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Old 12-02-2014, 10:14 AM   #91
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Here's an old thread that might have some useful information on how to run a beginner's class. Use any car (including RTR), nothing extra to buy, no fast guys running over the newbies, and no way to cheat:

Breakout Racing: The Ultimate Spec Class!!!
True, but breakout racing is a lot tougher than it looks. I've run it in an oval class and in a VTA class, and getting that perfect lap takes some skill and consistency. It does put everyone on a level playing field if the equipment is different.
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Old 12-02-2014, 10:14 AM   #92
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Again i am speaking about the newest of newbies trying to enter. I am not talking about the novice that can at least get around the track. Those folks can suck it up and just run with the best and take a beating. At least they can get out of the way.
Yep, and IMO even VTA is typically too fast/ complicated for these folks. Some tracks seem to have had success running things like Mini Coopers but from what I've seen once a person sees a well set up, fast TC or pan car they really don't want to start with a Mini. Instead they want to jump in feet first which can work if the person has reasonable expectations and a lot of patience. I really wish there was some type of tiered system but for the life of me can not think of a way to do it that would work given the economic realities most tracks face. For a while we ran a "Mongrel" class which had a breakout time so pretty much anything could be run together. While we had decent turnouts I cant remember it bringing anyone new to the track. Seemed it was mostly established guys dusting off old cars and doing it for laughs.
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Old 12-02-2014, 10:30 AM   #93
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once a person sees a well set up, fast TC or pan car they really don't want to start with a Mini. Instead they want to jump in feet first which can work if the person has reasonable expectations and a lot of patience.
Cant agree more. This was me. I only wanted to run a TC and if i was going to spend the large dollars i want what i want. Having said that you had guys at the old track that had two or three TC's and just had the different motors in them and just ran all the classes with no real beginner class. I never raced. Just practiced. That is ok too but if we want newbies in they need to get the bug bite of race day without feeling way out of place. I like the mongrel and other idea of that as a beginner class.
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Old 12-02-2014, 10:53 AM   #94
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lol Mini is a fun class. I still have mine. They run exceptionally well when setup right. Bring them back!

Lot's of people forgot why RC started in the first place... To run scaled down versions of real cars. Something about it being SCALE.
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Old 12-02-2014, 11:56 AM   #95
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I really wish there was some type of tiered system but for the life of me can not think of a way to do it that would work given the economic realities most tracks face. For a while we ran a "Mongrel" class which had a breakout time so pretty much anything could be run together. While we had decent turnouts I cant remember it bringing anyone new to the track. Seemed it was mostly established guys dusting off old cars and doing it for laughs.
This seems like a good way to get new racers through the door - we'd have to find a way to advertise to the masses - but if they have a [suitable] car they'd be able to join in on the fun.

However, a potential wrench in keeping the "casual" racers interested - transponder requirements... Short of those with the intent of getting involved on a serious level, I doubt many newbies are interested in spending $85 for a transponder.
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Old 12-02-2014, 12:36 PM   #96
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This seems like a good way to get new racers through the door - we'd have to find a way to advertise to the masses - but if they have a [suitable] car they'd be able to join in on the fun.

However, a potential wrench in keeping the "casual" racers interested - transponder requirements... Short of those with the intent of getting involved on a serious level, I doubt many newbies are interested in spending $85 for a transponder.
Yep, when we had the class we also had house transponders. Those eventually died out and now everyone has to provide their own. I think a Mini kit with motor and esc is around $135 so even the $65 for the less expensive MRT seems pretty steep as a percentage of the car cost. Hard sell to tell them the transponder should last years when they don't know if they will stick with RC past the first day.
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Old 12-02-2014, 12:39 PM   #97
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lol Mini is a fun class. I still have mine. They run exceptionally well when setup right. Bring them back!

Lot's of people forgot why RC started in the first place... To run scaled down versions of real cars. Something about it being SCALE.
I bought a M06 to build while I was recovering from a broken leg. I've actually had a lot of fun driving it on the track. Slow but it brings its own set of challenges to the table and the realism is very cool. Not sure why they aren't more popular in my area. I have no issue running fast and not-so-fast classes. Racing is racing to me. Doesn't have to be a $1000 TC to be fun.
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Old 12-02-2014, 01:02 PM   #98
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... $65 for the less expensive MRT seems pretty steep as a percentage of the car cost. Hard sell to tell them the transponder should last years when they don't know if they will stick with RC past the first day.
Did the race director forget how to hand count or do the new programs not allow that anymore?

I used to hand count a dirt oval class that ran 10-12 second laps (10 car heat) and still announce position of the top 3. I also don't miss those days...
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Old 12-02-2014, 01:05 PM   #99
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Bring back racing. Forget about speeds. Bring back a sense of challenge. Instill the desire to rise through the ranks and be beat the best. Teach good practice habits. Stop giving participation awards. Make awards mean something.

I hate to sound like a jerk, but a race director should be able to say to the guy at his track for the first time "Put your car down and let me see you run 5 laps". The director then puts him either in a class or heat that he belongs in. I watch a guy walk in to practice every week, charged packs, runs his car into a wall 10 times a lap, breaks something and leaves after he runs out of spares. We desperately try to help him with his car, but his gear is used and used up. 2 weeks ago he buys a used GT12. He stops breaking. He runs better laps more consistently. He can save toward a better radio and servo. The club helped this guy get on his racing feet. He actually looked happy last time he left the track. TC is too expensive, too fragile even for VTA. Break an A arm on the inner hinge pin and be ready to race for the next round. Next round to someone who has never repaired a car in the heat of competition can cause a mental melt down. 45 minutes may not be enough time. Makes you want to put the car in the hauler and go home. Been there, lived through that.

I'm not on my SupaStox soapbox, but I could go there. The ideal class is good side by side racing, clean passing and lots of laughing. VTA is very close. Legends, 12th scale or GT12 with 21.5 1S would be the ultimate beginner class. The tires grip, there is plenty of room with the smaller cars on track. The best part is they feed the next level of competition.
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Old 12-02-2014, 01:16 PM   #100
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I always thought qualifying heats that determined your position in the main was the best way to conduct races. I know some people would sandbag but then again, why do you want to be the fast guy good enough to get into the A main but instead end up winning the C main? I never understood that.

An entry level class is needed. Some call it Sportsman. Some call it novice. Others consider it to be stock or spec. Everything is modified or open today. That scares new people off completely. I know some claim that the only point to a spec class is price but price is no longer an issue since motors and batteries are all basically the same price so it shouldn't be around anymore. Those people miss the point entirely. An entry level class would definitely help bring people out along with a helpful attitude from the more experienced to those new people. A tech inspection should be mandatory for all races to keep cheating to a minimum. You don't see that anymore at the club level and it's a shame.

The shops need to do their part too. They need to carry cheaper kits. Traxxas is hardly a cheap company to buy anything from. Kids used to get into rc with Tamiya plastic kits as a stepping stone. Things like that are still around but no one pushes them. Most kids didn't get into rc to race. Racing was a side effect. This should be remembered. Make it cheaper to get into in general and then make racing friendlier to them. The internet isn't hurting anyone in this regards since this is an advantage that the brick and mortar store has.
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