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Old 06-13-2014, 07:08 PM   #421
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New R1Wurks motor 1500+ rotors and no poof. Have tried gearing from 3.4fdr to 4.0fdr with different motor timings and it works well in all ranges. Just in case any of you guys wanted to go over to the dark side.
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Old 06-13-2014, 07:34 PM   #422
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Josh, I would have gotten those if they were in stock...

By the way, how are you guys adjusting the timing without damaging stuff? If I pull the rotor out, it adjusts very smooth. I don't see that as an easy option when they're in the cars.
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Old 06-14-2014, 12:12 AM   #423
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Josh, I would have gotten those if they were in stock...

By the way, how are you guys adjusting the timing without damaging stuff? If I pull the rotor out, it adjusts very smooth. I don't see that as an easy option when they're in the cars.
Your talking about the killshot timing plate not being able to move easy right? Another big flaw. You have to take the whole timing endbell assembly apart. I had to grind down the metal ring backing because it binded when fully assembled. Also the the ring within the ring I had to sand down those edges as well. Big fun when purchasing a new motor. Sorry about the R1 motors being out of stock. Steve has his hands full at the moment and I know he is replenishing those as we speak.
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Old 06-14-2014, 02:36 AM   #424
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New R1Wurks motor 1500+ rotors and no poof. Have tried gearing from 3.4fdr to 4.0fdr with different motor timings and it works well in all ranges. Just in case any of you guys wanted to go over to the dark side.
what size rotor
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Old 06-14-2014, 07:27 AM   #425
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what size rotor
12.5
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Old 06-14-2014, 01:30 PM   #426
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Josh, I would have gotten those if they were in stock...

By the way, how are you guys adjusting the timing without damaging stuff? If I pull the rotor out, it adjusts very smooth. I don't see that as an easy option when they're in the cars.
+1 on the R1 unavailability, that's why I have 3 Kill Shots.

No problem with the timing ring on any of my timing KS rings, very easy to adjust.
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Old 06-14-2014, 01:52 PM   #427
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Default Max timing on a KILL SHOT?

Many people on this thread , including myself, have said not to go beyond 55 to 60 degrees of timing on the Kill Shot motors. I was playing with my dyno this afternoon and now I'm not sure that is valid advise. First, I have two 21.5 RPM stator KSs, one with the 12.5mm RPM rotor and one with the 12.5mm turquoise Torque rotor. On both, I've tested the motors up to 70 degrees of timing before the amp draw starts to go crazy. Between 60 and 70 degrees the amp draw is very consistent with other 21.5 motors at much less timing, but the performance is very good. I'm going to take a few teeth off the pinion to account for the higher RPM, then make a few test runs and check the motor temps. I anticipate these will come off the track at about the same temps as other motors with the same amp draws. I'll let you know.
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Old 06-15-2014, 01:16 AM   #428
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I recently purchased a Killshot 21.5R for my TC6.1 for the upcoming carpet racing season.
Running a MMP for an ESC and altho we need to run "blinky" mode for the VTA class I'm running, I'd like to play around with the timing to see how she'll run. Mech timing vs static (ESC) timing, is there a lot of difference?

The MMP has "cheat" mode with adjustable timing which is what I'd like to use, can I get the same effect with this as mech timing?
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Old 06-15-2014, 01:24 AM   #429
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Originally Posted by Josh-n-ya View Post
Your talking about the killshot timing plate not being able to move easy right? Another big flaw. You have to take the whole timing endbell assembly apart. I had to grind down the metal ring backing because it binded when fully assembled. Also the the ring within the ring I had to sand down those edges as well. Big fun when purchasing a new motor. Sorry about the R1 motors being out of stock. Steve has his hands full at the moment and I know he is replenishing those as we speak.
I used the aluminum option timing ring on all my killshot. Moving the timing is now smooth. If you don't want to go the grinding route.
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Old 06-16-2014, 11:58 AM   #430
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Originally Posted by Yosh70 View Post
I recently purchased a Killshot 21.5R for my TC6.1 for the upcoming carpet racing season.
Running a MMP for an ESC and altho we need to run "blinky" mode for the VTA class I'm running, I'd like to play around with the timing to see how she'll run. Mech timing vs static (ESC) timing, is there a lot of difference?

The MMP has "cheat" mode with adjustable timing which is what I'd like to use, can I get the same effect with this as mech timing?
There's no difference between mechanical timing and static ESC timing. If you have a static amount of timing it's the same throughout the rev range.

There is a big difference between static and dynamic timing. Dynamic timing will make a motor faster throughout the rev range because the timing goes in when the motor can use it, whereas with static timing the timing can only be used at the point it is most useful - usually at the top of the rev range. Apart from the that, the excess timing just creates excess heat.

If you are certain that the ESC timing is static, then you can have the same effect with the mechanical timing. But, as you say, if it is a blinky class the the Esc timing is illegal. HTH
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Old 06-16-2014, 02:06 PM   #431
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Originally Posted by John Wallace2 View Post
Many people on this thread , including myself, have said not to go beyond 55 to 60 degrees of timing on the Kill Shot motors. I was playing with my dyno this afternoon and now I'm not sure that is valid advise. First, I have two 21.5 RPM stator KSs, one with the 12.5mm RPM rotor and one with the 12.5mm turquoise Torque rotor. On both, I've tested the motors up to 70 degrees of timing before the amp draw starts to go crazy. Between 60 and 70 degrees the amp draw is very consistent with other 21.5 motors at much less timing, but the performance is very good. I'm going to take a few teeth off the pinion to account for the higher RPM, then make a few test runs and check the motor temps. I anticipate these will come off the track at about the same temps as other motors with the same amp draws. I'll let you know.
Be careful. I also went this route with the 17.5 motors. I got very good results with cranking timing up to 65 or70 with fdr at 4.0 to 4.1 but with the expense of a motor or two. The stators just don't have it in them to go that far consistently. On a motor tester it shows great numbers revved up but on the track however it's just a mater of time. So when I was asked to run the R1 I was hesitant but throwing it on my little motor tester at only 30* of timing. RPM numbers were the same as killshot at 60*. I was impressed. Proof was on the track. It proved it and is still getting better with our timing reaching up to 40* and fdr at 4.0ish. It's like a 13.5 boosted.
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Old 06-17-2014, 09:33 AM   #432
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Originally Posted by John Wallace2 View Post
Many people on this thread , including myself, have said not to go beyond 55 to 60 degrees of timing on the Kill Shot motors. I was playing with my dyno this afternoon and now I'm not sure that is valid advise. First, I have two 21.5 RPM stator KSs, one with the 12.5mm RPM rotor and one with the 12.5mm turquoise Torque rotor. On both, I've tested the motors up to 70 degrees of timing before the amp draw starts to go crazy. Between 60 and 70 degrees the amp draw is very consistent with other 21.5 motors at much less timing, but the performance is very good. I'm going to take a few teeth off the pinion to account for the higher RPM, then make a few test runs and check the motor temps. I anticipate these will come off the track at about the same temps as other motors with the same amp draws. I'll let you know.
Why do you think we run them with 70* of timing...

I ran my new ones this weekend with 58* and they felt down on power...
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Old 06-17-2014, 09:46 AM   #433
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Originally Posted by Josh-n-ya View Post
Be careful. I also went this route with the 17.5 motors. I got very good results with cranking timing up to 65 or70 with fdr at 4.0 to 4.1 but with the expense of a motor or two. The stators just don't have it in them to go that far consistently. On a motor tester it shows great numbers revved up but on the track however it's just a mater of time. So when I was asked to run the R1 I was hesitant but throwing it on my little motor tester at only 30* of timing. RPM numbers were the same as killshot at 60*. I was impressed. Proof was on the track. It proved it and is still getting better with our timing reaching up to 40* and fdr at 4.0ish. It's like a 13.5 boosted.
I will BTW what version of the KS where you using (HT/HT)?
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Old 06-17-2014, 10:06 AM   #434
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I will BTW what version of the KS where you using (HT/HT)?
I tried both. Best results I ever had with a killshot was using the rpm stator with the 12.5 rpm rotor or the 12.5 broadband rotor with motor timing at 65*! I always raced on big tracks with 150ft straights. Small indoor tracks I would stick with the torque/torque.
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Old 06-17-2014, 10:47 AM   #435
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I ordered 3 motors from Fantom last week, a 21.5 and two 17.5's (one for a friend).

The 17.5 tested fine on the table and in the staging area of the track but when I got on the driver's stand to take off, it cogged and died. When I picked the car up, the motor was cold. The Tekin read 1-2-6-7 so I immediately thought my spare ESC was toast. Unsoldered the motor and ESC went back to normal. So... I grabbed the other 17.5 that was supposed to be for my friend and put it in. Fortunately, that one worked and I was able to run the main. 58* timing, geared at 3.7 came off around 105* after 5 minutes. Performance was okay but not nearly as fast as the stock Killshot and 70* geared at 3.93.

I have a call into Fantom to discuss what the issue might be.


If anyone knows where I can get some R1 motors stateside, please let me know.
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