254LikesTamiya TRF419
10-20-2014, 06:44 PM
#316
For clarification the price of the 418 was 50-60 cheaper compared with T4 and BD7 from HK online hobby shops.
10-20-2014, 08:01 PM
#317
Ok cool!
I knew I was going out on a limb buying a TRF here, but the reality is parts are so easy to get ex Japan (and cheap compared to local stuff for other brands) and the lack of broken parts means it isn't an issue really.
I knew I was going out on a limb buying a TRF here, but the reality is parts are so easy to get ex Japan (and cheap compared to local stuff for other brands) and the lack of broken parts means it isn't an issue really.
10-20-2014, 08:05 PM
#318
It was/is a good choice.
I could have went either way, at the time a BD7 2014 was available locally so I bought it to race the following weekend.
I could have went either way, at the time a BD7 2014 was available locally so I bought it to race the following weekend.
10-20-2014, 09:52 PM
#319
Japan has a very complicated pricing system.
I think you can pay about three prices retail there, and I don't claim I understand how it happens. Shops in Akihabara are just prohibitive. Last time I visited, TRF cars were actually sold at Tamiya recommended retail, so in the 700$ region. I don't know why online prices are so different (because they are) maybe it's because you don't pay one of their impossible taxes. I couldn't buy anything there even though I wanted to. As simple as that. Never bought anything in Japan on my trips apart from camera gear which is sold very competitively (and there's a lot of stuff they only sell in Japan - at least for the first year of release).
In Europe, I tried to find Tamiya in Germany, Austria, Switzerland, Belgium, Sweden, France, the Czech Republic, Hungary and Italy. Considering this covers a market of 300 million people, it is inexistent. I don't care you know some shop where you can find it. (I didn't manage to find any hobby shops in my short trip across Denmark, if you care to illuminate, I'll stop next time and check it out).
And yes, you can find bits and bobs, usually the low end kits and plastic model kits, which is probably the bulk of Tamiya's business, but the TRF kits, I simply not have seen one in Europe (we are after all looking for TRF stuff).
Compare this with Hong Kong. If you went to RcMart shop, you'd think the Tamiya factory is in their back yard and there's a few of them, not just one. There was one shop in Akihabara where I found so much diversity, (and actually more), with stacks of TRF boxes everywhere and option parts I never heard of for all their kits. Prices however were as mentioned above.
For Australia, in recent times shipping has started to kill some of the online buying (long delays, bad service, high prices imposed by lots of parcels going missing so everybody mails stuff insured which is expensive and slow and needs lots of signatures).
That said, HK (and SE Asia) is still cheaper by a considerable margin, and with all the delays still quicker. Last I checked, it was six weeks to get something ordered through the shop, at a time when you could have it on your doorstep in three days at 1/3 the price form HK (now it's more like 2-4 weeks, but you can see, still quicker and a lot cheaper). Why bother?
My last purchase, a Yokomo BD7 kit was half price (plus shipping on top) compared to my local shop. I want to support my LHS, but they need to get real.
SIx weeks waiting time is not acceptable.
Price twice as high as overseas is not acceptable.
The situation is so bad in Australia, our government has put out information how to shop online without disclosing your IP address, because people like Apple, Microsoft and everybody else and their dog is reaming us just because they can. There was an investigation and basically these companies said so (I mean we're talking about digital objects, no manufacturing, packaging, transport, no shipping, no import fees, nothing, and we're still paying 1.7 times as much as americans/UK for instance). For physical goods, the same, even though the ipod/ipad/whatever for instance is not even made in the US/Europe, but here for some reason these things cost 1.7 times the price (before the importer slaps on their markup).
Well, good luck to them, they won't see a penny from me.
Long live SE Asia.
I think you can pay about three prices retail there, and I don't claim I understand how it happens. Shops in Akihabara are just prohibitive. Last time I visited, TRF cars were actually sold at Tamiya recommended retail, so in the 700$ region. I don't know why online prices are so different (because they are) maybe it's because you don't pay one of their impossible taxes. I couldn't buy anything there even though I wanted to. As simple as that. Never bought anything in Japan on my trips apart from camera gear which is sold very competitively (and there's a lot of stuff they only sell in Japan - at least for the first year of release).
In Europe, I tried to find Tamiya in Germany, Austria, Switzerland, Belgium, Sweden, France, the Czech Republic, Hungary and Italy. Considering this covers a market of 300 million people, it is inexistent. I don't care you know some shop where you can find it. (I didn't manage to find any hobby shops in my short trip across Denmark, if you care to illuminate, I'll stop next time and check it out).
And yes, you can find bits and bobs, usually the low end kits and plastic model kits, which is probably the bulk of Tamiya's business, but the TRF kits, I simply not have seen one in Europe (we are after all looking for TRF stuff).
Compare this with Hong Kong. If you went to RcMart shop, you'd think the Tamiya factory is in their back yard and there's a few of them, not just one. There was one shop in Akihabara where I found so much diversity, (and actually more), with stacks of TRF boxes everywhere and option parts I never heard of for all their kits. Prices however were as mentioned above.
For Australia, in recent times shipping has started to kill some of the online buying (long delays, bad service, high prices imposed by lots of parcels going missing so everybody mails stuff insured which is expensive and slow and needs lots of signatures).
That said, HK (and SE Asia) is still cheaper by a considerable margin, and with all the delays still quicker. Last I checked, it was six weeks to get something ordered through the shop, at a time when you could have it on your doorstep in three days at 1/3 the price form HK (now it's more like 2-4 weeks, but you can see, still quicker and a lot cheaper). Why bother?
My last purchase, a Yokomo BD7 kit was half price (plus shipping on top) compared to my local shop. I want to support my LHS, but they need to get real.
SIx weeks waiting time is not acceptable.
Price twice as high as overseas is not acceptable.
The situation is so bad in Australia, our government has put out information how to shop online without disclosing your IP address, because people like Apple, Microsoft and everybody else and their dog is reaming us just because they can. There was an investigation and basically these companies said so (I mean we're talking about digital objects, no manufacturing, packaging, transport, no shipping, no import fees, nothing, and we're still paying 1.7 times as much as americans/UK for instance). For physical goods, the same, even though the ipod/ipad/whatever for instance is not even made in the US/Europe, but here for some reason these things cost 1.7 times the price (before the importer slaps on their markup).
Well, good luck to them, they won't see a penny from me.
Long live SE Asia.
10-21-2014, 12:14 AM
#320
There are probably more of the like in EU, but modellbau-seidel.de has everything for the TRF's, competitive prices and delivers in two days.
Locally in Denmark, I have 2 shops in a 20 km radius and another one a little further away, that stocks various TRF parts. Not 100% but all "standard" parts.
But I have also bought from rcmart etc. I don't care where from. I always first check my LHS, if they can't deliver I shop abroad.
I actually tend not to care what the LHS sells or stocks. I'm much more interested in the availability on the net, ebay etc., because the LHS may sell and stock a certain brand this year, and maybe another brand next year or the year after.
I have seen a couple of cases where people went "all in" based on local LHS support only to be "ditched" the year after, because the LHS decided to sell another brand.
Locally in Denmark, I have 2 shops in a 20 km radius and another one a little further away, that stocks various TRF parts. Not 100% but all "standard" parts.
But I have also bought from rcmart etc. I don't care where from. I always first check my LHS, if they can't deliver I shop abroad.
I actually tend not to care what the LHS sells or stocks. I'm much more interested in the availability on the net, ebay etc., because the LHS may sell and stock a certain brand this year, and maybe another brand next year or the year after.
I have seen a couple of cases where people went "all in" based on local LHS support only to be "ditched" the year after, because the LHS decided to sell another brand.
10-21-2014, 01:40 AM
#321
The BD7 just landed here, it's going to be around 700AUD. Just got back from the shop, they have them in the shop but not sure about the price yet. There you go.
RcMart will probably have them at 450-490AUD (depending on exchange rate) plus shipping (generally about 20-30AUD). I can probably afford a pair of DCJ and a spare gear diff plus more for the difference.
If you care to link the Denmark shops here, I promise I'll drop by next time I'm over there and have a look.
Another problem I found with stuff bought in Europe is you can not get your tax back. Australia has probably the best system here, you just show your receipt at the airport before boarding and they pop back all the GST on your card, no forms, no fuss, no questions asked. All you need is the original receipt (which shows GST because it is the law).
For comparison, Europe is a pain in the butt (if you can get your money at all) and you don't get all the GST back, it's always less, because they use private companies that take their own cut. I tried to find out how to do it directly, without any middle man but even at the border, they give you those blue forms which means the customs basically hand you over to a third party company to be reamed. This is not allowed din Australia where the government can not (by law) have third party preferred companies in any activity. With the GST, they didn't even try so you get back 100%.
You get reamed by importers though, and these days, everything is imported.
RcMart will probably have them at 450-490AUD (depending on exchange rate) plus shipping (generally about 20-30AUD). I can probably afford a pair of DCJ and a spare gear diff plus more for the difference.
If you care to link the Denmark shops here, I promise I'll drop by next time I'm over there and have a look.
Another problem I found with stuff bought in Europe is you can not get your tax back. Australia has probably the best system here, you just show your receipt at the airport before boarding and they pop back all the GST on your card, no forms, no fuss, no questions asked. All you need is the original receipt (which shows GST because it is the law).
For comparison, Europe is a pain in the butt (if you can get your money at all) and you don't get all the GST back, it's always less, because they use private companies that take their own cut. I tried to find out how to do it directly, without any middle man but even at the border, they give you those blue forms which means the customs basically hand you over to a third party company to be reamed. This is not allowed din Australia where the government can not (by law) have third party preferred companies in any activity. With the GST, they didn't even try so you get back 100%.
You get reamed by importers though, and these days, everything is imported.
Last edited by niznai; 10-21-2014 at 09:41 AM.
10-21-2014, 02:05 AM
#322
I bought some hudy gear recently from Europe and paid no sales tax.
Worked out WAY cheaper than local. Ridiculously so. Even when paying 60euro for the delivery!
In fact, I couldn't even get it here realistically. They said 6-8week wait minimum, and "not 100% sure" (ie: waiting for a bigger order, then they will think about it)
Global economy. My money comes from all over the world and I don't care where my money goes really. Good service and fair price gets my business first and foremost.
Worked out WAY cheaper than local. Ridiculously so. Even when paying 60euro for the delivery!
In fact, I couldn't even get it here realistically. They said 6-8week wait minimum, and "not 100% sure" (ie: waiting for a bigger order, then they will think about it)
Global economy. My money comes from all over the world and I don't care where my money goes really. Good service and fair price gets my business first and foremost.
10-21-2014, 06:35 AM
#323
Japan has a very complicated pricing system.
I think you can pay about three prices retail there, and I don't claim I understand how it happens. Shops in Akihabara are just prohibitive. Last time I visited, TRF cars were actually sold at Tamiya recommended retail, so in the 700$ region. I don't know why online prices are so different (because they are) maybe it's because you don't pay one of their impossible taxes. I couldn't buy anything there even though I wanted to. As simple as that. Never bought anything in Japan on my trips apart from camera gear which is sold very competitively (and there's a lot of stuff they only sell in Japan - at least for the first year of release).
I think you can pay about three prices retail there, and I don't claim I understand how it happens. Shops in Akihabara are just prohibitive. Last time I visited, TRF cars were actually sold at Tamiya recommended retail, so in the 700$ region. I don't know why online prices are so different (because they are) maybe it's because you don't pay one of their impossible taxes. I couldn't buy anything there even though I wanted to. As simple as that. Never bought anything in Japan on my trips apart from camera gear which is sold very competitively (and there's a lot of stuff they only sell in Japan - at least for the first year of release).
Current prices for new tamiya cars:
trf419 for 45300 JPY (365 euro with 10% tax)
ff-04 for 32900 JPY (265 euro with 10% tax)
shops in akihabara are all around these same prices, only the official Tamiya store in Shimbashi is more expensive, but i would suggest a visit just to check their large collection of (build) cars and models.
since the devaluation of the JPY with the new prime minister in summer 2013, japan is the cheapest place to get japanese RC cars.
taxes are very simple, sale tax (VAT) is 10%
you can check prices of the biggest akihabara store RC CHAMP here:
http://www.rc-champ.co.jp/Champ_Web_...ar/6821930.pdf
just add the 10% and pay cash in the store they don't like plastic
you will, often find package deals and extra promos in the store.
last time out i got a ta06R with titanium screw set for 26000 JPY (+-190 euro)
and an mt-4 with RX471 for 18000 JPY (+-130 euro)
however if you don't read oir speak Japanese it can be more difficult.
i doubt very much that you visited an actual RC shop, if you walk into any big store and try to buy an rc car from the toy section you will pay official prices
10-21-2014, 06:41 AM
#324
10-21-2014, 07:39 AM
#326
i am in Akihabara 2 times a year, they sell way below tamiya prices
Current prices for new tamiya cars:
trf419 for 45300 JPY (365 euro with 10% tax)
ff-04 for 32900 JPY (265 euro with 10% tax)
shops in akihabara are all around these same prices, only the official Tamiya store in Shimbashi is more expensive, but i would suggest a visit just to check their large collection of (build) cars and models.
since the devaluation of the JPY with the new prime minister in summer 2013, japan is the cheapest place to get japanese RC cars.
taxes are very simple, sale tax (VAT) is 10%
you can check prices of the biggest akihabara store RC CHAMP here:
http://www.rc-champ.co.jp/Champ_Web_...ar/6821930.pdf
just add the 10% and pay cash in the store they don't like plastic
you will, often find package deals and extra promos in the store.
last time out i got a ta06R with titanium screw set for 26000 JPY (+-190 euro)
and an mt-4 with RX471 for 18000 JPY (+-130 euro)
however if you don't read oir speak Japanese it can be more difficult.
i doubt very much that you visited an actual RC shop, if you walk into any big store and try to buy an rc car from the toy section you will pay official prices
Current prices for new tamiya cars:
trf419 for 45300 JPY (365 euro with 10% tax)
ff-04 for 32900 JPY (265 euro with 10% tax)
shops in akihabara are all around these same prices, only the official Tamiya store in Shimbashi is more expensive, but i would suggest a visit just to check their large collection of (build) cars and models.
since the devaluation of the JPY with the new prime minister in summer 2013, japan is the cheapest place to get japanese RC cars.
taxes are very simple, sale tax (VAT) is 10%
you can check prices of the biggest akihabara store RC CHAMP here:
http://www.rc-champ.co.jp/Champ_Web_...ar/6821930.pdf
just add the 10% and pay cash in the store they don't like plastic
you will, often find package deals and extra promos in the store.
last time out i got a ta06R with titanium screw set for 26000 JPY (+-190 euro)
and an mt-4 with RX471 for 18000 JPY (+-130 euro)
however if you don't read oir speak Japanese it can be more difficult.
i doubt very much that you visited an actual RC shop, if you walk into any big store and try to buy an rc car from the toy section you will pay official prices
I agree to this statement.
Went to Akihabara too and the pricing were cheapest!
However the VAT Tax was 8%.
CMIIW
10-21-2014, 07:47 AM
#327
10-21-2014, 07:48 AM
#328
10-21-2014, 08:20 AM
#329
Besides RC-Champ, are there any other sites doing Pre-Orders for the 419?
10-21-2014, 09:48 AM
#330
I bought some hudy gear recently from Europe and paid no sales tax.
Worked out WAY cheaper than local. Ridiculously so. Even when paying 60euro for the delivery!
In fact, I couldn't even get it here realistically. They said 6-8week wait minimum, and "not 100% sure" (ie: waiting for a bigger order, then they will think about it)
Global economy. My money comes from all over the world and I don't care where my money goes really. Good service and fair price gets my business first and foremost.
Worked out WAY cheaper than local. Ridiculously so. Even when paying 60euro for the delivery!
In fact, I couldn't even get it here realistically. They said 6-8week wait minimum, and "not 100% sure" (ie: waiting for a bigger order, then they will think about it)
Global economy. My money comes from all over the world and I don't care where my money goes really. Good service and fair price gets my business first and foremost.
Dude, I don't give a diddly what you think. My experience is as I say it is. Vanilla stories like yours may happen but I wouldn't encourage anyone to book a trip to Japan (much as it is a beautiful country) on the chance they'll get R/C stuff at discounted prices.
I have used RC Champ on the web before I went to Japan, and I don't rate them as cheap, plus they like to hit me with all sorts of fees for using Paypal or credit which is what everybody in the world is using. They do however have some of the more difficult to obtain stuff outside Japan. And yes, I have been in their shop and it's all peachy keen until you show them a foreign credit card.
As for the prices you quote, I think they're out of your imagination for now. The cars have not been released yet let alone prices.
And lastly, when I travelled, the Australian dollar was at its highest so things should have been the cheapest for me to buy, but Japan had not heard of it apparently. The exchange rate in Japan was horrible as opposed to everywhere else.
Last edited by niznai; 10-21-2014 at 10:01 AM.