2008 Region 8 ROAR Offroad Regionals
08-14-2008, 05:11 PM
#32
NO ONE BUY THIS FROM PORTER.....
If you are truly one of his friends, you will force him to keep it so he has nothing to Bitch about when the snow starts to fall and he can race at Jakes. I'm sorry but this is one of his BAD habits and we need to publicly teach him a lesson. You know I'm right!
If you are truly one of his friends, you will force him to keep it so he has nothing to Bitch about when the snow starts to fall and he can race at Jakes. I'm sorry but this is one of his BAD habits and we need to publicly teach him a lesson. You know I'm right!
08-14-2008, 09:56 PM
#36
Avatar of the week club. That's funny.
Last edited by rcfisher; 08-15-2008 at 01:55 AM.
The new HotBodies looks pretty cool also
08-15-2008, 05:13 PM
#38
08-16-2008, 08:33 AM
#41
RE: LIPO RULES FROM ROAR GOOD LUCK
Lithium Polymer battery packs may be used to power electric racing cars if a Certification
Of Compliance has been received and accepted by ROAR from the manufacturers of the
battery packs. The Certification of Compliance indicates that the Lithium Polymer cells
internal to the battery packs have been tested in accordance with UN T1-T8, the United
Nations Recommendations on the Transport of Dangerous Goods, Manual of Test and
Criteria (ST/SG/AC.10.11/Rev.4) and passed the acceptance criteria. Lithium Polymer
battery packs that do not have UN certification must pass the ROAR tests listed below
and performed by the ROAR Li-Poly Test laboratory. Certification of Compliance to these
test requirements and acceptance criteria shall be provided by the Original Manufacturer
of the batteries. The Certification of Compliance will apply to all Lithium-Polymer products
from the Original Manufacturer and provided on a one time basis. The Certification of
Compliance can be sent directly to ROAR by the Original Manufacturer or supplied to
ROAR by the Value Added Manufacturer that distributes the batteries. A Value Added
Manufacturer must also provide ROAR a Statement of Origin identifying the Original
Manufacturer of the cells used in the battery pack and the number of battery packs
provided for sale within North America. The Value Added Manufacturer performs the
assembly of cells into battery packs, installs the hard protective case and provides the
electrical hook up points. The Original Manufacturer is the manufacturer of the individual
cells.
8.3.2.2.1 Li-Poly battery packs must have a hard, protective case that surrounds the cell(s) in
the racing application. A factory encased hard shell pack is mandated for race
durability reasons that stem from the vulnerability of Lipo cells to physical damage.
Any physical distortion, denting or puncture to the cells will cause either an immediate
35
or long term safety risk. A hard cased pack reduces this risk significantly by protecting
the cells from crash damage, battery ejection, and general wear and tear at the track.
ROAR defines the "hard case" as a case made of ABS or similar type material. The
case shall consist of two (2) halves with each half being constructed from a single
mold that is not easily pliable and retains it shape without any exterior or interior
support. Both the top and bottom sections of the case must be secured together by
glue, double-sided tape or heat seal with a label across the seam stating "ROAR
Approved" in such a manner that separation of the case to remove or replace the cells
will destroy the case and/or label and render it unusable in competition. The case
must be installed by the manufacturer or Value added manufacturer no end User
installed cases are acceptable. The case will protect the cells from damage on all
sides and will completely cover all cells having only openings for wire connections.
Any modification to the factory approved hard case will make the pack ineligible for
participation in ROAR events.
Note: Approved batteries will be required to have "ROAR Approved" Label
across the seam by Jan 2009. ROAR will have a grandfather clause until Jan
2009 for all approved cells at competition on the Label rule.
8.3.2.2.2 The maximum case size shall be as follows:
Length: 139mm +0mm/-3mm
Width: 47mm +0mm/-2mm
Height: 25.1mm +0mm/-3.0mm
The battery pack shall have leads extending from the case for the positive and
negative electrical connections using wire of adequate size to handle discharge rates
acceptable to racing applications. Alternatively, the case shall have external
connection points for these wires clearly marked positive and negative so the user
can apply the lead wires. Markings on the case are required stating the rated voltage
and capacity of the battery. The Value Added Manufacturers name and/or logo shall
be easily readable on the case. Individual cells used in the construction of the battery
shall be rated at 3.7 VDC and the pack shall be 2 cells in series.
8.3.1.2 ROAR Impact/Drop Test
8.3.1.2.1 The cells of the battery pack shall experience no loss of mass, no leakage, no
venting, no rapid disassembly, and no rise in temperature. The case shall not splinter
or shatter in a manner that would create shrapnel and potentially puncture the cell
inside.
8.3.1.2.2 The fully charged battery pack shall be dropped from a height of 5 feet to a flat
concrete floor. The battery pack shall land flat on the floor during the drop.
8.3.1.3 ROAR Overcharge Test
8.3.1.3.1 The battery pack shall no display rapid disassembly resulting from Thermal Runaway.
8.3.1.3.2 The fully charged battery pack shall be charged to a value up to 12.0 VDC at a rate of
1 times the capacity of the cells in the battery pack for a period of 30 minutes
(Example: 5000 mah charge rate is 5 amps).
8.3.1.4 ROAR External Short Circuit Test
8.3.1.4.1 The battery pack shall not display rapid disassembly resulting from Thermal
Runaway.
8.3.1.4.2 A 0.1 Ohm resistance shall be applied to a fully charged battery pack at room
temperature (70 deg F +/-10). The test is concluded when the temperature of the
battery pack returns to within10 deg of room temperature.
8.3.1.5 Li-Poly Battery Pack Approval
8.3.2.6.1 Li-Poly battery approvals will take place twice per year. Manufacturers applying
for approval shall submit 4 battery packs to the ROAR Li-Poly battery laboratory
before April 1st or before October 1st of each calendar year. The results of each
approval cycle will be announced either May 1st or November 1st of each calendar
year on the approved battery list on the ROAR Website. Please find the battery
approval form for Li-Poly batteries in the Approvals section of the ROAR website.
Detailed instructions for submitting Li-Poly battery packs are provided on that
form. A fee of $250.00 US is required to cover the testing costs by the laboratory.
36
8.3.1.6 General information about Li-Poly batteries.
8.3.1.6.1 Lithium Polymer packs must be charged with chargers capable of the industry
standard CC/CV (Constant Current/Constant Voltage) charge profile.
8.3.1.6.2 Li-Poly batteries may be charged to a maximum of 8.40V +/-0.04V. Overcharging is a
serious safety hazard and will not be tolerated.
8.3.1.6.3 All Lithium Polymer packs used for motor power must be charged inside a “Lipo Sack”
or similar fire mitigation device proven to withstand a minimum of an 8.4v 5000mah
Lithium Polymer pack failing destructively without showing external flame.
8.3.1.6.4 A Lipo battery pack is damaged when any of the following rules are broken. The
damage is cumulative and cannot be reversed. These rules provide the safest
operation and longest pack life. Going outside these rules may result in a destructive
pack failure.
8.3.1.6.4.1 Do not over discharge Lithium Polymer battery packs and use a Proper ESC cutoff
voltage. Some newer speed controls give you the option to set a cutoff voltage, and
some do not. The cutoff voltage setting is working properly when the ESC does not
allow the motor to spin anymore when the pack voltage reaches this set cutoff. A
Lithium Polymer battery is damaged when it goes below a set voltage whether under
load or not. The lower the voltage and the longer it stays low, the more damage is
occurring to the cells. If your ESC doesn't have a setting for cutoff voltage, we strongly
suggest not using any Lipo pack with it unless you have a secondary device to cut off
the motor at the correct voltage. By the time the pack “feels soft” at the end of the run
or you notice any decrease in power, the pack has already been damaged. Consult
your Lipo pack manufacturer for the proper low voltage cutoff since this value varies
based on manufacturer.
8.3.1.6.4.2 The maximum safe temperature of a Lithium Polymer pack is 140degF. Generally the
pack temp will INCREASE for about 5-10mins after the run is over, so measure the
temperature of the pack immediately after the run and then again about 10 minutes
later. The faster the car is geared, the more amps the motor is drawing and the
battery is delivering. The less capable of outputting high current (amps) the pack is,
the more it will heat up with the same load (think IB4200's vs. NiCad 2400's on a mod
motor) Exceeding 140degF pack temperature causes damage, and the pack is also
less efficient at near critical temperatures.
8.3.1.6.4.3 Only charge Lithium Polymer packs with a charger that uses the industry standard
CC/CV charging algorithm for Lithium based batteries. There are two settings you will
need to either set or verify on your charger each and every time before you begin
charging a pack. The first is the pack voltage or cell count (each charger uses
different nomenclature). If your charger is asking for the voltage of the pack, the
choices are 3.7v (one cell), 7.4v (two cell), and 11.1v and beyond (3+cells). ROAR
legal Lithium packs are all two cells, or 7.4v packs so set your charger accordingly.
Some chargers ask for the cell count of the pack (one cell, two cells, and etc.) so you
would set it for a two cell pack. The next setting is the charging rate. Lithium Polymer
battery packs not only show no performance benefit from charging at higher than
recommended rates, but they can be damaged by charging rates that are too high.
The standard charging rate is “1C” which means the actual capacity of the pack in
Milliamp hours. We charge in Amps not Milliamps, so divide the Milliamp Hours (Mah)
of your pack by 1,000 to get your proper charging rate. For a 4800mah pack,
4800mah divided by 1,000 = 4.8 Amp charge rate. For a 3200Mah pack = 3.2 Amps,
and a 5000Mah pack = 5.0 Amps. Unless specifically recommended by the
manufacturer with no loss of cycle life, a maximum of 1C charge rate should always
be used.
8.3.2.7.4 Lithium Polymer packs that will not be run for more than a month or two should be
stored approximately half charged. Do not store them fully charged and do not store
them near fully discharged (down to 6.0v) or damage will occur. The best way to know
the charge state of a Lipo is to use the Mah displayed on your charger when charging
from fully discharged. For a 5000mah pack driven all the way to cutoff, charge it until
you have 2500mah back into the pack and disconnect it from the charger for storage.
Or use the discharge function on your charger, and discharge a fully charged pack to
1/2 of its capacity. So for a fully charged 5000mah pack, discharge 2500mah from it
before long term storage.
37
8.3.2.7.5 There are six
Of Compliance has been received and accepted by ROAR from the manufacturers of the
battery packs. The Certification of Compliance indicates that the Lithium Polymer cells
internal to the battery packs have been tested in accordance with UN T1-T8, the United
Nations Recommendations on the Transport of Dangerous Goods, Manual of Test and
Criteria (ST/SG/AC.10.11/Rev.4) and passed the acceptance criteria. Lithium Polymer
battery packs that do not have UN certification must pass the ROAR tests listed below
and performed by the ROAR Li-Poly Test laboratory. Certification of Compliance to these
test requirements and acceptance criteria shall be provided by the Original Manufacturer
of the batteries. The Certification of Compliance will apply to all Lithium-Polymer products
from the Original Manufacturer and provided on a one time basis. The Certification of
Compliance can be sent directly to ROAR by the Original Manufacturer or supplied to
ROAR by the Value Added Manufacturer that distributes the batteries. A Value Added
Manufacturer must also provide ROAR a Statement of Origin identifying the Original
Manufacturer of the cells used in the battery pack and the number of battery packs
provided for sale within North America. The Value Added Manufacturer performs the
assembly of cells into battery packs, installs the hard protective case and provides the
electrical hook up points. The Original Manufacturer is the manufacturer of the individual
cells.
8.3.2.2.1 Li-Poly battery packs must have a hard, protective case that surrounds the cell(s) in
the racing application. A factory encased hard shell pack is mandated for race
durability reasons that stem from the vulnerability of Lipo cells to physical damage.
Any physical distortion, denting or puncture to the cells will cause either an immediate
35
or long term safety risk. A hard cased pack reduces this risk significantly by protecting
the cells from crash damage, battery ejection, and general wear and tear at the track.
ROAR defines the "hard case" as a case made of ABS or similar type material. The
case shall consist of two (2) halves with each half being constructed from a single
mold that is not easily pliable and retains it shape without any exterior or interior
support. Both the top and bottom sections of the case must be secured together by
glue, double-sided tape or heat seal with a label across the seam stating "ROAR
Approved" in such a manner that separation of the case to remove or replace the cells
will destroy the case and/or label and render it unusable in competition. The case
must be installed by the manufacturer or Value added manufacturer no end User
installed cases are acceptable. The case will protect the cells from damage on all
sides and will completely cover all cells having only openings for wire connections.
Any modification to the factory approved hard case will make the pack ineligible for
participation in ROAR events.
Note: Approved batteries will be required to have "ROAR Approved" Label
across the seam by Jan 2009. ROAR will have a grandfather clause until Jan
2009 for all approved cells at competition on the Label rule.
8.3.2.2.2 The maximum case size shall be as follows:
Length: 139mm +0mm/-3mm
Width: 47mm +0mm/-2mm
Height: 25.1mm +0mm/-3.0mm
The battery pack shall have leads extending from the case for the positive and
negative electrical connections using wire of adequate size to handle discharge rates
acceptable to racing applications. Alternatively, the case shall have external
connection points for these wires clearly marked positive and negative so the user
can apply the lead wires. Markings on the case are required stating the rated voltage
and capacity of the battery. The Value Added Manufacturers name and/or logo shall
be easily readable on the case. Individual cells used in the construction of the battery
shall be rated at 3.7 VDC and the pack shall be 2 cells in series.
8.3.1.2 ROAR Impact/Drop Test
8.3.1.2.1 The cells of the battery pack shall experience no loss of mass, no leakage, no
venting, no rapid disassembly, and no rise in temperature. The case shall not splinter
or shatter in a manner that would create shrapnel and potentially puncture the cell
inside.
8.3.1.2.2 The fully charged battery pack shall be dropped from a height of 5 feet to a flat
concrete floor. The battery pack shall land flat on the floor during the drop.
8.3.1.3 ROAR Overcharge Test
8.3.1.3.1 The battery pack shall no display rapid disassembly resulting from Thermal Runaway.
8.3.1.3.2 The fully charged battery pack shall be charged to a value up to 12.0 VDC at a rate of
1 times the capacity of the cells in the battery pack for a period of 30 minutes
(Example: 5000 mah charge rate is 5 amps).
8.3.1.4 ROAR External Short Circuit Test
8.3.1.4.1 The battery pack shall not display rapid disassembly resulting from Thermal
Runaway.
8.3.1.4.2 A 0.1 Ohm resistance shall be applied to a fully charged battery pack at room
temperature (70 deg F +/-10). The test is concluded when the temperature of the
battery pack returns to within10 deg of room temperature.
8.3.1.5 Li-Poly Battery Pack Approval
8.3.2.6.1 Li-Poly battery approvals will take place twice per year. Manufacturers applying
for approval shall submit 4 battery packs to the ROAR Li-Poly battery laboratory
before April 1st or before October 1st of each calendar year. The results of each
approval cycle will be announced either May 1st or November 1st of each calendar
year on the approved battery list on the ROAR Website. Please find the battery
approval form for Li-Poly batteries in the Approvals section of the ROAR website.
Detailed instructions for submitting Li-Poly battery packs are provided on that
form. A fee of $250.00 US is required to cover the testing costs by the laboratory.
36
8.3.1.6 General information about Li-Poly batteries.
8.3.1.6.1 Lithium Polymer packs must be charged with chargers capable of the industry
standard CC/CV (Constant Current/Constant Voltage) charge profile.
8.3.1.6.2 Li-Poly batteries may be charged to a maximum of 8.40V +/-0.04V. Overcharging is a
serious safety hazard and will not be tolerated.
8.3.1.6.3 All Lithium Polymer packs used for motor power must be charged inside a “Lipo Sack”
or similar fire mitigation device proven to withstand a minimum of an 8.4v 5000mah
Lithium Polymer pack failing destructively without showing external flame.
8.3.1.6.4 A Lipo battery pack is damaged when any of the following rules are broken. The
damage is cumulative and cannot be reversed. These rules provide the safest
operation and longest pack life. Going outside these rules may result in a destructive
pack failure.
8.3.1.6.4.1 Do not over discharge Lithium Polymer battery packs and use a Proper ESC cutoff
voltage. Some newer speed controls give you the option to set a cutoff voltage, and
some do not. The cutoff voltage setting is working properly when the ESC does not
allow the motor to spin anymore when the pack voltage reaches this set cutoff. A
Lithium Polymer battery is damaged when it goes below a set voltage whether under
load or not. The lower the voltage and the longer it stays low, the more damage is
occurring to the cells. If your ESC doesn't have a setting for cutoff voltage, we strongly
suggest not using any Lipo pack with it unless you have a secondary device to cut off
the motor at the correct voltage. By the time the pack “feels soft” at the end of the run
or you notice any decrease in power, the pack has already been damaged. Consult
your Lipo pack manufacturer for the proper low voltage cutoff since this value varies
based on manufacturer.
8.3.1.6.4.2 The maximum safe temperature of a Lithium Polymer pack is 140degF. Generally the
pack temp will INCREASE for about 5-10mins after the run is over, so measure the
temperature of the pack immediately after the run and then again about 10 minutes
later. The faster the car is geared, the more amps the motor is drawing and the
battery is delivering. The less capable of outputting high current (amps) the pack is,
the more it will heat up with the same load (think IB4200's vs. NiCad 2400's on a mod
motor) Exceeding 140degF pack temperature causes damage, and the pack is also
less efficient at near critical temperatures.
8.3.1.6.4.3 Only charge Lithium Polymer packs with a charger that uses the industry standard
CC/CV charging algorithm for Lithium based batteries. There are two settings you will
need to either set or verify on your charger each and every time before you begin
charging a pack. The first is the pack voltage or cell count (each charger uses
different nomenclature). If your charger is asking for the voltage of the pack, the
choices are 3.7v (one cell), 7.4v (two cell), and 11.1v and beyond (3+cells). ROAR
legal Lithium packs are all two cells, or 7.4v packs so set your charger accordingly.
Some chargers ask for the cell count of the pack (one cell, two cells, and etc.) so you
would set it for a two cell pack. The next setting is the charging rate. Lithium Polymer
battery packs not only show no performance benefit from charging at higher than
recommended rates, but they can be damaged by charging rates that are too high.
The standard charging rate is “1C” which means the actual capacity of the pack in
Milliamp hours. We charge in Amps not Milliamps, so divide the Milliamp Hours (Mah)
of your pack by 1,000 to get your proper charging rate. For a 4800mah pack,
4800mah divided by 1,000 = 4.8 Amp charge rate. For a 3200Mah pack = 3.2 Amps,
and a 5000Mah pack = 5.0 Amps. Unless specifically recommended by the
manufacturer with no loss of cycle life, a maximum of 1C charge rate should always
be used.
8.3.2.7.4 Lithium Polymer packs that will not be run for more than a month or two should be
stored approximately half charged. Do not store them fully charged and do not store
them near fully discharged (down to 6.0v) or damage will occur. The best way to know
the charge state of a Lipo is to use the Mah displayed on your charger when charging
from fully discharged. For a 5000mah pack driven all the way to cutoff, charge it until
you have 2500mah back into the pack and disconnect it from the charger for storage.
Or use the discharge function on your charger, and discharge a fully charged pack to
1/2 of its capacity. So for a fully charged 5000mah pack, discharge 2500mah from it
before long term storage.
37
8.3.2.7.5 There are six
08-16-2008, 08:38 AM
#42
08-16-2008, 04:23 PM
#43
all of the lipo's that are legal are hard cased
i.e. core, orion, reedy, losi are the few that i can remember
i.e. core, orion, reedy, losi are the few that i can remember
08-17-2008, 10:47 PM
#45
FYI from the NMRC site,
No Li-Po allowed in building, unless in hard pack. Soft pack not allowed. Charging Li-Po ONLY allowed in charging bags or in planter saucers, available at track.
If that helps..
Gonna try to make this race, dont know about the fall classic...
On the topic of Porter... If your that fast, you can do anything ya want!
Dude you wer GONE this weekend! Like a freakin rocket! Congrats!
No Li-Po allowed in building, unless in hard pack. Soft pack not allowed. Charging Li-Po ONLY allowed in charging bags or in planter saucers, available at track.
If that helps..
Gonna try to make this race, dont know about the fall classic...
On the topic of Porter... If your that fast, you can do anything ya want!
Dude you wer GONE this weekend! Like a freakin rocket! Congrats!