitive... how expensive will it then become?

Right now with Nitro, all fuels are the same ballpark cost wise... cost wise i don't think it's too difficult to have a car specced up there with the pro's and keep it running... most of it is in set up, attention to detail and actual racing skills.

My gripe with Electric right now running with Nitro is when marshalling... an electric rolls behind you and you can't hear it, then the driver gets angry
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Old 07-16-2008, 04:28 PM   #29
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Good post stuart. You're absolutely right about nitro and its challenges. LIke I said I love the whole pitting thing.

Ian, I'm with you on the marshalling thing. When I raced my 1/8th electric car at the SilverState race everyone was watching and laughed their arses off when I rolled it in one corner and the marshall picked it up and thought it flamed out. But he was in for a big surprise when I blipped the throttle and spun the wheels. I think it scared the crap out of him ....LOL
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Old 07-16-2008, 06:04 PM   #30
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I am actually curious... the reason i don't fancy electric is the way the tech jumps, and with that the cost... brushless, cells, chargers... i stopped racing 1/10th when i was younger just as the whole pulse charger thing happened (Just after i went thermal) and cells where getting expensive and so on... to the point where to compete you had to spend a LOT of cash... i don't understand liPo too much much but from what i gather it looks promising in terms of cost but when it becomes a class it's going to get competitive... how expensive will it then become?


Excellent point. There are still a lot of us in this world that don't enjoy wasting money as technology passes something by. Right now electric is changing every day. I've got an 8 year old nitro buggy and it is still competitive at my track and I enjoy running it. Engines don't change enough to need to go out and buy a new one before the piston/sleeve needs to be replaced and you decide if you want to do a big rebuild or look at a newer engine that will be 100% fresh. Right now there is a lot of electric activity at my track and the guys with the money are always changing something. I get so pi$$ed when I buy something and it's obsolete the next year. Everything I do in life is for the long haul. I've bought two computers my whole life becuase they were both exactly enough for what I needed. Every full size car I've bought new was 10 years old when I traded it in and could have kept going. If my current 3 year old car doesn't hold up for 10 years/250,000 miles I'll be greatly disappointed. And no that is not an unrealistic expectation now days. I think the RC stuff also appeals to different personalities and is one of the reasons that the people that are so set on their choice don't understand the other. I look at the cost and technology of the batteries and all the time standing around charging and I don't get it. It's the very part of owning a Tamiya Hornet as a kid that I couldn't stand. My TX/RX batteries last all day and if I don't crash hard I just go,go, go with the nitro non-stop. It lasts a lot longer than I do when it's hot outside
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