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Old 12-18-2016, 10:19 AM   #361
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It amazes me how many ppl still think 2 motors of the same kv will therefore be equal. I can show plenty of dyno runs which prove otherwise.
That's on the manufactures, and is their fault. If they can't come up with a practical solution then they should not be on the roar approved list.

It's all in the name of taking your money.
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Old 12-18-2016, 10:38 AM   #362
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Sales keep the rc industry alive. Companies stay in business because of motor wars. Start limiting things too much and you kill the hobby completely.
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Old 12-18-2016, 11:12 AM   #363
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Sales keep the rc industry alive. Companies stay in business because of motor wars. Start limiting things too much and you kill the hobby completely.
This is what I hear a lot, but is it?

Remember when brushless was introduced? In the 2 years afterward we had almost the ESC of the month to get. In this war of getting the latest stuff people were tired to buy anything to keep up. I know for a lot of people the interest of a national competition was low. Then came the need of zero timing which is still widely used today.

My opinion for a stock class is that it needs to be equal and fair and sadly (for you) that comes with a bunch of rules. Rules that does not hurt the experience of real racing.
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Old 12-18-2016, 11:52 AM   #364
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This is what I hear a lot, but is it?

Remember when brushless was introduced? In the 2 years afterward we had almost the ESC of the month to get. In this war of getting the latest stuff people were tired to buy anything to keep up. I know for a lot of people the interest of a national competition was low. Then came the need of zero timing which is still widely used today.

My opinion for a stock class is that it needs to be equal and fair and sadly (for you) that comes with a bunch of rules. Rules that does not hurt the experience of real racing.
Unfortunately, yes, it is true. Sales have to continue at a very consistent rate. There's only a handful of companies out there that can sustain a profitable business without releasing something "innovative" (yes I use that term loosely) every six months. These companies we buy from are far from rich.
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Old 12-18-2016, 12:11 PM   #365
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Keeping the number of classes down also keeps cost down. We need to stop requesting a ridiculous number of different motors from manufacturers. If the difference on track is 1/2 second with a change of 4 turns, as described in one of the first post in thread, then a 25.5 AND 21.5 class is unnecessary. I defy anybody to tell which is which without a stopwatch unless they are on track together.
I say there should be a 25.5 class and then maybe a 17.5 before going to unlimited. After all, racing is about driver skill, not mechanical superiority
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Old 12-18-2016, 01:25 PM   #366
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Originally Posted by Roelof View Post
This is what I hear a lot, but is it?

Remember when brushless was introduced? In the 2 years afterward we had almost the ESC of the month to get. In this war of getting the latest stuff people were tired to buy anything to keep up. I know for a lot of people the interest of a national competition was low. Then came the need of zero timing which is still widely used today.

My opinion for a stock class is that it needs to be equal and fair and sadly (for you) that comes with a bunch of rules. Rules that does not hurt the experience of real racing.
What happened with the ESC war anyway? Was it the fact that it went to blinky and the war ended or did the manufactures level the playing field amongst themselves? I don't hear much about the latest and greatest ESCs anymore.
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Old 12-18-2016, 01:33 PM   #367
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What happened with the ESC war anyway? Was it the fact that it went to blinky and the war ended or did the manufactures level the playing field amongst themselves? I don't hear much about the latest and greatest ESCs anymore.
The firmware is now upgradable.
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Old 12-18-2016, 01:43 PM   #368
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The ESC war lasted for about 6 months, after which the difference between ESCs was near zero.
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Old 12-18-2016, 03:01 PM   #369
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It was easy with 25.5 since the motor class was new. Now it would have to be at least slightly below everything currently approved.
At some point, the line has to be drawn in the sand. The sooner the better. If it needs to be 57-ish milliohms terminal resistance at 25C to match the new motors, then let's do it and end this nonsense.

At the same time, prohibit:
skewed stators;
non-symmetrical pole laminations;
built-in dynamic timing;
and whatever else we can think of that isn't yet done, but could be.
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Old 12-18-2016, 03:13 PM   #370
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At some point, the line has to be drawn in the sand. The sooner the better. If it needs to be 57-ish milliohms terminal resistance at 25C to match the new motors, then let's do it and end this nonsense.

At the same time, prohibit:
skewed stators;
non-symmetrical pole laminations;
built-in dynamic timing;
and whatever else we can think of that isn't yet done, but could be.
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Old 12-18-2016, 03:27 PM   #371
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+1000
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Old 12-18-2016, 03:47 PM   #372
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Another thing to consider, offroad is a bigger part of the motor market by huge margins. What onroad wants isn't necessarily what offroad wants. So who wins this argument?
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Old 12-18-2016, 04:15 PM   #373
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Off-road runs almost exclusively Mod. I would say less than 10% runs 17.5. And no one runs a 21.5 or 25.5 off road. So for the "spec" motor classes onroad is where the money is at.
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Old 12-18-2016, 06:02 PM   #374
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The ESC war lasted for about 6 months, after which the difference between ESCs was near zero.
I don;'t know a Tekin RS / RS Pro is still a slug in a spec class blinky mode IMO, not sure why but just feels like 80% throttle compared to everything else.
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Old 12-18-2016, 06:32 PM   #375
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I don;'t know a Tekin RS / RS Pro is still a slug in a spec class blinky mode IMO, not sure why but just feels like 80% throttle compared to everything else.
I'm running a stock spec tekin gen 2 in one of my 17.5 TC cars and it doesn't seem to be lacking speed at all.
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