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Old 11-19-2014, 07:01 AM   #316
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ROAR has been broken for many many years, I'm not sure it can be fixed. It may be time for something else.
ROAR isn't broken just because of recent issues like the D3.5 debacle and other race issues etc, but, this may be the nail in the coffin. The sanctioning body is broken on many levels due to rapid change the way the world operates now, the ability to not keep up with change, lack of support(mostly due to previous), and the unwillingness to admit help is needed. I would equate it to the way the record labels and movie companies have struggled with digital life, but on a larger scale with significantly less money and people to support the rapid changes.

It is VERY evident in almost every form of RC racing how irrelevant ROAR really is. Almost every large racing event is put on by another promoter besides ROAR not requiring membership. What I find interesting is ROAR does not stop usage of ROAR rules and or the ROAR name at events which are not ROAR sanctioned events. Would the NFL or MLB or any other sanctioning body allow others to steal their rules and advertise their usage? No.

Personally at this point, I think becoming ROAR president would have damaged EA's reputation in the long run and he's dodging a huge bullet.

The biggest issue at hand is, once the sanctioning body fails, where do we go? Who/what other sanctioning body has the ability to handle standing up a national organization capable of performing the functions ROAR currently does, but better in the real world of both today and tomorrow from all aspects?
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Old 11-19-2014, 07:20 AM   #317
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yeah its a list of names in which most of us know absolutely nothing about. i dont want to send an email to each member thats running asking them what they are going to do etc. i want to see a campaign speech (posting) from each of them.

And some acessability on the forums. since most of us are on here. why are they not? would be nice to be able to have a roar specific thread where we could address issues and they could field questions from the membership instead of an email. posting is pretty damn easy, se easy a caveman man do it...


Is this too much to ask?
They are not on here, because they are over here:http://roarracing.org/4rmb/activity.php where members must login and post with real names.
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Old 11-19-2014, 07:28 AM   #318
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...
It is VERY evident in almost every form of RC racing how irrelevant ROAR really is. Almost every large racing event is put on by another promoter besides ROAR not requiring membership. What I find interesting is ROAR does not stop usage of ROAR rules and or the ROAR name at events which are not ROAR sanctioned events. Would the NFL or MLB or any other sanctioning body allow others to steal their rules and advertise their usage? No.
...
If roar is so irrelevant why do large event use their rules?? It seems everyone wants roar to go away but at the same time they want to use their rules... how does that work??
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Old 11-19-2014, 07:56 AM   #319
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Originally Posted by bigwavedave33 View Post

The biggest issue at hand is, once the sanctioning body fails, where do we go? Who/what other sanctioning body has the ability to handle standing up a national organization capable of performing the functions ROAR currently does, but better in the real world of both today and tomorrow from all aspects?
Good luck if that happens. If the message boards are any indication the major contribution will be some malcontents posting "ROAR SUCKS, somebody needs to start a new organization". Then they can go back to sitting on their hands waiting for someone else to do the work because they are either too lazy, or too incompetent to do anything themselves. In this thread alone how many people are suggesting that we just selectively choose which rules should be adhered and which should be ignored? The same people that would be crying the second they were the victim of either ambiguous interpretation or ignoring a rule. Hypocrite babies getting exactly what they deserve.
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Old 11-19-2014, 08:04 AM   #320
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ROAR has helped to establish the WORLD of RC racing and even non racing. Over the past 30+ years its rules have influenced the design and functunality of both vehicles and electronics. Yes other partsnof the world have thier own rule sets and organizations, but if a company wished to sell a race car in the US, ROAR rules must be part of the design though proccess. In turn when companies create a non-race vehicle, they still must consider the size and shape of the electronics (battery is big one) that will go in it when they design it. ROAR has set dimension rules for various classes that are the standard for design now. Whether ROAR originally used another sanctioning body for these IDK, but they still influence
overall design. Just look at SCT design. Traxxas pretty much started the class, ROAR used the dimensions when creating the rules, now every other manufacturer has to follow suite.

To create a new org from scratch is impossible. ROAR has too much influence. That doesn't mean 1. ROAR should stay around or 2. A new org cant start. ROAR rules would have to be a blue print. Otherwise it throws too much turmoil into a world wide system that the U.S. could cope with. The rest of the world would just keep on keepin on.

For all the negativity that ROAR is getting (mostnof which seems to be earned), we must also thank ROAR for what is has done for the RC community as a whole. But like everything else, its time to adapt or die. Technology is moving at a very fast pace. Whether its communication tech or tech for our little toy cars. An example I can think of is the VTA class for ROAR. There are no motor rules. Rules have been submitted from, what I understand, over a year ago, and there isnt any word on it. Why? If they want to have another viable class that is a great entry point for new people, this should be paramount. And this is just one example. There were many others in the past such as lipo and brushless tech taking longer than
it should have to be approved and adpoted.

There are fewer and fewer races that require ROAR. It pretty much the only races that will qualify you for a next level event up to the worlds. Therefore it seems logical that the only entities that still really need ROAR and its influence are the manufacturers. And I'm sure if they could get on the world stage another way, they probably would.
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Old 11-19-2014, 08:05 AM   #321
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....
Hey Adam, try thinking this through:

"Existing ROAR leadership sh*ts its Depends when it realizes the votes coming in for EA are going to crush them."

1) Nobody on the EXCOM knows how many votes Eric has/had garnered to the best of my knowledge. On-road is dwarfed by off-road participation, so who's to say that even a motivated on-road group could change the election.

Even if Eric won, why would the current leadership or supposed good ole boys club care? Those who voted on the matter are in appointed positions, but need a majority of votes on the ExCom to get them removed. If they were worried about their butts, they didn't have to be since it would take 4 votes to remove them. Even if Eric and Tim Potter were sympatico, they'd have to recruit two other ExCom members to effect change in the committee (Article VI, section L).

*Existing ROAR leadership starts scouring the bylaws looking for a reason to disqualify EA.
*After two failed attempts, they find a bylaw which can be interpreted either way, giving them the choice of allowing him to remain or disqualify him.

Article VII, Section B Says "Write in votes are considered nominations subject to the approval of the Executive Committee." So the Executive committee asks Eric to prove he meets the requirements. Eric takes offense to this apparently, as he's said several places this was their third attempt to get him DQ'ed. I guess doing their job makes them the enemy.

Existing ROAR leadership chooses to interpret the rule to save themselves rather than go with what the overwhelming majority of the community wants.

Again, a majority of the on-road community. The election isn't over, it's not the sure thing that people keep making it out to be. It's their job to make sure Eric meets the requirements. They're interpretation (and they're in these positions to make rules and interpretations for the hobby, and it's their job to write/amend these Bylaws, so it seems right up their alley) was that somebody needed to be a member for 365 continuous days before their election. Eric didn't meet that requirement.

I really wish people would quit with the wild conspiracy BS

That's not to say that just because they could do it, that they should have. Would the damage of letting Eric's candidacy (and possible presidency), even if he was afoul of the eligibility requirements, be more than the damage this decision has created? But then again ROAR has been lambasted for not following their rules, working in the margins, or being blind and not closing the barn door until all the horses are out. I don't blame them for being proactive and trying to get this "right" to a T. The fact that every ExCom member present was in agreement speaks to the universal interpretation of the rule (and I already illustrated how it doesn't save their butts).

I would be curious to see what Eric could do as President, and I'm disappointed we won't get that chance this election. I'm more disappointed that what the "community" looks like launching straight into character assassination and conspiracy theories before thinking the issue through.
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Old 11-19-2014, 08:50 AM   #322
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Hey Adam, try thinking this through:

"Existing ROAR leadership sh*ts its Depends when it realizes the votes coming in for EA are going to crush them."

1) Nobody on the EXCOM knows how many votes Eric has/had garnered to the best of my knowledge. On-road is dwarfed by off-road participation, so who's to say that even a motivated on-road group could change the election.

Even if Eric won, why would the current leadership or supposed good ole boys club care? Those who voted on the matter are in appointed positions, but need a majority of votes on the ExCom to get them removed. If they were worried about their butts, they didn't have to be since it would take 4 votes to remove them. Even if Eric and Tim Potter were sympatico, they'd have to recruit two other ExCom members to effect change in the committee (Article VI, section L).

*Existing ROAR leadership starts scouring the bylaws looking for a reason to disqualify EA.
*After two failed attempts, they find a bylaw which can be interpreted either way, giving them the choice of allowing him to remain or disqualify him.

Article VII, Section B Says "Write in votes are considered nominations subject to the approval of the Executive Committee." So the Executive committee asks Eric to prove he meets the requirements. Eric takes offense to this apparently, as he's said several places this was their third attempt to get him DQ'ed. I guess doing their job makes them the enemy.

Existing ROAR leadership chooses to interpret the rule to save themselves rather than go with what the overwhelming majority of the community wants.

Again, a majority of the on-road community. The election isn't over, it's not the sure thing that people keep making it out to be. It's their job to make sure Eric meets the requirements. They're interpretation (and they're in these positions to make rules and interpretations for the hobby, and it's their job to write/amend these Bylaws, so it seems right up their alley) was that somebody needed to be a member for 365 continuous days before their election. Eric didn't meet that requirement.

I really wish people would quit with the wild conspiracy BS

That's not to say that just because they could do it, that they should have. Would the damage of letting Eric's candidacy (and possible presidency), even if he was afoul of the eligibility requirements, be more than the damage this decision has created? But then again ROAR has been lambasted for not following their rules, working in the margins, or being blind and not closing the barn door until all the horses are out. I don't blame them for being proactive and trying to get this "right" to a T. The fact that every ExCom member present was in agreement speaks to the universal interpretation of the rule (and I already illustrated how it doesn't save their butts).

I would be curious to see what Eric could do as President, and I'm disappointed we won't get that chance this election. I'm more disappointed that what the "community" looks like launching straight into character assassination and conspiracy theories before thinking the issue through.
When only 70 people TOTAL vote it doesn't matter On or Off Road.

The OVAL community has already left ROAR behind. Maybe it's time the Roadcourse racers do the same. If ROAR is a sanctioning body for 8th scale buggy racers and shortcourse trucks, then let them govern that. We can handle our own. Let the existing rules be our base, and let the ROADCOURSE community dictate OUR future.
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Old 11-19-2014, 08:55 AM   #323
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Lets take a vote.
Roar annual membership fee. $35.00. Non Profit Organization
OR
For Profit organization annual membership fee $150.00 @ a minimum

Let the games begin!!!!
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Old 11-19-2014, 08:57 AM   #324
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EA for inaugural North American Radio Controlled Roadracing Association President.
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Old 11-19-2014, 08:59 AM   #325
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Originally Posted by NITRO 540 View Post
Lets take a vote.
Roar annual membership fee. $35.00. Non Profit Organization
OR
For Profit organization annual membership fee $150.00 @ a minimum

Let the games begin!!!!
Really? Whats to keep another organization from being another non-profit that charges $35 for a annual membership. That's like saying this:

Lets take a vote:
A $20 entry to a non-profit club's race
OR
Pay $120 to enter a FOR profit club's race
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Old 11-19-2014, 09:00 AM   #326
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EA for inaugural North American Radio Controlled Roadracing Association President.
NARCRAP? lol
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Old 11-19-2014, 09:00 AM   #327
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Originally Posted by NITRO 540 View Post
Lets take a vote.
Roar annual membership fee. $35.00. Non Profit Organization
OR
For Profit organization annual membership fee $150.00 @ a minimum

Let the games begin!!!!
Takes out three $50 bills and sets them on fire.......
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Old 11-19-2014, 09:02 AM   #328
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NARCRAP? lol
Well NARCRA President. Still less $hit than we see now....lol.
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Old 11-19-2014, 09:08 AM   #329
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the second they were the victim of either ambiguous interpretation or ignoring a rule.
This ALONE encompasses the last ten years of ROAR's "leadership" Ambiguous? Legal today, banned next Tuesday. They can't even properly execute their OWN ruleset. "Ohhhhh, our tools were too old." "We're all volunteers, what do you expect from us?" Please.
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Old 11-19-2014, 09:12 AM   #330
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And Oval still uses ROAR approvals and rules for electronics (which admittedly you might be able to get from the BRCA/IFMAR/etc, but now you'll have zero say in the manner).
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