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Old 07-20-2017, 02:09 AM   -   Wikipost
R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: Xray T4'17
Please read: This is a community-maintained wiki post containing the most important information from this thread. You may edit the Wiki once you have been a member for 90 days and have made 90 posts.
 
Last edit by: R Dodge
Welcome to the XRAY T4'17 Thread & Wikipost! Here you will find some useful info, tips and tricks as well as setups that are used by several team drivers. This wikipost is a work in progress and should continue to develop over time. Feel free to add anything you feel is useful to the community!

New for 2017:
The T4'17 comes available with either a Graphite chassis, or Aluminum Flex chassis. We recommend the Graphite chassis for starting on asphalt, and the Aluminum Flex for starting on carpet. The 2017 also comes standard with the floating swing rack as an option, and the Composite Graphite arms included. Most of the team prefers the Graphite arms for both asphalt and carpet, though sometimes Hard arms may be ideal for asphalt depending on the conditions. This year's car also comes with the new "In-line Flex Adjustment" which provides many more flex adjustments than in the past allowing you to focus & fine-tune on forward/back flex and side-to-side flex both together & independently. Additionally, the Ackermann has been moved back by 1mm and the spacing of the RF blocks is wider, creating 0.5° less rear toe from previous T4 models.

What's NEW at T4 2017? Convert your '16 to '17 specs with these parts:

- NEW chassis plate (3 options to chose from below)
- NEW Motor holder
- NEW Motor holder plate
- NEW center shaft holder
- NEW Floating Servo Mount

301142 T4'17 CHASSIS 2.2MM GRAPHITE
301143 T4'17 ALU CHASSIS 2.0MM - SWISS 7075 T6
301144 T4'17 ALU FLEX CHASSIS 2.0MM - SWISS 7075 T6

302536 ALU STEERING POST FOR FLOATING SERVO SAVER (2)
303066-O T4'17 ALU LAYSHAFT BULKHEAD CLOSED L/R - ORANGE
303067-O T4'17 ALU MOTOR MOUNT - ORANGE
303068-O T4'17 ALU MOTOR MOUNT PLATE - ORANGE
306204-O T4'17 ALU SERVO MOUNT - ORANGE
306233 T4'17 GRAPHITE FLOATING SERVO HOLDER 3.0MM
306530 T4'17 GRAPHITE CHASSIS STIFFENER 3.0MM

Tips & Tricks:

Alex Hagberg's Tech Tip Tuesday articles

How to mount your Protoform LTC-R Body
Setting static camber
How to mount weight on your chassis Part1
How to mount the rear wing on Protoform bodies
Simple troubleshooting guide
How to mount the battery on your chassis
How to glue your front tires for CRC Black carpet with Eric Anderson
Mastering the Sanwa M12S: Utilizing Exponential and RMode
How to mount weight on your chassis Part2
Mastering the Sanwa M12S: Utilizing TH-Hold

Team driver Tim Wahl posted some very useful build tips for the T4'16 on Facebook as he worked through building a new kit. These tips will still apply on the current model.

1- Carbon Parts
2-Suspension
3-Solid Axle and Differential
4-Bulkheads & Drivetrain
5-Driveshaft (ECS & CVD)
6-Front & Rear Suspension
7-Tweak
8-Anti-Roll Bar
9-Battery Fix (OPTIONAL)
10-Bumper & Body
11-Shocks
12-Steering

Center Brace:
The manual indicates using a 2mm shim under the center brace when attaching to the chassis plate. The gap is actually 3mm, so a 3mm shim should be used here.

Tuning Note:
On Carpet we have found that adding screws or doubling up the graphite brace will make the car react quicker to steering input, & change direction faster. Raising the graphite brace off of the aluminum bulkheads by placing a shim under it on the front and rear holes will reduce response. Using the tie-rod will reduce initial response to input, but will generate more in-corner traction or 'side-bite'. Using no brace will generate even more of this 'side-bite' but all of this is at the expense of corner speed. Best to use the tie-rod or no brace only in low-traction conditions. Additionally, the center brace increases forward traction, so removing it will potentially increase wheel-spin out of low speed corners.

New Graphite Hubs:
Xray have recently released some additional Graphite hubs for the T4 lineup. The 4° Graphite C-Hub has been out for some time and is known to improve steering on entry, and in general makes the car turn better. This has been the go-to c-hub on asphalt for many on the Xray team, though it is not needed on high bite carpet. The Graphite rear hub tends to make the car more stable, especially on corner entry. We are still working on gathering input on the new Graphite steering block, but for the moment feel that it should improve steering response. All Graphite parts are approximately 1g lighter than the Hard or Medium options.

ARS Tuning courtesy of Ed (TryHard):
If you set the ARS up with no shims under either inside or outside ball positions, it actually adds toe-in under compression, at around 1° at 5.2mm ride height (how much it adds depends how much the car compresses, obviously )

Adding shims reduces the amount added (1mm under one of the links gives about 0.5°), until the link has 2mm worth of shims (1mm either side, or 2mm on one side) makes the ARS neutral. Adding more shims then turns it into reducing toe in under compression.

Whilst that might sound a bit backwards, it's actually not quite as simple as it sounds. By having the links to add toe, you gain forward traction. Also consider as the car rolls, the inside wheel is in negative compression, and the outside in compression. So the inside is toe-ing out, and the outside toe-ing in, so the whole rear is then 'steering' in the direction of the turn. Obviously the inside wheel has a lot less influence than the outside as it's far less loaded, but the effect is still there.

Optional & Tuning Parts to consider:
XRA301196 T4 Graphite Upper Deck 1.6mm V2
XRA302254 Composite Steering Block - Graphite
XRA302334 Aluminum C-Hub Block - Caster
0° - Orange *Only for ARS*
XRA302383 Composite C-Hub Right – 4
° - Graphite (ECS)
XRA302384 Composite C-Hub Left – 4
° - Graphite (ECS)
XRA302711 Brass Front Lower 1-Piece Suspension Holder - Front - FF
XRA302803 1.3mm Front Anti-Roll Bar
XRA303360 Composite Upright 0° Outboard Toe-In - Graphite
XRA303802 1.2mm Rear Anti-Roll Bar
XRA305137 Steel Solid Axle Driveshaft Adapters - HUDY Spring Steel *Highly recommend*
XRA305242 Composite Drive Shaft Replacement Cap 3.5mm – Orange – Strong (QTY 4)
XRA305351 Aluminum Wheel Hub – Offset “-0.75mm” – Black (QTY 2)
XRA305352 Aluminum Wheel Hub - Offset
“+0.75mm” - Black (QTY 2)
XRA306191 T4 Graphite + Aluminum Fully Adjustable Battery Holder
XRA308264 4S Spring-Set Progressive C=2.5-2.8 (QTY 2)
XRA308276 4S Spring-Set C=2.7 (QTY 2)
XRA308286 4S Spring-Set C=2.6 (QTY 2)

XRA308039 Aluminum Progressive Shock System – Set (QTY 2) *Only for asphalt*

Recent Setups:
Bruno Coelho - IIC 2016 - High Bite Carpet - Modified
Alex Hagberg - AOC HK 2016 - Med Bite Asphalt - Modified
Jan Ratheisky - AOC HK 2016 - Med Bite Asphalt - 13.5
Chris Adams - Halloween Classic - High Bite Carpet - Modified
Chris Adams - ROAR Region 9 - Med Bite Asphalt - Modified
Craig Xavier - US Indoor Champs - High Bite Carpet - 17.5
Bruno Coelho - ETS Rd1 Hrotovice - Med Bite Carpet - Modified
Craig Xavier - Stock Wars - High Bite Carpet - 17.5
Jan Ratheisky - DHI Cup - Med Bite Carpet - 13.5
Chris Adams - Texas EOS Rd 1 - High Bite Carpet - Modified
Alex Hagberg - Snowbird Nationals - High Bite Carpet - Modified
Robbie Dodge - Snowbird Nationals - High Bite Carpet - 17.5
Jan Ratheisky - TITC - High Bite Asphalt - 13.5
Drew Ellis - ROAR Carpet Nationals - High Bite Carpet - Modified
Eric Anderson - ROAR Carpet Nationals - High Bite Carpet - 17.5
Martin Crisp - Canadian Nationals - Medium Bite Carpet - Modified
Martin Crisp - Canadian Nationals - Medium Bite Carpet - 17.5
Dan Hamann - MN State Champs - High Bite Carpet - 17.5

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Old 05-16-2017, 07:25 AM   #1141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny-b23 View Post
If I remember correctly it may fit, but you can't use the center brace if you run the weight. Technically the holes it screwed into are no longer there, so you'd also have to use servo tape.

An alternative might be the stuff from 7075it. I believe they make some products that work with the new brace setup.
They do make a lot of cool stuff! I wonder if the ship to the US?
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Old 05-16-2017, 08:34 AM   #1142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carrizojim View Post
They do make a lot of cool stuff! I wonder if the ship to the US?
Sounds like they will, however, shipping isn't cheap.
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Old 05-16-2017, 09:05 AM   #1143
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7075 Special Parts di Merano Luana
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Old 05-16-2017, 09:20 AM   #1144
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Originally Posted by erchn View Post
What are you doing in here you defector lol j/k
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Old 05-16-2017, 09:22 AM   #1145
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What are you doing in here you defector lol j/k
Keeping tabs on you kids. lol
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Old 05-16-2017, 10:33 AM   #1146
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Sounds like they will, however, shipping isn't cheap.
ToniSport Much cheaper for shipping and fast service.

EA
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Old 05-16-2017, 11:30 AM   #1147
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Originally Posted by Danny-b23 View Post
Really as long as you don't want to run any screws in the brace besides the ones in the ends, anything that will fit under the brace will do just fine. Thin pieces of tungsten may also work well.
I already did that with some weights and double sided tape
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Old 05-17-2017, 10:35 PM   #1148
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Hi guys,
Small issue here. Can’t get a proper setup for my car. The first 10 laps the car is running fine after that the rear starts to get loosened. I have to use the brake at every corner otherwise car will oversteer corner in. Or in long turns car will oversteer at corner exit.
Track has less than medium grip. I am almost back to standard setup. What can I do to get more grip at the rear?
Thanks in advace.
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Old 05-17-2017, 11:20 PM   #1149
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Hi guys,
Small issue here. Can’t get a proper setup for my car. The first 10 laps the car is running fine after that the rear starts to get loosened. I have to use the brake at every corner otherwise car will oversteer corner in. Or in long turns car will oversteer at corner exit.
Track has less than medium grip. I am almost back to standard setup. What can I do to get more grip at the rear?
Thanks in advace.
I had similary issues on low to medium grip asphalt with the standard asphalt setup please have loot at post 1103 where I explain in more detail what I did. Changing the rear roll-center definitely made a huge difference. As for the shock change, I will try the same setup this weekend but with the shocks in the rear back in position 2.
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Old 05-18-2017, 10:57 PM   #1150
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Thanks, gonna try this next weekend.

You have moved the roll center more up (not down) closer to the center of mass, therefore less momentum of roll in the car.
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Old 05-18-2017, 11:32 PM   #1151
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Thanks, gonna try this next weekend.

You have moved the roll center more up (not down) closer to the center of mass, therefore less momentum of roll in the car.
No, I gave it more roll. Initially it is 1mm inner and 4mm outer, I am now at 2mm inner and 3mm outer, which lowers the roll center.
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Old 05-19-2017, 04:10 PM   #1152
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sounds like the tires are getting too hot and that's what is breaking traction.
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Old 05-25-2017, 02:52 AM   #1153
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Quiet week in here. Everyone must be enjoying their T4'17s!

Good luck to the XRAY/RCAmerica team attending the Reedy Race this weekend!
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Old 05-26-2017, 12:14 PM   #1154
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Has anyone tried the samix 2.25 carbon chassis out yet?
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Old 05-26-2017, 12:47 PM   #1155
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrmarquez.702 View Post
Has anyone tried the samix 2.25 carbon chassis out yet?
I have their chassis and top deck here ready to try. Quality looks nice, flex feels similar to the kit parts. Will post a review when I've tested it
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