Edit: reducing your droop will also make for better handling everywhere else too.
Quote:
Limit your droop, that's the entire problem. After you take that down a little bit you will be able to go back to a thinner front sway bar and tune for more aggressive handling. Cars with too much droop will always traction roll.
dont take this as a attack but i disagree with most of this..i most always run full droop...i may limit the front some if i need less weight transfer to the rear of the car, but other then that i have NO issues with traction rolling ever.And i always use he tire and compund of choice for every track i run at..
the only way i can see less droop make a car better handling if its on a smooth indoor clay track with small jumps..
limit to much drop you got a car that bottoms easy,dosnt settle fast and gets bucked around like crazy in the rough...basically killing the strong points of the MBX-6
i feal that the low degree of rear camber and running a rear tire with too much side bite is the problem you are having..try something like a I beam or bow tie that dosnt have crazy side bite and run a city block in the front..block pass works good in the front too..
sway bars are a minor tuning tool,but i do agree the thinner bars "seem" to work better on the MBX-6..i actually some times dont even run the rear if i need the car to plant a little more through rough stuff..
GOOD LUCK!...my best advice is to find tires that work..leave the car alone and drive the shit out of it as much as you can...you'll get faster i gaurentee
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I was running V3 Bowties (wider ones) on the rear and am now using I-Beams.
I might go back to V2 Bowties and trim the side tread. It's just the track in that spot is really rough and pitted out bad. The rest of the track I have no problems with, just wanted to be faster there, it's right before a huge triple that no one can make and if I can carry more speed thru that turn I can clear it and make better lap times, But I heard today they are changing the triple to a double-double, so I guess that don't matter no more and I can just slow down or go a little wide in that turn.
dont take this as a attack but i disagree with most of this..i most always run full droop...i may limit the front some if i need less weight transfer to the rear of the car, but other then that i have NO issues with traction rolling ever.And i always use he tire and compund of choice for every track i run at..
the only way i can see less droop make a car better handling if its on a smooth indoor clay track with small jumps..
limit to much drop you got a car that bottoms easy,dosnt settle fast and gets bucked around like crazy in the rough...basically killing the strong points of the MBX-6
i feal that the low degree of rear camber and running a rear tire with too much side bite is the problem you are having..try something like a I beam or bow tie that dosnt have crazy side bite and run a city block in the front..block pass works good in the front too..
sway bars are a minor tuning tool,but i do agree the thinner bars "seem" to work better on the MBX-6..i actually some times dont even run the rear if i need the car to plant a little more through rough stuff..
GOOD LUCK!...my best advice is to find tires that work..leave the car alone and drive the shit out of it as much as you can...you'll get faster i gaurentee
thats so true, listen to some club pro and spent like a hundred bucks on swa bars and diff oil, really could not feel any bloody difference. such a waste of money. best is still the tyres, i ran shumacher mini pins and that rally made a diffrence.
On a final note, use the brakes!!! lol
Joking aside usualy the main reason for traction rolling is guys trying to take a corner at impossible speeds, when i first started out i would spend half the day being marshaled because i would go full speed down the stretch come into the corner coasting and traction roll mid corner...
It seems un natural at first nearly as if you're braking too much but ultimately it's the fastest way around the track.
I totaly agree with yoshgixxer on the whole full droop thing Always try and run the maximum available.
can just slow down or go a little wide in that turn
you just gave your self the best advice....
for one..everyone wants to cut the pipes as tight as possible and apex everything like this is the indy car race...well guess what its not..and the fastest line is the line were you carry the most momentum..just because line "A" is slower into the turn dosnt mean its the slowest back out..lots of corners i may enter semi slow but well set up, and my exit speed is off the hook..once your car is carrying some speed,it dosnt have to be much, it will pull 5 times harder out of a corner then from a dead stop!
also set your mugen to have 40 front/60 rear brake bias and have it set so at full brakes the rear wheels want to stop it fast but not skid...and the front of the car should dive and the front wheels should NEVER lock up...cant steer with locked up wheels!
p.s. try city blocks all the way around..they work great every were..unless its totaly blown out loose dirt
i tried calibers for the first time last week too..excellent tire's had amazing traction compable to a city block ..but they were half shot after one day of racing..i had M2 mediums..maybe try the XTR's
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for one..everyone wants to cut the pipes as tight as possible and apex everything like this is the indy car race...well guess what its not..and the fastest line is the line were you carry the most momentum..just because line "A" is slower into the turn dosnt mean its the slowest back out..lots of corners i may enter semi slow but well set up, and my exit speed is off the hook..once your car is carrying some speed,it dosnt have to be much, it will pull 5 times harder out of a corner then from a dead stop!
also set your mugen to have 40 front/60 rear brake bias and have it set so at full brakes the rear wheels want to stop it fast but not skid...and the front of the car should dive and the front wheels should NEVER lock up...cant steer with locked up wheels!
p.s. try city blocks all the way around..they work great every were..unless its totaly blown out loose dirt
i tried calibers for the first time last week too..excellent tire's had amazing traction compable to a city block ..but they were half shot after one day of racing..i had M2 mediums..maybe try the XTR's
Everything this guy said about droop, tires, brakes, and lines, I agree with totally. This is how I run my car and how I drive. Use tires to tune, leave the basic set up alone and learn how to drive. Watch your local fast guys and you"ll be amazed at how in control and effortless they make it look if they are any good. Car sideways and flying all over the place with the tires ballooned out to the moon may look cool but it's not the fast way around. just my 2 cents
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One of the best things you can do to help your lap speed, is watch the 2 or 3 fastest guys in practice.
(If your not sure who they are they will be the ones who seem to always find traffic since they catch everyone pretty quickly and bozos will wait for them to see how good they might be running against them during practice, lol)
Sometimes a tight smooth line is fastest, sometimes a wider turn that lets you carry speed is fastest, for example, leading to a big jump. But for me the biggest thing to learn is throttle control, since wheel speed vs. car speed is key. Spinning the tires into pizza cutters is not the fastest way around on any track!
The biggest setup elements for me have always been tires first, then clutch and brake bias/end points, then diff fluids. The rest is minor after that.
I see far too many supposedly "knowledgable racers" tweaking thier ride hieght and camber to the n'th degree, but when they enter a turn under braking their front tires are locked, the car isn't responding and the front end diffs out really bad under full wood on exit......If your not in control of the car first, those tiny tuning exersizes are a waste of time and energy.
just my .02
...Jim
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But for me the biggest thing to learn is throttle control, since wheel speed vs. car speed is key
Thats why i race 1/10 2wd electric during the winter..i hate every minute of it but i know its being used more of a "learning" tool the a race car..if that makes sense..my trigger finger deffinatly smoothed out after a indoor season on 1/10 2wd buggy
i also fly heli's...thats for fun though but deffinatly helped my hands become more proportional and sensitive to stick inputs
but here we are full circle were it all comes back to practice practice practice!! this was like a cool little bit of "race talk"
oh and the MBX-6 is the shizznit
Good luck at the races guys
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dont take this as a attack but i disagree with most of this..i most always run full droop...i may limit the front some if i need less weight transfer to the rear of the car, but other then that i have NO issues with traction rolling ever.And i always use he tire and compund of choice for every track i run at..
the only way i can see less droop make a car better handling if its on a smooth indoor clay track with small jumps..
limit to much drop you got a car that bottoms easy,dosnt settle fast and gets bucked around like crazy in the rough...basically killing the strong points of the MBX-6
No offense taken but you should give the droop suggestions Allan42r (Mugen factory driver) a try. Yoshgixxer, I know you're pretty new to running the Mugen (just traded away an 8ight 2.0, right?) but if you're taking traction away from the car to stop traction rolling you are literally throwing corner speed out the window. The car still has plenty of travel with the droop settings mentioned a few posts ago but has none of the radical weight transfer issues that come with max travel. You'll notice that pro's almost never run their cars at full droop anymore. There's a reason for that.
No offense taken but you should give the droop suggestions Allan42r (Mugen factory driver) gave us a try. Yoshgixxer, I know you're pretty new to running the Mugen (just traded away an 8ight 2.0, right?) but if you're taking traction away from the car to stop traction rolling you are literally throwing corner speed out the window. The car still has plenty of travel with the droop settings mentioned a few posts ago but has none of the radical weight transfer issues that come with max travel. You'll notice that pro's almost never run their cars at full droop anymore. There's a reason for that.
I tend to agree on the droop thing. I have wound out most of the droop on my 6 and it feels great on the track. I hate lots of droop. Makes the car really wallow around in the corners and makes it feel tippy. With less droop the cars sits flatter and more stable and will change directions in the tight stuff faster and better. I never run full droop on any car.
Running full droop on the Mugen is crazy the car simply has way too much down travel. If you look at the fast guys like Bobby Tillman, Drew Moeller, Rhonda Skelton there cars dont get into ruts they glide over them and it's the limiting of Droop that allows this to happen. If your traction rolling i would be willing to bet it's one of these 2 things, first you have the wrong tire on the car, it doesnt matter what you do if you have too much or too little traction the car will be dificult to drive, tires are 90% of your setup. Now secondly you have your suspension set to soft, either too light on the oil weight not enough rebound, too much rebound or to heavy of an oil wieght. Your overall setup should be something you come up with, we all drive differently ask any pro, Ryan Cavalerri will be the first one to give you his setup becuase he knows its not going to make you any faster the pro's setup's are the way they want the car to be, to make this easy they set the car up so that it drives in such a way that the car matches there preceptions of what the car should be doing based on the input they are giving there car through the Radio. This magic setup is something they and there team mates spend a lot of time perfecting, if you really want to put a good setup on your car start with the base setup and a well built car then go from there adressing one problem at a time and making only one cahnge to the car at a time so as not to get too far off on your suspension tuning. If you do it this way you end up keeping better mental notes and learning your cars dynamics so you know what to change to make the car better for you.
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