3LikesXray T4 2016
03-17-2017, 02:10 AM - Wikipost
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12-11-2016, 10:28 PM
#1081
to compensate for the slow reaction when pointing the bushings down, I do the following:
1. shorten the link on the roll center upper clamp, hole 1 (hole that is most outward from the chassis or hole nearest the tire).
2. shorten the rear wheelbase
3. increase my droop 1 - 2 steps
4. increase my diff oil
I don't do these all at once and it is no particular order, it will always depend on each driver's feel or how you want to drive your car.
1. shorten the link on the roll center upper clamp, hole 1 (hole that is most outward from the chassis or hole nearest the tire).
2. shorten the rear wheelbase
3. increase my droop 1 - 2 steps
4. increase my diff oil
I don't do these all at once and it is no particular order, it will always depend on each driver's feel or how you want to drive your car.
12-12-2016, 12:55 AM
#1082
Tech Adept
"0.5 in" means the dot on the bushings point up? If so, wouldn't that make the roll center higher, and higher roll center means having lower grip? I plan to start with all neural in front and 0.5 down at the rear.
12-12-2016, 03:56 AM
#1084
I'm also fighting to find rear end traction on low traction carpet. I have bushing "1 down/in" (maybe it's too much?) and could get it quite good when I find best droop/ride height combination. But still strangely can varies from day to day, tire condition, tire additive etc.
I don't remember exactly what I had in rear diff, but I changed oil to 2000 CST. By feel it felt like it made it softer. And I didn't like it at all. I'm planing to go back to 5k or 7k or even 10k. I see most setup sheets have 5k or more for low traction tracks.
What do you think, is it typical to go higher on diff oil to get rear end more stable?
I don't remember exactly what I had in rear diff, but I changed oil to 2000 CST. By feel it felt like it made it softer. And I didn't like it at all. I'm planing to go back to 5k or 7k or even 10k. I see most setup sheets have 5k or more for low traction tracks.
What do you think, is it typical to go higher on diff oil to get rear end more stable?
12-12-2016, 04:12 AM
#1085
I'm also fighting to find rear end traction on low traction carpet. I have bushing "1 down/in" (maybe it's too much?) and could get it quite good when I find best droop/ride height combination. But still strangely can varies from day to day, tire condition, tire additive etc.
I don't remember exactly what I had in rear diff, but I changed oil to 2000 CST. By feel it felt like it made it softer. And I didn't like it at all. I'm planing to go back to 5k or 7k or even 10k. I see most setup sheets have 5k or more for low traction tracks.
What do you think, is it typical to go higher on diff oil to get rear end more stable?
I don't remember exactly what I had in rear diff, but I changed oil to 2000 CST. By feel it felt like it made it softer. And I didn't like it at all. I'm planing to go back to 5k or 7k or even 10k. I see most setup sheets have 5k or more for low traction tracks.
What do you think, is it typical to go higher on diff oil to get rear end more stable?
I've posted a low-grip carpet setup here for club racing:
http://forum.teamxray.com/xform/inde...&setup=t4_2015
You don't need to go crazy on any of the settings, it's just about getting the car balanced. Bodyshell, springs, oils and graphite arms are the important bits for me.
12-12-2016, 05:51 AM
#1086
Tech Rookie
I've posted a low-grip carpet setup here for club racing:
http://forum.teamxray.com/xform/inde...&setup=t4_2015
http://forum.teamxray.com/xform/inde...&setup=t4_2015
I've noticed that some pros use the setting, but i've sort of dismissed it as a high grip trick to limit weight transfer when breaking and thus taking out excessive initial steering.
I guess you get less caster which may be good on low grip... I'm going to try it for sure, but would be great to hear your views as well.
12-12-2016, 06:23 AM
#1087
Thanks for sharing! I'm curious of one parameter in particular: What do you achieve with the antidive (FF 0,5 down/out) on a low traction surface?
I've noticed that some pros use the setting, but i've sort of dismissed it as a high grip trick to limit weight transfer when breaking and thus taking out excessive initial steering.
I guess you get less caster which may be good on low grip... I'm going to try it for sure, but would be great to hear your views as well.
I've noticed that some pros use the setting, but i've sort of dismissed it as a high grip trick to limit weight transfer when breaking and thus taking out excessive initial steering.
I guess you get less caster which may be good on low grip... I'm going to try it for sure, but would be great to hear your views as well.
Antis don't really change the total weight-transfer much (you'll get a tiny bit more, because the CoG stays higher). But they cause more undamped transfer through the suspension arms, so the car is more sensitive to throttle/brake inputs, and not as good over bumps.
Last edited by daleburr; 12-12-2016 at 06:34 AM.
12-12-2016, 09:23 PM
#1088
Tech Apprentice
So what would you suggest for a combination of a low grip and bumpy track then?. I have tested the 1 down and out FF / 0.5 down and out FR and it has produced my fastest lap time, but I have lost some time through the chicanes/ quick direction changes, what else should I try?
12-12-2016, 10:08 PM
#1089
So what would you suggest for a combination of a low grip and bumpy track then?. I have tested the 1 down and out FF / 0.5 down and out FR and it has produced my fastest lap time, but I have lost some time through the chicanes/ quick direction changes, what else should I try?
12-13-2016, 03:53 AM
#1090
So what would you suggest for a combination of a low grip and bumpy track then?. I have tested the 1 down and out FF / 0.5 down and out FR and it has produced my fastest lap time, but I have lost some time through the chicanes/ quick direction changes, what else should I try?
Or various other options to improve direction-change without costing traction:
- Stiffer front springs
- Drop the inner camber links (front and rear)
- Narrow hexes (front and rear)
12-13-2016, 04:18 AM
#1091
Tech Adept
Also, based on the settings from XRay T4 2016 assembly manual, the default toeing for front is 0 and 3 degree toe-in for rear (if all bushings are centered). Is that true too?
I intend to have 2.5 degree toe-in at my rear and 1 degree toe-out at the front.
12-14-2016, 02:34 AM
#1092
Front kit settings are 0deg on the arms, but most people run some arm-sweep (e.g. 0.5 out on the FF inserts). And start with 1.0deg toe out at the wheels.
12-14-2016, 06:36 AM
#1093
Tech Adept
Btw, how much camber (front and rear) do you usually set for low traction outdoor track, assuming I'm going to have 0.5 down bushings for both front and rear?
12-16-2016, 05:16 AM
#1094
Tech Rookie
It gives more turn-in steering and more traction on corner exit (two things I usually seem to want in low grip conditions). Anti-dive and reduced castor will both do this, so the combination of the two means you can really feel the effect on track.
Antis don't really change the total weight-transfer much (you'll get a tiny bit more, because the CoG stays higher). But they cause more undamped transfer through the suspension arms, so the car is more sensitive to throttle/brake inputs, and not as good over bumps.
Antis don't really change the total weight-transfer much (you'll get a tiny bit more, because the CoG stays higher). But they cause more undamped transfer through the suspension arms, so the car is more sensitive to throttle/brake inputs, and not as good over bumps.
Looking for an even nimbler car i tried the graphite in-line flex thing (2 screws from chassis plate with nuts) in addition to the anti dive - This really helped in the chicanes. After 5 mins i felt at "one" with the car, if you know what i mean. I seldom get that feeling, but it's so cool when it happens - Feels like i can hit the same lines over and over at very little risk
. Next thing to try is the 0,5 arm sweep in the setup you posted. I have the opposite (0,5 wider FR than FF) - Copied it from a local fast guy and and haven't gotten around to tinker with that setting just yet. Will the arm sweep stiffen up the suspension initially and go on to provide more steering mid corner/exit? If so it might be just what i'm looking for
12-16-2016, 11:37 AM
#1095
Tech Initiate
Is that anti dive or pro dive?