Hey guys, newbie here...(to this forum at least)...
Recently purchased a used Recoil pro from Fleabay and right now im looking at my options for a motor choice. Brushless is the way I would like to go.
Oh before I continue, I did want to say also, I have read through all 30 pages on this thread (what a tiring way to spend a sunday) and it has given me a better understanding of setups for this thing. I have found that this seems to be about the best Sportwerks Recoil tech thread/forum I have found.
First off, is there a instruction booklet (manual) that comes with the pro edition? I have only been able to find the RTR version manual on Horizon Hobbies webpage. Which isn't all that helpful for trying to set this up to be honest.
Reason, my adjustable turnbuckles all have different inner ball end to ball end widths when measured on my digital caliper. I have no idea where 0 degrees camber would be on this car to reset it and change it to what i want. Is there a camber measuring tool that can be used w/ the Recoil to figure that out? I know I saw a steel ruler in the RTR manual.
Motor... the guys I run with are using the Dynamite C4 BL motors and so far have nothing bad to say about them. This was my initial choice. However, after flipping around this thread and reading about the Wraith 7K motor it made me want to consider that one instead. My only concern, how would performance of the Wraith 7K be with a 6 cell NIMH pack? Reason being, my r/c club does not allow LIPO's to be run. So my only choice is NIMH.
I'am not looking to have the fastest Recoil so that it blows up driveline parts, nor to have a "stock speed" brushed motor Recoil. But something that is efficient and fast enough without being complete overkill. I might be racing the Recoil this summer outdoors (parking lot) and in the winter time in a basement Ozite carpet track. Which would be a tight and twisty track and no real big straight-aways for high speed. There are old videos on Youtube of the track (Search for NRCC track and you will see them).
So, a torquey motor would probably be better for a tight / twisty track vs top end speed. I have seen the suggestions about airplane motors as well, but was a bit confused on which one to look into. I would also be looking for one that does not require cutting the rear deck to install. So, if there is a torquey airplane motor that fits, please advise.
Mamba 25 would probably be my ESC of choice for now as well.
As part of the package I bought I do have a selection of foam tires to run, different springs as well. Currently the car came with cut gold VCS shocks, which after thumbing through this thread seemed to be somewhat recommended. No idea on oil weight, I dumped what was in there out anyways.
Ball diffs, how tight should that single screw that threads into the diff be set at? Should it be fairly snug or somewhat loose to activate the balls? It looks like there is black grease and stock balls in there.
Hmmm, that basically starts out my questions. Yes I know that I wrote up a huge novel for my first post, but I also wanted to get my questions noted.
I am wondering everyones opinions on this...: I am looking to upgrade to a more powerful brushed motor for the recoil (and esc) but it sounds like a lot of peeps then have trouble with thier car holding up to the hop ups...
I am wondering everyones opinions on this...: I am looking to upgrade to a more powerful brushed motor for the recoil (and esc) but it sounds like a lot of peeps then have trouble with thier car holding up to the hop ups...
Exactly what I dont want to do with my up and coming Recoil.
We have 3 guys that run recoils, one runs a 6800 CC Mamba BL, one an 8000kv Dynamite C4 and the last guy runs the 9200kv C4. Performance wise, the 6800 was leaving the 8000/9200 behind and they were just off of nitro times.
Which is why im curious to see the Wraith up here to be different. As long as it isnt a waste of time with nimh.
the wraith is a good motor, a good bit on the ridiculous side, but a good motor. it will work fine on 6c nimh. 6800 or 8000 castle motor will be more controllable (which is y it deos the best times @ your track)
micro man - i got one now im comin for ya @ nats
__________________
Mike Gee
Team Driver For: Exotek/Castle/Psycho Cells/GQ Tires/Darkside Designz/Rad Racing
Proud Supporter of: MRL (Micro Racing League) / Final Thoughts RC Club
Glad to see some posting, thought everyone left there for a while. Nerve...
which motor is best ??? that argument will continue for a long time. The first thing to do is get the car to handle !! Then worry about the speed...you mentioned short technical tracks....I raced my recoil last winter on a short technical RCP foam track, both stock and modified classes with same car. We had a small number of brushless guys in the mod class and many with some form of modified motor. I was able to win overall class champion in both stock and mod class with a stock Recoil, all stock with factory radio and rec/speed control. The reason was I worked on my car to get it to handle correctly. If you run on large long tracks then worry about the motor, until then get the car to handle, that is the secret. Many times slower can be faster !!! My only upgrades to the Recoil were CVD's, alum shocks, adjustable tie rod and turnbuckles and the steering ball bearings. Be sure to properly breakin the stock motor and switch to trinity XXX brushes right away, the stock brushes are the motors initial problem. Hope this helps...git er done !!
Well, its not really about "what motor is best" kinda question. Just I was looking for more information on that Wraith. Initially I would have just gone w/ the Dynamite C4 motors, because that is what is being run by others. So if there was something that would make the Wraith more worthwhile to buy vs the Dynamite, then I would.
Where I race, it is more of a "family" orientated race setup. It isn't about dominating, it isnt about points, it isnt about trophies, it isn't about money, it just about going out and running on a track with other guys/gals.
My first step, is to get it rebuilt...LOL. Right now it is still sitting in pieces on my desk and I currently do not have any motors for it. When I bought it off Ebay it was only a roller setup. So it already has CVDs, turnbuckles, bearings etc. Just lacking a motor / esc for now. I will have three Elite 1500 6cell packs ready for it when I finish it off.
I understand what you are saying, sometimes the slower cars end up doing more laps because they aren't crashing due to overkill on speeds. From racing a Micro RS4 this past winter, I would still like to start with a BL motor and see where that leads me.
Geeunit mentioned the Wraith was a bit on the ridiculous side, so I would imagine then that motor is more built for all out speed?. Even when using NIMH.
Right now I was following post#451 from Sydewynder for my setup on this car. I went with his suggestions for shock oil and will try his other settings as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by airshot
Glad to see some posting, thought everyone left there for a while. Nerve...
which motor is best ??? that argument will continue for a long time. The first thing to do is get the car to handle !! Then worry about the speed...you mentioned short technical tracks....I raced my recoil last winter on a short technical RCP foam track, both stock and modified classes with same car. We had a small number of brushless guys in the mod class and many with some form of modified motor. I was able to win overall class champion in both stock and mod class with a stock Recoil, all stock with factory radio and rec/speed control. The reason was I worked on my car to get it to handle correctly. If you run on large long tracks then worry about the motor, until then get the car to handle, that is the secret. Many times slower can be faster !!! My only upgrades to the Recoil were CVD's, alum shocks, adjustable tie rod and turnbuckles and the steering ball bearings. Be sure to properly breakin the stock motor and switch to trinity XXX brushes right away, the stock brushes are the motors initial problem. Hope this helps...git er done !!
the wraith is a bigger size can and 7700kv, it has some ponies. it may not be too bad on nimh in a recoil, but itl be way faster than stock. something like a 5400 or a 6800 will be more controllable, and with those you can always throw in a 3s lipo for the insame speed runs
__________________
Mike Gee
Team Driver For: Exotek/Castle/Psycho Cells/GQ Tires/Darkside Designz/Rad Racing
Proud Supporter of: MRL (Micro Racing League) / Final Thoughts RC Club
Your post did not mention whether your batts of choice were lipo or nmh, but if you have not already tried them the lipo's will really wake up the brushed motors. I run a 1700 mah 12c lipo in my recoil in the mod class (recoil is all stock) and have no trouble keeping up with the brushless on our short track. If any of the peeps in r/c land have not tried lipo's, the price has come down to almost as low as good nmh batts, but way more power!! Lipo's are still less cost than fancy motors, just be sure you have lipo charging equipment.................
Thanks Airshot! I have been looking at them in the tower hobbies catalog...but uh, yeah these that I have, are nimh.
And I have a question, If my chassis has a ride height of about 7mm but the body is lowered to the ground, will it still want to flip more???
yes, if youre trying to defeat traction roll the chassis needs to be low, not just the body. not only does the lower ride height lower everything, but it will make the car roll a little less. for carpet, id start with 4.5mm and asphalt 5.5. also, if youre running foam tires, try putting some ca glue on teh front tire sidewalls, that will help any traction roll situation
__________________
Mike Gee
Team Driver For: Exotek/Castle/Psycho Cells/GQ Tires/Darkside Designz/Rad Racing
Proud Supporter of: MRL (Micro Racing League) / Final Thoughts RC Club
Lowering the chasis is a must, mine sets only 3mm in the front and 4mm in the rear. I run pink foams on carpet and RCP track. Only set higher if on a rough surface, then again the Recoil is not made for rough surfaces. If on a tight track then run slight toe out, on a large fast track then dead straight or very slight toe in. Give your car a degree of camber, and shim the diffs if running stock diffs. I run 50 wt oil in front and rear shocks. Hope this helps.
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