R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 03-10-2014, 03:47 PM   #241
Tech Champion
 
RedBullFiXX's Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Intergalactic Planetary
Posts: 6,539
Trader Rating: 34 (100%+)
Cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by gazza View Post
Just got the new frontend today! Can't wait to put some laps on it at Middle River this weekend.
looks sweet, let us know how it works
__________________
--> 12th scale Information Source <--

"Men do not quit playing because they grow old; they grow old because they quit playing."
― Oliver Wendell Holmes Jr.
RedBullFiXX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2014, 02:36 PM   #242
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 1,117
Trader Rating: 13 (100%+)
Default

Wanted to share some setup info for the new front-end... For those who purchased one, this should give you a good place to start if you feel like exploring outside the typical caster window that the standard old-skool provides.

This is not the setup I would go into a race like Vegas or Snowbirds with(we already have a great setup for the super-high bite, billiard table smooth stuff)... but since the majority of customers/drivers are going to be racing their cars at their locals tracks in conditions that are similar, it should transfer very well.

The facility that I have been racing/testing @ in Houston has pretty good grip... I would say it is Medium-High for a club track. This is not a subfloor track... so there are a few little bumps, but nothing serious. The layout that we have down now has a couple hairpins/180s, including one at the end of the straight. When I had the standard old-skool front end on my Rev8, the car just didn't carry the speed in these 180s that I thought it should. I had to wait to get on the throttle at corner exit. With the extra caster that you can easily tune in to the New-Skool front end, the car was much better in these areas.

In the past, Ive always tried to measure/compare caster with a standard adjustable camber gauge against the kingpin. This is cumbersome at best... The Slapmaster caster gauge is a god-send for dialing in the New-Skool front end. If you are planning on playing with caster on your new front end (which I strongly encourage, given how easy it is to adjust), get yourself one of these gauges.

Anyhoo... The setup that I ended up on is attached below. Along with a shot of the car.

I do want to note that, since I started driving the Rev8 back in Oct, I have almost always been faster with the transverse setup at my club tracks. Again, Snowbirds/Vegas/Etc is another story... but on lower bite carpet, the transverse has been the ticket for me with the old-skool front end. However, with the new front end and extra caster, I felt that I no longer had to depend on the weight transfer to get the car in and out of the corner quickly. My inline car with the New-Skool was wicked fast. I didn't have a chance to test the battery configs back-to-back... but my inline car did everything that I wanted it to.


Attached Files
File Type: pdf JamesL_Rev8_Inline_RSD.pdf (375.2 KB, 165 views)
JamesL_71 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2014, 02:41 PM   #243
sg1
Tech Elite
 
sg1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ohio
Posts: 2,787
Trader Rating: 79 (100%+)
Default

Nice looking ride James!

I like the motor too
__________________
**Team Scream**Parma/PSE**TQ Wire**Roche**Pemberton**BSR**Graupner/GM**SXT**
sg1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2014, 04:56 PM   #244
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 1,117
Trader Rating: 13 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sg1 View Post
Nice looking ride James!

I like the motor too
Dialed chassis + fast motor = win
JamesL_71 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2014, 06:10 PM   #245
Tech Regular
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Garner, NC
Posts: 390
Default

I just had my first race weekend with this car and it turned out well. I ended up taking 4th at the Minnesota State Champs race. There were 38 1/12 cars at the race, I had the only SM. Thank you to Joel and Bruce, it is a great car and I couldn't be more happy with it.
avink007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2014, 06:16 PM   #246
Tech Champion
 
RedBullFiXX's Avatar
R/C Tech Elite Subscriber
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Intergalactic Planetary
Posts: 6,539
Trader Rating: 34 (100%+)
Cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by avink007 View Post
I just had my first race weekend with this car and it turned out well. I ended up taking 4th at the Minnesota State Champs race. There were 38 1/12 cars at the race, I had the only SM. Thank you to Joel and Bruce, it is a great car and I couldn't be more happy with it.
Glad to hear you got her all dialed in
That was fast
__________________
--> 12th scale Information Source <--

"Men do not quit playing because they grow old; they grow old because they quit playing."
― Oliver Wendell Holmes Jr.
RedBullFiXX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2014, 07:38 PM   #247
avs
Tech Master
 
avs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,144
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesL_71 View Post
Wanted to share some setup info for the new front-end... For those who purchased one, this should give you a good place to start if you feel like exploring outside the typical caster window that the standard old-skool provides.

Anyhoo... The setup that I ended up on is attached below. Along with a shot of the car.

I do want to note that, since I started driving the Rev8 back in Oct, I have almost always been faster with the transverse setup at my club tracks. Again, Snowbirds/Vegas/Etc is another story... but on lower bite carpet, the transverse has been the ticket for me with the old-skool front end. However, with the new front end and extra caster, I felt that I no longer had to depend on the weight transfer to get the car in and out of the corner quickly. My inline car with the New-Skool was wicked fast. I didn't have a chance to test the battery configs back-to-back... but my inline car did everything that I wanted it to.
I have also been trying to get an inline layout to work, it seems like transverse is faster for me.

one detail question on your setup, when you indicate 1.5 turns on the side springs, does this mean 1.5 turns of preload on the springs or 1.5 turns from fully raised which are just lightly touching?
__________________
Tony Shimko
avs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-28-2014, 07:56 PM   #248
Tech Elite
 
andrewdoherty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: ★Wylie, TX★
Posts: 3,763
Trader Rating: 47 (100%+)
Default

I'm sure he means 1.5 down from the top, not 1.5 of preload.
__________________
"Whether you think you can, or think you can't, you're right." -Henry Ford
"[Driving] Genius is 1% inspiration, and 99% perspiration" -T.A. Edison
|◤Hobbywing◢|◤SpeedzoneUSA.com◢|◤Pro-One◢|
|◤ReflexRacing.net◢|◤Protoform◢|◤AVID R/C◢|
andrewdoherty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2014, 12:52 AM   #249
avs
Tech Master
 
avs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,144
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewdoherty View Post
I'm sure he means 1.5 down from the top, not 1.5 of preload.
thanks, glad I asked. I had been thinking they meant more preload, which really wasn't working so well.
__________________
Tony Shimko
avs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2014, 10:17 AM   #250
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 1,117
Trader Rating: 13 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by avs View Post
I have also been trying to get an inline layout to work, it seems like transverse is faster for me.

one detail question on your setup, when you indicate 1.5 turns on the side springs, does this mean 1.5 turns of preload on the springs or 1.5 turns from fully raised which are just lightly touching?
Sorry... Yes, just like Andrew said, this is 1.5 turns from fully backed off. Which lets the springs just kiss the rear pod plate.

With the inline car, you have much less weight transfer to the front off-throttle... so you cannot simply jump off the throttle and let the car whip around the corner. This places a larger emphasis on the settings of the front suspension, springs, lube, etc. The front of your car really needs to be making the correct balance of mechanical grip (and making that grip in the correct stage of the turn, depending on track layout). This can take some time and testing to get it just right. And if you are using the old-skool front end, it can be a pain to adjust caster/camber and get everything perfect from side to side. The upside to this, IMO, is that once you get the car working well with the inline config, it seems to be more consistent and retains better steering towards the end of the run. Since you are depending less upon the weight transfer, you will find that the car makes very similar amounts of steering regardless of the corner type(or speed at which you are approaching the corner)... You will also find that the steering does not fizzle out towards the end of the race, when you are low on battery and digging into the throttle(and not letting off nearly as much) more and more.

Since moving to the new-skool front end, I have been having much more success with the inline config @ club tracks. I will get a chance to test it out in a higher bite setting @ MHIC in 2 weeks, as well.
JamesL_71 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2014, 01:13 PM   #251
avs
Tech Master
 
avs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,144
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesL_71 View Post
Sorry... Yes, just like Andrew said, this is 1.5 turns from fully backed off. Which lets the springs just kiss the rear pod plate.

With the inline car, you have much less weight transfer to the front off-throttle... so you cannot simply jump off the throttle and let the car whip around the corner. This places a larger emphasis on the settings of the front suspension, springs, lube, etc. The front of your car really needs to be making the correct balance of mechanical grip (and making that grip in the correct stage of the turn, depending on track layout). This can take some time and testing to get it just right. And if you are using the old-skool front end, it can be a pain to adjust caster/camber and get everything perfect from side to side. The upside to this, IMO, is that once you get the car working well with the inline config, it seems to be more consistent and retains better steering towards the end of the run. Since you are depending less upon the weight transfer, you will find that the car makes very similar amounts of steering regardless of the corner type(or speed at which you are approaching the corner)... You will also find that the steering does not fizzle out towards the end of the race, when you are low on battery and digging into the throttle(and not letting off nearly as much) more and more.

Since moving to the new-skool front end, I have been having much more success with the inline config @ club tracks. I will get a chance to test it out in a higher bite setting @ MHIC in 2 weeks, as well.
thanks for the insight, seems like I was too focused on the change in lateral weight transfer and ignoring the difference in fore-aft transfer. with a transverse layout I had been most successful with minimal droop like 0.5mm and equal middle and rear ride heights, and .25mm of rake in the front.

so sorry this brings up another question regarding sag vs middle and rear ride height. (I had always equated rear sag with the difference between the middle and rear ride height, so in your case that would be around 0.5mm sag due to the 3.4mm mid and 3.8mm rear ride heights).
what measurement does one get 1mm sag from? if you measure sag from the upper travel limit to static ride height, then it would be closer to 2mm?
__________________
Tony Shimko
avs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2014, 07:36 AM   #252
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 1,117
Trader Rating: 13 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by avs View Post
so sorry this brings up another question regarding sag vs middle and rear ride height. (I had always equated rear sag with the difference between the middle and rear ride height, so in your case that would be around 0.5mm sag due to the 3.4mm mid and 3.8mm rear ride heights).
what measurement does one get 1mm sag from? if you measure sag from the upper travel limit to static ride height, then it would be closer to 2mm?
Sag is difference between the static center ride height and the center ride height at full extension of the shock. Basically... measure the center ride height, then pull up on the top of the shock or antenna, and re-measure. The difference between the 2 measurements will give you your chassis sag measurement.

I typically measure the pod droop by placing the car on droop blocks and measuring from the pit board to the rear edge of the pod plate with a pair of calipers... then subtracting the height of the droop blocks.

Using this method to measure droop has pretty much always left me with pod droop and chassis sag measurements that differ by just a little bit. But the exact #s aren't as important as making sure A) you have some sag in the car, and B) that you measure the sag/droop the same every time, so you can compare from setup to setup/change to change. If you have 1mm(+/- .5mm) of droop and sag, you will be in the ballpark.
JamesL_71 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2014, 10:12 AM   #253
Tech Master
 
LonnyJ1950's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ. USA
Posts: 1,141
Default

You're actually measuring droop 2 different ways. This is what Bruce says about it:

http://www.petitrc.com/reglages/spee...hassisSag.html
__________________
Lonny
LonnyJ1950 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2014, 10:31 AM   #254
Tech Champion
 
JayBee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: 12TH-MAN COUNTRY
Posts: 6,803
Trader Rating: 31 (100%+)
Default

Someone please correct me....I may be wrong but when I read that, it seems to me that both measurements are predicated by the center shocks length and springs preload. In other words, at a certain chassis sag you will have a fixed amount of rear pod droop.
Or can both measurements be found independently of each other? For example...can you have 2mm of chassis sag & 2mm of rear pod droop?
__________________
R C 3 G R A F I X _ F U S I O N . G R A P H I X _ S E A T T L E - R/C - R A C E R S _ E M E R A L D C I T Y R C . C O M

A E - 12R5.2 _ S M - REV8 PRO
JayBee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2014, 11:20 AM   #255
Tech Addict
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 734
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
Default

Droop is strictly length of shock. It's the physical travel. Sag is the 'dead space' before the weight transfer.

Neither is something I measure. I'm going to steal James' tools or cars in Denver. I never measure ride height at the rear of the pod. Droop and sag is a visual and feel thing to me.

You can adjust sag by axle height and preload. But I never change my rear ride height adjusters and never touched my tamale pod. When your car is ready to go I load the car by pressing on the tweak brace body posts with thumb and pinky fingers. Then pull up on the body clips with those fingers. There should be some dead space (sag)
JoelV is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 11:56 PM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net

SEO by vBSEO 3.5.0