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Old 07-16-2014, 06:57 AM   #931
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Originally Posted by robk View Post
Can you see any rear tire marks inside the body? I have seen the tires contact the body under a lot of roll.

Although you think the camber is ok, how much do you have? You may not need much more than .5*.

The center shock uses HPI sized springs. Tamiya springs are too small of a diameter, unless you use a Tamiya shock bottom and adjuster on the body.

The front springs are pretty soft, something like a Tamiya gold or an .018 spring would possibly be a little better.

Also what are you putting on the tires? Sunscreen is usually the best thing in combination with an initial layer of paragon
@robk, I didn't notice it before, but now that you mention it there is a small area on the left hand side where the paint has been rubbed off: http://i.imgur.com/ovEPfG5.png

Will try less camber next time around. Started with 1* but since then a foam savvy local changed it to something else. Didn't check, but couldn't feel any difference either, the fronts seem to have enough grip no matter what.

I've switched to the 5* caster blocks (with both spacers in the back, thanks @liljohn1064) and started lowering the front, but ran out of thread on the screws so I have to source some 16 and 18mm ones before I can continue.
In the mean time I measured my tire diameters and found that there is some coning going on - the outer front diameters are 0,8 and 1 mm smaller than the inner, measured 1 cm from the outer and inner edges. If I look closely, I also see a thin line running the circumference of the fronts about 1/3 from the inner edge - looks like glued seam?

AFAIK Paragon isn't available here and amain.com says they can't ship that stuff abroad, but luckily almost everybody at the track seem to be happy with CS High Grip additive on both rubber and foam. Works like flypaper on my rubbered touring. Will ask if anybody has tried sun screen, at least it's in season during the same few months we are able to drive outside here
My LM-1 didn't need any sauce up front - tried 50% and had far too much grip for comfort - but I soak the rears for 20 minutes, wipe off and drive. Don't have warmers, and papertowels were scarse on last track day, so it took 10-12 seconds to run off the excess and/or get some heat in before the grip was at its best. Not sure how long the grip really lasts, because I frequently have to do a hairy save in the long high speed lefts and run into the dusty and unsugared part of the track.

However, my rear end problem in the long lefts was there from the first lap on, and if the fixes you all have suggested aren't working out I'll try to film what happens.

Now why didn't I think of switching the shock bottom and adjuster, or even the whole damper?

Thanks for all your suggestions, will let you how (when!) it works out
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Old 07-16-2014, 10:33 AM   #932
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Originally Posted by bakoo View Post
@robk, I didn't notice it before, but now that you mention it there is a small area on the left hand side where the paint has been rubbed off: http://i.imgur.com/ovEPfG5.png

Will try less camber next time around. Started with 1* but since then a foam savvy local changed it to something else. Didn't check, but couldn't feel any difference either, the fronts seem to have enough grip no matter what.

I've switched to the 5* caster blocks (with both spacers in the back, thanks @liljohn1064) and started lowering the front, but ran out of thread on the screws so I have to source some 16 and 18mm ones before I can continue.
In the mean time I measured my tire diameters and found that there is some coning going on - the outer front diameters are 0,8 and 1 mm smaller than the inner, measured 1 cm from the outer and inner edges. If I look closely, I also see a thin line running the circumference of the fronts about 1/3 from the inner edge - looks like glued seam?

AFAIK Paragon isn't available here and amain.com says they can't ship that stuff abroad, but luckily almost everybody at the track seem to be happy with CS High Grip additive on both rubber and foam. Works like flypaper on my rubbered touring. Will ask if anybody has tried sun screen, at least it's in season during the same few months we are able to drive outside here
My LM-1 didn't need any sauce up front - tried 50% and had far too much grip for comfort - but I soak the rears for 20 minutes, wipe off and drive. Don't have warmers, and papertowels were scarse on last track day, so it took 10-12 seconds to run off the excess and/or get some heat in before the grip was at its best. Not sure how long the grip really lasts, because I frequently have to do a hairy save in the long high speed lefts and run into the dusty and unsugared part of the track.

However, my rear end problem in the long lefts was there from the first lap on, and if the fixes you all have suggested aren't working out I'll try to film what happens.

Now why didn't I think of switching the shock bottom and adjuster, or even the whole damper?

Thanks for all your suggestions, will let you how (when!) it works out
I just increased camber until the tire wore flat again. I'm right around 1.5 to 1.75. Honestly if the grip is good and the coning doesn't bother you, Rob is right. The flatter you can get the tire at full lock, the better. Rob knows his foam brother!
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Old 07-16-2014, 10:48 AM   #933
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Originally Posted by liljohn1064 View Post
I just increased camber until the tire wore flat again. I'm right around 1.5 to 1.75. Honestly if the grip is good and the coning doesn't bother you, Rob is right. The flatter you can get the tire at full lock, the better. Rob knows his foam brother!
I agree, I'm running what Rob would consider a lot of camber as well. Being a long time oval guy from years past I always look for even wear. I agree 100% with liljohn on your ride height. I'm at 4mm on fairly smooth, and what I would consider average grip asphalt (prepped parking lot)

I'm shocked your not having heat issues with your gearing I'm 72/19, but I likely have more tight sections than you.
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Old 07-16-2014, 10:53 AM   #934
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bakoo, the pic you linked. How are you getting tire rub in that spot?? That looks more like the spur gear rubbing (I have some) than tire rub. Unless your rear pod is loose, which I'll doubt, and it's shifting that far.
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Old 07-16-2014, 12:36 PM   #935
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Originally Posted by Solara View Post
Finished the 3rd revision, will see what else we need to change before the final molding.

Some other versions of the 908:
Attached Thumbnails
Speed Passion brand new Spec Racing LeMans car - The LM1-oreca-908.jpg   Speed Passion brand new Spec Racing LeMans car - The LM1-pink-oreca-908.jpg   Speed Passion brand new Spec Racing LeMans car - The LM1-green-oreca-908.jpg   Speed Passion brand new Spec Racing LeMans car - The LM1-yellow-oreca-908.jpg   Speed Passion brand new Spec Racing LeMans car - The LM1-oreca-peugeot-908.jpg  

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Old 07-16-2014, 01:38 PM   #936
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I just increased camber until the tire wore flat again. I'm right around 1.5 to 1.75. Honestly if the grip is good and the coning doesn't bother you, Rob is right. The flatter you can get the tire at full lock, the better. Rob knows his foam brother!
This is not only my first pan car, but my first set of foams, so at this point any tire shape preference comes solely from the inherent beauty of symmetry If the car sticks better with some coning, and swapping left and right fronts every pack keeps the wear even between the two sides, I don't care about the shape.

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I agree, I'm running what Rob would consider a lot of camber as well. Being a long time oval guy from years past I always look for even wear. I agree 100% with liljohn on your ride height. I'm at 4mm on fairly smooth, and what I would consider average grip asphalt (prepped parking lot)

I'm shocked your not having heat issues with your gearing I'm 72/19, but I likely have more tight sections than you.
Got the rear down to 4mm using the 1.5 inserts and with the old tires on, but since I could only fit a 1mm spacer without risking the front screws, the front is locked at 6mm until the longer screws arrive.
(Edit: Updated the ride height values, which changed radically as soon as I remembered to tighten the center spring after reassembly...)

Droop is now at 0,6mm on both sides, but when I test for tweak, one side still drops the coin 0,1mm before the other. Can it be as simple as having more of my electronics on that side of the car?
The only other issue I'm aware of, is that I don't really know when I'm done adjusting the side springs, so I just went by the book and then added half a turn like John suggested

I love our track, even if it is a 50 minutes indirect bus trip away. It's 204 meters/669 feet long, open and flowing, and rarely packed. The only downsides are the nordic climate and the neighbouring sand volley pit.
My best LM-1 lap last week was 17.8 (with an average of around 20, which hints to the problems I'm having). It's still 2.5 seconds behind my best superstock lap that week, so I believe there is a lot to gain.
I've dialled both punch and braking down to a minimum, running a blinky ESC and zero timing on the motor, and haven't yet been able to lay the power down in the long lefthanders (See 1 and 2 in this pic of our track), so I haven't needed to brake much erither.
As you all have been saying I've almost certainly geared too hard, with the biggest hint so far being that I can't keep the revs up through the topmost corner before the straight. As soon as I get the car to stick I'll drop a tooth on the pinion, but until now my longest run has been only 6 minutes, bringing the motor to 90 C.

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Originally Posted by racer1812 View Post
bakoo, the pic you linked. How are you getting tire rub in that spot?? That looks more like the spur gear rubbing (I have some) than tire rub. Unless your rear pod is loose, which I'll doubt, and it's shifting that far.
Looks like the culprit is the C-tab on the motor. Plan on getting longer cables on my ESC so I can center the electronics mass, will probably resolder the C-tab at the same time.

Last edited by bakoo; 07-16-2014 at 05:08 PM. Reason: Updated ride height values
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Old 07-16-2014, 05:41 PM   #937
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I haven't checked it yet, so I apologize in advance for asking. Is the axle interchangeable with the F103, F104, or others?
Yes, you can fit a Tamiya diff in there. if you are just changing the axle then you will need the F103 or F104 axle, diff joint and diff housing parts to replace the LM-1 axle and diff housing.
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Old 07-16-2014, 06:09 PM   #938
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Thanks, Terry.
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Old 07-17-2014, 03:18 PM   #939
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2014 Rebellion R-One. The flat front fender can give you some wiggle room between 270mm and 280mm wheelbase chassis.
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Old 07-17-2014, 07:35 PM   #940
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I want to buy this car after 2 years in a roll attended the 24 hrs of Le Mans watching Audi R18 wooping ass!
Only thing stop me is we do weekly Parking lot racing with our 1/8 GTE class and now will try to start 1/10 scale Touring car.
This LMP1 only have foam tires and low to ground. We run spec tire of Sweeps from Touring car which I think it won't match this chassis. Any one race one of these on Parking lot asfault and what is the handling & durability?
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Old 07-18-2014, 05:47 AM   #941
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I want to buy this car after 2 years in a roll attended the 24 hrs of Le Mans watching Audi R18 wooping ass!
Only thing stop me is we do weekly Parking lot racing with our 1/8 GTE class and now will try to start 1/10 scale Touring car.
This LMP1 only have foam tires and low to ground. We run spec tire of Sweeps from Touring car which I think it won't match this chassis. Any one race one of these on Parking lot asfault and what is the handling & durability?
Ride height is adjustable both front and rear. Out of the box the front ride height is like 7-9mm, so it's not really that low. Most guys I know run 4-5mm even for parking lot racing. Shims are used to adjust front ride height and standard pan car spacers are used in the rear.

I race on a prepped (soda/pop) parking lot and the kit tires work amazingly well actually.
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Old 07-18-2014, 08:14 AM   #942
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The front end will always need 2 to 4mm longer screws to get the ride height down.

I added the CF option parts to the rear aluminum pod plates and picked up .5 seconds a lap. Of course it could be that I cleaned and inspected all the parts when reassembling.... Just need the main chassis to come out and battery brace to come back in stock finish stiffening the car up.
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Old 07-18-2014, 08:21 AM   #943
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You're on carpet though right John?

I know one guy I run with who has added all the CF parts to his but I haven't driven it yet. I'm not sure stiffer is better on a medium grip parking lot...?

It would be nice if SP would show you how, and give enough hardware, to space both the LM1 and the SP-1 down to 4-5mm ride height. (in the front)
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Old 07-18-2014, 08:30 AM   #944
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You're on carpet though right John?

I know one guy I run with who has added all the CF parts to his but I haven't driven it yet. I'm not sure stiffer is better on a medium grip parking lot...?

It would be nice if SP would show you how, and give enough hardware, to space both the LM1 and the SP-1 down to 4-5mm ride height. (in the front)
As far as the rear pod. I wanted that to be virtually one solid piece. CF was the only way to do that. The plastic left pod brace bound and snapped on mine. The shock brace had too much flex and allowed the pod shape, axle and motor to shift. The lower pod plate stopped most of the that and the rear brace stopped all side to side flex. The front half parts may not be needed.

I agree! They should include the optional spacers and screws. Not everyone has a box of those floating around. 15 to 18 mm screws can be hard to find.
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Old 07-19-2014, 05:56 PM   #945
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Some other versions of the 908:
The last one on your list there the #4 car is the one I'd like to try painting up.
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