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Old 04-21-2015, 03:12 PM   #1141
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TB04R might be my next chassis to run simply because part supply is starting to dry up for ta05v2 and TB03. Or fingers crossed for a new design to surface before end of the year. I currently do not quite understand Tamiya's reasoning behind building midrange cars with tubs and no top deck. I think the route spec r and 3 racing took for mid range cars makes more sense for racers or I might be missing something. Using FRP decks and plastic bulkheads will cut down significantly on tooling and design cost. Maybe I'm missing on the machining cost but now a days the chassis do not have nearly as many holes as they used to. Just develop some plastic bulkheads and they are ready to go. For belt cars bending stiffness is a must and tub cars without top decks simply won't do it. As for shaft cars I think a tub design is pretty good.

Also, the quick form material looks very interesting. Wonder if that will make it to mid range TC cars.
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Old 04-21-2015, 04:09 PM   #1142
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Which parts for the TA05 are drying up? I own a version 1 and Tamiya still has everything available. Also keep in mind, parts from later cars can be used in earlier cars. The only real part you have to worry about is the belt.. The rest of driveline can be found if you know where to look. The ball diffs, gear diffs, spools, pulleys of later cars can all be used with the TA05. Suspension arms can all be upgraded to the 418 style.

As for why they have plastic tub cars, here are a few reasons

1. Tamiya is a plastic model company it's in their DNA
2. Tamiya doesn't just make cars for racers. Sales to racers most likely only account for a small percentage of their sales
3. Plastic tub cars are part of their TCS class rules

The TA03 and TA04 both had an FRP / Carbon Upper deck, either standard or as an option. On the TA05 they decided to move away from it.. However if you look at the bulk heads, it does have screw mount holes for a top deck. As to why, maybe the chassis stiffners are sufficient in their opinion.

The TA06 was over engineered imo.. Maybe they will go back to TA05 layout for the TA07.
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Old 04-21-2015, 04:34 PM   #1143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raman View Post
Which parts for the TA05 are drying up? I own a version 1 and Tamiya still has everything available. Also keep in mind, parts from later cars can be used in earlier cars. The only real part you have to worry about is the belt.. The rest of driveline can be found if you know where to look. The ball diffs, gear diffs, spools, pulleys of later cars can all be used with the TA05. Suspension arms can all be upgraded to the 418 style.

As for why they have plastic tub cars, here are a few reasons

1. Tamiya is a plastic model company it's in their DNA
2. Tamiya doesn't just make cars for racers. Sales to racers most likely only account for a small percentage of their sales
3. Plastic tub cars are part of their TCS class rules

The TA03 and TA04 both had an FRP / Carbon Upper deck, either standard or as an option. On the TA05 they decided to move away from it.. However if you look at the bulk heads, it does have screw mount holes for a top deck. As to why, maybe the chassis stiffners are sufficient in their opinion.

The TA06 was over engineered imo.. Maybe they will go back to TA05 layout for the TA07.
Parts will dry up eventually. Parts like the chassis bottom plate, spur holder, bulkheads, belts are starting to thin out. I tend to swap out a chassis bottom at least once a year due to bending. In my experience a tub chassis still needs a top deck to keep it from bananaing. I just stripped my spur holder and was only able to find one in Japan. Belts actually wear down much slower than i anticipated and also pretty durable.

TA06 also seems over engineered to me. I have not tried it myself but others say the drive train loss prevent it from being competitive in larger tracks.

I think you have a good point on Tamiya being a company based on injected plastic products.

As of now I think TB04R is a viable choice for replacing my aging ta05 in the future. I've built one for a friend and was not impressed by the complicated design but it seems to be efficient.
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Old 04-21-2015, 04:48 PM   #1144
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At least on the TB04 something as mundane as adjusting motor timing is not a PITA...

Spur gear change is better as well.. but still surprisingly "screwy"... need to take five of those cap screws just to see it: "what spur is on there again?". And if you want/need to change the spur/pinoin (with the adapter on the motor to allow for larger pinions) checking how the gears mesh is harder than it should be.

edit: When comparing to TB03.
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Old 04-21-2015, 05:53 PM   #1145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by torg View Post
At least on the TB04 something as mundane as adjusting motor timing is not a PITA...

Spur gear change is better as well.. but still surprisingly "screwy"... need to take five of those cap screws just to see it: "what spur is on there again?". And if you want/need to change the spur/pinoin (with the adapter on the motor to allow for larger pinions) checking how the gears mesh is harder than it should be.

edit: When comparing to TB03.
Torg you have a TB04?
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Old 04-21-2015, 07:52 PM   #1146
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I'd love a real TB03 vs TB04 comparison review...
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Old 04-21-2015, 10:35 PM   #1147
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Originally Posted by tobyzhang View Post
Torg you have a TB04?
yeah. Last year I had just finished building it before TCS nationals, but ended up going with my TA06 since I had more laps on it... then this year I built TB03 from parts since everyone was saying TB04 has gearing disadvantage. But I was running 3.8 FDR in GT3 w/R1Wurks UltraPremiumDeluxeProPlusExtremeMegaDopplerHD+ 21.5, which they can both do... so I want to dust the TB04 off again.

In GT2/17.5 things may be different?
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Old 04-22-2015, 04:39 AM   #1148
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raman View Post
Which parts for the TA05 are drying up? I own a version 1 and Tamiya still has everything available. Also keep in mind, parts from later cars can be used in earlier cars. The only real part you have to worry about is the belt.. The rest of driveline can be found if you know where to look. The ball diffs, gear diffs, spools, pulleys of later cars can all be used with the TA05. Suspension arms can all be upgraded to the 418 style.

As for why they have plastic tub cars, here are a few reasons

1. Tamiya is a plastic model company it's in their DNA
2. Tamiya doesn't just make cars for racers. Sales to racers most likely only account for a small percentage of their sales
3. Plastic tub cars are part of their TCS class rules

The TA03 and TA04 both had an FRP / Carbon Upper deck, either standard or as an option. On the TA05 they decided to move away from it.. However if you look at the bulk heads, it does have screw mount holes for a top deck. As to why, maybe the chassis stiffners are sufficient in their opinion.

The TA06 was over engineered imo.. Maybe they will go back to TA05 layout for the TA07.
I am looking forward to the TA07 and do hope that the go back to the TA05 layout. I never owned a TA06.
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Old 04-22-2015, 01:23 PM   #1149
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Originally Posted by torg View Post
yeah. Last year I had just finished building it before TCS nationals, but ended up going with my TA06 since I had more laps on it... then this year I built TB03 from parts since everyone was saying TB04 has gearing disadvantage. But I was running 3.8 FDR in GT3 w/R1Wurks UltraPremiumDeluxeProPlusExtremeMegaDopplerHD+ 21.5, which they can both do... so I want to dust the TB04 off again.

In GT2/17.5 things may be different?
I bought a few 70t spur before and it will definitely make TB04 work for gt3
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Old 04-22-2015, 10:58 PM   #1150
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Quote:
Originally Posted by torg View Post
At least on the TB04 something as mundane as adjusting motor timing is not a PITA...

Spur gear change is better as well.. but still surprisingly "screwy"... need to take five of those cap screws just to see it: "what spur is on there again?". And if you want/need to change the spur/pinoin (with the adapter on the motor to allow for larger pinions) checking how the gears mesh is harder than it should be.

edit: When comparing to TB03.

I know you guys are die hard Tamiya fans, but I'd have to disagree with this about motor timing adjustment difficulty. Use smaller electronics, place them forward, and cut an allen key down to fit in the space! Trust me it works...

As for the spur change, it takes me roughly the same amount of time to change one on either 03 or 04. I dont own the 04, but have tuned for a friend. Plate chassis cars take even longer actually because I have to remove the top deck and pull E clips and then recheck the chassis for tweak. The 419 does not get any easier than a 417.

I can show you if you'd like at Tamiya practice next time.... I'm the new guy there

TB04R is on my list in case I need a replacement for TB03. The outdrives wear toooo fast. I have to buy those in 2 sets at a time.
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Old 04-22-2015, 11:12 PM   #1151
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Greenpea, you can change the spur on the trf419 by removing the front diff (4 screws) and the layshaft screws (2 screws). Keep your top deck on
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Old 04-22-2015, 11:38 PM   #1152
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Just looked at the chassis.
You're right!
Got so used to my 417.
419 doesn't have screws on the motor mount except for the central one on the top deck. I've had it for a month. Awesome chassis on carpet.
Thanks for the tip!
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Old 04-23-2015, 04:24 AM   #1153
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No worries I know cplus has a way that doesn't even require removing the front diff! He removes the front belt by rolling it around or something so he only has to remove the center lay shaft screws and the spur is free.

I found my TRF419 to be so much easier to work on then the tb04 pro v2. Its a combination of the fact that aluminium is easier to screw into as well as the design. Removing the spur on the tb04 was always a pain, setting gear mesh could only be done with out the center bulkhead cover on when using a small spur gear like a 64p 73t
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Old 04-23-2015, 06:58 AM   #1154
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Originally Posted by tobyzhang View Post
I bought a few 70t spur before and it will definitely make TB04 work for gt3

70T? What size pinion are you using? I'm currently running 72T with a 52T pinion using the exotek adapter. Even with 72T I find getting the motor close enough to mesh properly difficult.
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Old 04-23-2015, 10:39 AM   #1155
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Originally Posted by greenpea76 View Post
Use smaller electronics, place them forward, and cut an allen key down to fit in the space! Trust me it works...
This is what I have done, impossible to change timing otherwise. Still a pain..
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