R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Like Tree1Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 01-25-2017, 05:18 PM   #46
Tech Elite
 
303slowdown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Rapid City SD.
Posts: 2,288
Trader Rating: 21 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bertrandsv87 View Post
I guess 25.5t motors will be getting alot of attention from now on, but wouldn't it be better to gain power by reducing the car's rotational mass instead ???
This is a thread about motors not weight.
__________________
Ryan Borgheiinck
303slowdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2017, 05:35 PM   #47
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 150
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kregger View Post
I asked because the OP was asking about the D4.
Unless I read it wrong the D4 25.5 is being listed as roar approved.
I definitely was, but I figured I would let the discussion happen since it was way more informative then my original question would have allowed for.
djgrom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2017, 05:36 PM   #48
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 150
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bertrandsv87 View Post
I guess 25.5t motors will be getting alot of attention from now on, but wouldn't it be better to gain power by reducing the car's rotational mass instead ???
The short answer is yes. I used to race motorcycles and for every pound of rotational weight we could remove it was roughly like the bike dropped five pounds.
djgrom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2017, 05:53 AM   #49
Tech Elite
 
Aaron P's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Kansas...unfortunately.
Posts: 3,380
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

If I remember correctly, every gram of rotating mass is worth 3 grams static.
__________________
Proud Privateer
Aaron P is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2017, 07:25 AM   #50
Tech Addict
 
scirocco14's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Asheville, NC
Posts: 526
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Default

And every impact with the wall is worth 100g.
__________________
Mark C. USVTA #115 TC4 & Xray T4 '13, USGT #115 Xray T4 '13
USVTA-F1 #115 F103/4 & F1R3 & WTF1 FC-16. Tamiya M05 M06
Bush River RC, The RUG at King, Ho B Max Raceway, Easley RC
scirocco14 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2017, 08:00 AM   #51
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 150
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

So since we all agree that the D4 motor meets ROAR specs but is not ROAR approved has anyone used the 24K, I am looking at the motiv as well but not sure how it compares directly to the NOVAK boss.
djgrom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2017, 08:06 AM   #52
Tech Addict
 
scirocco14's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Asheville, NC
Posts: 526
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by djgrom View Post
So since we all agree that the D4 motor meets ROAR specs but is not ROAR approved has anyone used the 24K, I am looking at the motiv as well but not sure how it compares directly to the NOVAK boss.
I'm running the Novak Boss and the Motiv 25.5 in my USVTA cars (I have two...one is primarily a loaner). I've won A-mains locally with both motors, and beaten and have been beaten by the 24K.

The motors are all so close you'll be fine with any of them. Each has to be geared slightly differently to make it work optimally.

Mark
__________________
Mark C. USVTA #115 TC4 & Xray T4 '13, USGT #115 Xray T4 '13
USVTA-F1 #115 F103/4 & F1R3 & WTF1 FC-16. Tamiya M05 M06
Bush River RC, The RUG at King, Ho B Max Raceway, Easley RC
scirocco14 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2017, 08:07 AM   #53
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 150
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by scirocco14 View Post
I'm running the Novak Boss and the Motiv 25.5 in my USVTA cars (I have two...one is primarily a loaner). I've won A-mains locally with both motors, and beaten and have been beaten by the 24K.

The motors are all so close you'll be fine with any of them. Each has to be geared slightly differently to make it work optimally.

Mark
How do you gear the boss motor? I keep playing around with the gearing and get pretty close but think I miss the sweet spot.
djgrom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2017, 08:15 AM   #54
Tech Addict
 
scirocco14's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Asheville, NC
Posts: 526
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by djgrom View Post
How do you gear the boss motor? I keep playing around with the gearing and get pretty close but think I miss the sweet spot.

Depends on your track, motor timing, etc.

Interesting experiment. My friend was messing around with gearing on his Novak and started at 3.8FDR on our medium sized track. He kept going down on the pinion, one tooth at a time. From 3.8 to 4.5 FDR, the lap times did not change signficantly. In fact, he got a little faster at first and then it wasn't until he went over 4.5 that the lap times started to drop off a little. Motor temps dropped quite a bit though.

So that just shows there's a pretty wide window for gearing.

Mark
__________________
Mark C. USVTA #115 TC4 & Xray T4 '13, USGT #115 Xray T4 '13
USVTA-F1 #115 F103/4 & F1R3 & WTF1 FC-16. Tamiya M05 M06
Bush River RC, The RUG at King, Ho B Max Raceway, Easley RC
scirocco14 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2017, 08:21 AM   #55
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 150
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by scirocco14 View Post
Depends on your track, motor timing, etc.

Interesting experiment. My friend was messing around with gearing on his Novak and started at 3.8FDR on our medium sized track. He kept going down on the pinion, one tooth at a time. From 3.8 to 4.5 FDR, the lap times did not change signficantly. In fact, he got a little faster at first and then it wasn't until he went over 4.5 that the lap times started to drop off a little. Motor temps dropped quite a bit though.

So that just shows there's a pretty wide window for gearing.

Mark
I have the motor timing set all he way up to the end mark but not past. I think now you are allowed to advanced it more I would have to check. We set up a track in the parking lot every weekend, I would have to measure it but I think it is 50x120 how we do it. Generally have more turns then straights. So far I have tended to gear the motor more on the torque side so I can get to max speed quicker even if it is slower between turns but I am not sure if that really is the best, just my theory.
djgrom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2017, 08:25 AM   #56
Tech Addict
 
scirocco14's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Asheville, NC
Posts: 526
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by djgrom View Post
I have the motor timing set all he way up to the end mark but not past. I think now you are allowed to advanced it more I would have to check. We set up a track in the parking lot every weekend, I would have to measure it but I think it is 50x120 how we do it. Generally have more turns then straights. So far I have tended to gear the motor more on the torque side so I can get to max speed quicker even if it is slower between turns but I am not sure if that really is the best, just my theory.
Only thing that matters is lap time. So don't worry about if your car is faster/slower on straights than others. Adjust gearing and/or timing and look at your top 5 or top 10 average.

Mark
__________________
Mark C. USVTA #115 TC4 & Xray T4 '13, USGT #115 Xray T4 '13
USVTA-F1 #115 F103/4 & F1R3 & WTF1 FC-16. Tamiya M05 M06
Bush River RC, The RUG at King, Ho B Max Raceway, Easley RC
scirocco14 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2017, 08:27 AM   #57
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 150
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by scirocco14 View Post
Only thing that matters is lap time. So don't worry about if your car is faster/slower on straights than others. Adjust gearing and/or timing and look at your top 5 or top 10 average.

Mark
Wow I totally wrote that wrong. I have it geared for more torque so I can get to top speed between turns faster between each turn even though I sacrifice top speed it seems to suit our tracks better.
djgrom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2017, 08:37 AM   #58
Tech Champion
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,080
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Good to know that the novak is close to all the other motors.
Mass/ rotational mass will be critical in VTA since everybody builds their own tires: lighter foams might account for over 10gram less per tire or more in addition to the lighter drivetrain... That might make it seem like one motor is way faster than another with the same gearing.... Yeah I know this is a motor thread, but motors don't make any contact with the ground...
bertrandsv87 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2017, 08:41 AM   #59
Tech Champion
 
DARKSIDE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Nashville-Memphis
Posts: 8,449
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

USVTA rules state you must use stock foams that come with the HPI tires.
__________________
Myron "BATTMAN" Kinnard
Team Associated/Reedy Powered/PROTOform
2017 U.S.VTA+ Southern Nationals in Music City U.S.A.
Sept 21-24th @ Thunder RC Raceway
1172 Park Ave, Murfreesboro, TN 37129
DARKSIDE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2017, 08:43 AM   #60
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 150
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bertrandsv87 View Post
Good to know that the novak is close to all the other motors.
Mass/ rotational mass will be critical in VTA since everybody builds their own tires: lighter foams might account for over 10gram less per tire or more in addition to the lighter drivetrain... That might make it seem like one motor is way faster than another with the same gearing.... Yeah I know this is a motor thread, but motors don't make any contact with the ground...
I think I am going to get another thread going to talk about VTA performance tips and discussion. I don't mind just using this thread though. It has been way more informative then I thought it would be. Where do you get lighter foam for the tires? I haven't thought about it but I have a little scale I should weigh the wheels I use and see if there is a better option.
djgrom is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
U.S. Vintage Trans-Am Racing Part 2 IBLib Electric On-Road 10709 Today 08:53 AM
Novak Havoc 2S with Trinity Monster Locked? Delawareguy Electric On-Road 6 12-05-2011 01:59 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 03:35 PM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net