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Old 11-28-2016, 04:44 AM   #16
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I disagree. The TC4 needs too much hands-on experience (Dremel work, etc) to make it run right and will not accommodate a silver can motor. Besides at $150 USD it is way more expensive, has no body, ESC, motor, tires, or wheels and is old school imperial hardware.
What's stopping a silver can motor working in a TC4? Worked fine in my TC3 after I drilled the cam opening a touch wider.
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Old 11-28-2016, 05:33 AM   #17
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That is really idiotic. Why would Associated make the cam too small for silvercans?!

I withdraw my suggestion above. A spec chassis aimed at beginners on a budget can not require mods straight out of the box even though I maintain that the silvercan would be a poor choice of spec motor.

This is basically telling all their potential customers, no you can not buy this car because it is cheap and then run a cheap motor in it.

Epic fail.

New suggestion. Go with the cheap as chips TT chassis or take our friend's suggestion and go with the TB02.

PS. Just checked RCmart and they don't have any TB02 kits right now. The TT02 based kits are around the 80-90$ mark.
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Old 11-28-2016, 06:36 AM   #18
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Did you really just say the Associated TC4 is an epic fail because you can't gear a silver can motor high enough? You do know this car has been around 15 years, right? Plus the fact the car was discontinued 3 years ago, replaced by the RTR Apex.

You are never going to be able to "spec" out a chassis. This has been tried ad nauseum since the beginning of RC. I understand the concept, but it's never going to work. Let's face it, for someone to get into the hobby it's going to take quite a bit of coin. The best we can do is help new people on the local level.
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Old 11-28-2016, 06:38 AM   #19
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Carisma GT10RS RTR class

They actually run these cars as a spec class in Hong Kong
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Old 11-28-2016, 09:48 AM   #20
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If you where to pick a chassis to start a spec tc class what chassis would you go with?
Were you actually considering trying to start a new class or just spit balling? If we had enough new people I would agree to try and get something going. As it sits now the newer racers already bought a chassis of some type, best we can do is help them along in USGT.
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Old 11-28-2016, 10:23 AM   #21
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Did you really just say the Associated TC4 is an epic fail because you can't gear a silver can motor high enough? You do know this car has been around 15 years, right? Plus the fact the car was discontinued 3 years ago, replaced by the RTR Apex.

You are never going to be able to "spec" out a chassis. This has been tried ad nauseum since the beginning of RC. I understand the concept, but it's never going to work. Let's face it, for someone to get into the hobby it's going to take quite a bit of coin. The best we can do is help new people on the local level.
Correct.....the TC3 and TC3 will not accept a silver can motor. The motor cam will not fit unless you machine it to the point where is almost comes apart.

Yes......it is possible to have a spec, one-chassis class. My club did it years ago with the Hot Bodies Cyclone S RTR kit. These came complete with a 2400mah Nicad battery and we were allowed only to run what came in the box. This was a fantastic spec class and made for great racing. We also had a beginners class running the Tamiya TL-01 chassis kits. Again, this was a run what comes in the box class and the oval battery opening left racers with little options for lipo packs. We ran the Reedy 3000 lipo packs.
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Old 11-28-2016, 10:24 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by WagwanBumba View Post
Carisma GT10RS RTR class

They actually run these cars as a spec class in Hong Kong
Unfortunately, the OP is not from Hing Kong and this brand is obscure at best here. Kits and parts are mail order only and that makes for a horrible environment for new racers.
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Old 11-28-2016, 10:25 AM   #23
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That is really idiotic. Why would Associated make the cam too small for silvercans?!
Go ahead......try it for yourself.
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Old 11-28-2016, 10:33 AM   #24
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Did you really just say the Associated TC4 is an epic fail because you can't gear a silver can motor high enough? You do know this car has been around 15 years, right? Plus the fact the car was discontinued 3 years ago, replaced by the RTR Apex.

[...]
I am not sure what you are trying to suggest.

Tamiya has manufactured the TA02 chassis for two decades and it is still rubbish. And perhaps many others.
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Old 11-28-2016, 01:34 PM   #25
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Did you really just say the Associated TC4 is an epic fail because you can't gear a silver can motor high enough? You do know this car has been around 15 years, right? Plus the fact the car was discontinued 3 years ago, replaced by the RTR Apex.
No. It's not the gearing. A silver can literally won't fit in the car even without a pinion, as the bushing stub is too large to fit inside the motor cam. Also, the TC4 is still being sold, it hasn't been discontinued yet.
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Old 11-28-2016, 02:01 PM   #26
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If I may interject, I'm quite green still, maybe 5 practice sessions lasting 5-15mins each, on account of driving straight into a wall or deciding to change something that didn't work on account of my inexperience. I'm attempting to join vta and would love another class for my other chassis, plural (apparently chassis is spelled the same singular and plural). The support from the OG guys has been amazing, and if I'm honest they're most the reason I persevere week after week, broken part after part, scuffed fender after... you get the point. Now, 8-10 months ago when I started gathering rc stuffs I had no clue about club level organized racing, this forum has helped a ton, and the fact I have one of the best local tracks in the USA has helped too. Now, I do not understand the intricacies of the rc world like you all above, I only know my experiences, to give you an idea of my level of investment after 8-10 months our entire dining room is filled with boxes and bins of vehicles and parts, most useless to spec on-road racing in any competitive capacity. That's a bit frustrating now but I've learned alot, and I'm certain I'm not alone here. What if, with all thsee extra parts and cars, we (meaning each person at a given local track, and this Web based community when applicable) pool together and put together RTRs to loan, for the night or donated or kept at the track (owners choice), and try to invite friends, family, coworkers, girlfriends, moms, dads, mechanics, bosses, bartenders, masseuses, whatever etc. On a periodic practice or different alotted day/night every week or month. I know if I was introduced years ago I would've been hooked, but I had no idea how to enter the seemingly secret society of rc clubbers. I'm sure someone will point out why this won't work and I'll crawl back into my nerd hole until I am more educated, but the whole spec thing turns me off, I already have running cars, I'm not skilled enough to compete even if I had the top shelf stuff, but I'm having fun building, learning, crashing and building again. Do you remember those days? I know regardless how great a setup is if you can't drive it you don't win and conversely if you have a little skill you could win with even the lowliest rebranded Redcat bathtub chassis drift thing with sand for bearings and a motor from a cassette player. My point being if no one knows that club racing exists we can pontificate on hypotheticals until we're too old to remember what brushed motors were but there won't be anymore participation to pump money into any part of the industry, whilst all the players wither and die, i.e. Novak. (I understand the Chinese roll in novak's demise, just a loose example of how if the rc market was stronger there would be a place for higher end, less price obsessed manufacturers to survive). Not sure if this ramble makes the same amount of sense here as it did in my head, just thought I'd try to add to the conversation, because it could be an important debate. Thanks, Rooster-Nashville TN
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Old 11-28-2016, 02:05 PM   #27
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Did you really just say the Associated TC4 is an epic fail because you can't gear a silver can motor high enough? You do know this car has been around 15 years, right? Plus the fact the car was discontinued 3 years ago, replaced by the RTR Apex.

You are never going to be able to "spec" out a chassis. This has been tried ad nauseum since the beginning of RC. I understand the concept, but it's never going to work. Let's face it, for someone to get into the hobby it's going to take quite a bit of coin. The best we can do is help new people on the local level.
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Old 11-28-2016, 02:26 PM   #28
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And the "this motor won't fit into that" and "this is better that that" etc. Is too fine a point I think, the people the o.p. references don't know the finer points some of do, and ultimately for the purpose originally posed, does not matter. I, personally don't care if a spec rtr is 'only' $100 I'm not putting another bill into a tamiya kit that most likely will be useless to me the 2nd season, I have cars that were fairly competitive globally 5+ years ago, now it is my fault I have invested in out dated equipment but you know and I know that's the easiest/cheapest way to do it. Maybe a class spec'd on initial or overall price, or an eBay 2nd hand spec... as for spec turn motors, I got the 17.5s I could afford, they're not the latest great Team Scream that you have to have to win at the highest level but I'm not good enough so that doesn't matter to me, I like that I can be included with whatever orphaned 17.5 I can afford at the time, and get in there apologize to the fast guys as I accidently block them as they lap me for the 3rd time...on the first lap I just think this conversation is (almost) moot without the input of the people that which are the subject.
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Old 11-28-2016, 02:43 PM   #29
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When I began racing, R/C racing that is, ages ago, I hated that I had bought "on the cheap" only to have to spend again to get what I should've bought in the first place. A spec chassis class, and this is just my opinion, isn't conducive to club, in other words, organized racing. Look at the different levels of chassis at a TCS race. You have those that have spent very little to those who have purchased every available "Hop-up" Tamiya offers.

I was the former when I was young and racing. Had no money, and did everything on the cheap. I would cobble Ni-Cads together from rejects of the racers who were throwing out old batteries. Now that my kids are grown and I spend way more than I should - I'm not any better at it other than I have more invested in my "chassis". To me, and again - my opinion, spec racing should be limited to motors and tires. etc. If someone wants to run an Xray T4 2016 vs someone with a 3Racing Sakura XI in VTA, go on then. The motor/tires/battery will make it as even as it can be. The problem with the "Spec" chassis comes when that person wants to expand their hobby and realize they wished they would have bought xyz instead of abc. And probably wished they'd went with xyz from the beginning.

We are looking at doing a spec 1/12 scale class at our track. Right now we run 17.5 blinky. Not everyone runs blinky mode, and that's okay because that isn't the reason someone wins. Tires are your choice and body is your choice - just have to run a 17.5 motor. We are thinking about doing 21.5 motor, Spec PF PFM-12 body, and CRC purple stripe tire. You can run whatever chassis you want - Xray, Associated, Serpent, CRC, VBC, etc.

Anyway, enjoyed the insight of the new guy below - and I think he is spot-on.

+1 On this point below.

Quote:
Originally Posted by roosterreagan View Post
If I may interject, I'm quite green still, maybe 5 practice sessions lasting 5-15mins each, on account of driving straight into a wall or deciding to change something that didn't work on account of my inexperience. I'm attempting to join vta and would love another class for my other chassis, plural (apparently chassis is spelled the same singular and plural). The support from the OG guys has been amazing, and if I'm honest they're most the reason I persevere week after week, broken part after part, scuffed fender after... you get the point. Now, 8-10 months ago when I started gathering rc stuffs I had no clue about club level organized racing, this forum has helped a ton, and the fact I have one of the best local tracks in the USA has helped too. Now, I do not understand the intricacies of the rc world like you all above, I only know my experiences, to give you an idea of my level of investment after 8-10 months our entire dining room is filled with boxes and bins of vehicles and parts, most useless to spec on-road racing in any competitive capacity. That's a bit frustrating now but I've learned alot, and I'm certain I'm not alone here. What if, with all thsee extra parts and cars, we (meaning each person at a given local track, and this Web based community when applicable) pool together and put together RTRs to loan, for the night or donated or kept at the track (owners choice), and try to invite friends, family, coworkers, girlfriends, moms, dads, mechanics, bosses, bartenders, masseuses, whatever etc. On a periodic practice or different alotted day/night every week or month. I know if I was introduced years ago I would've been hooked, but I had no idea how to enter the seemingly secret society of rc clubbers. I'm sure someone will point out why this won't work and I'll crawl back into my nerd hole until I am more educated, but the whole spec thing turns me off, I already have running cars, I'm not skilled enough to compete even if I had the top shelf stuff, but I'm having fun building, learning, crashing and building again. Do you remember those days? I know regardless how great a setup is if you can't drive it you don't win and conversely if you have a little skill you could win with even the lowliest rebranded Redcat bathtub chassis drift thing with sand for bearings and a motor from a cassette player. My point being if no one knows that club racing exists we can pontificate on hypotheticals until we're too old to remember what brushed motors were but there won't be anymore participation to pump money into any part of the industry, whilst all the players wither and die, i.e. Novak. (I understand the Chinese roll in novak's demise, just a loose example of how if the rc market was stronger there would be a place for higher end, less price obsessed manufacturers to survive). Not sure if this ramble makes the same amount of sense here as it did in my head, just thought I'd try to add to the conversation, because it could be an important debate. Thanks, Rooster-Nashville TN
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Old 11-28-2016, 04:47 PM   #30
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The tc4 is too advanced to be a spec chassis kit, specially after you've done the BERT mods.....
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