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Old 02-06-2014, 08:08 AM   #946
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Thank you for that explanation!

So then the front spring preload doesn't really do anything? I say that since changing the proload doesn't change the spring rate... so would you even use that for tuning?
Preload is used for setting droop in this case. Too much preload can limit droop or remove it all together. The softer the front spring, the more preload you can use. With the stock front spring, there is a just a touch of preload on my car. What ends up as about .5 to .75 mm droop is what the weight of the car compresses the spring after setting preload with no weight on the springs.

Set some level of preload intially (kit setting).
Load the car, wheels and tires on, level surface.
Check the droop. There will either be space you can see on the king pin and/or a distance you can lift the nose before the tires leave the bench.
Measure ride height Vs. the point where the tires leave the surface and you will have the total droop.
If too much droop, increase preload and check droop again.
***Make sure both front tires are leaving the surface at the same time when you are happy with the setting. The old 1:12 scale guys used to put pennies on each tire, then lift dead center. If they didn't fall off at the same time, they adjusted again.
Now shim ride for ride height. Don't use the suspension to adjust ride height!
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Old 02-06-2014, 08:59 AM   #947
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Hi,
Could you let me know what shells fit please ie tamiya,
Thank you,
Mark
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Old 02-06-2014, 09:40 AM   #948
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Hi,
Could you let me know what shells fit please ie tamiya,
Thank you,
Mark
Any F1 body will fit....but of course, there are some trimming required for the side link area.
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Old 02-06-2014, 04:21 PM   #949
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Originally Posted by liljohn1064 View Post
Preload is used for setting droop in this case. Too much preload can limit droop or remove it all together. The softer the front spring, the more preload you can use. With the stock front spring, there is a just a touch of preload on my car. What ends up as about .5 to .75 mm droop is what the weight of the car compresses the spring after setting preload with no weight on the springs.

Set some level of preload intially (kit setting).
Load the car, wheels and tires on, level surface.
Check the droop. There will either be space you can see on the king pin and/or a distance you can lift the nose before the tires leave the bench.
Measure ride height Vs. the point where the tires leave the surface and you will have the total droop.
If too much droop, increase preload and check droop again.
***Make sure both front tires are leaving the surface at the same time when you are happy with the setting. The old 1:12 scale guys used to put pennies on each tire, then lift dead center. If they didn't fall off at the same time, they adjusted again.
Now shim ride for ride height. Don't use the suspension to adjust ride height!
understand all above except where do you shim for ride height.
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Old 02-06-2014, 07:50 PM   #950
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understand all above except where do you shim for ride height.
The plate the lower arms and steering rack mount to is shimmed away from the bottom chassis plate. With my droop set I have 4 mm of spacers on each of the 4 screws and ride height is right around 4.5 mm with F104 Shimizu 571 tires.
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Old 02-07-2014, 03:54 PM   #951
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Originally Posted by liljohn1064 View Post
The plate the lower arms and steering rack mount to is shimmed away from the bottom chassis plate. With my droop set I have 4 mm of spacers on each of the 4 screws and ride height is right around 4.5 mm with F104 Shimizu 571 tires.
That's how my ride height is set too.

And thank you for the above explanation. I understand how to properly set droop and tweak on TC cars, it's just F1 that's taking me for a new spin. But your explanation makes sense, so thanks!
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Old 02-08-2014, 03:52 AM   #952
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where can i find setup sheet from last ETS Rd for SP1? also interested in gearing used on ETS? thinking of buying SP1 roller...
also looking for web shops with parts...
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Old 02-09-2014, 03:03 PM   #953
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Well since I'm losing the only track within 2 hrs and the only onroad track in the state I'm selling my brand new SP-1

Speed passion SP-1 F1 Formula 1 ARTR Orca EAM Hobbywing
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Old 02-09-2014, 04:54 PM   #954
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The SP-1 behaved better last night, this was with 30K CRC grease in the side damper and 35 wt oil with a 3.0 Spec-R spring for the top shock. Still, though, the car does't maintain corner speed. It might be my driving, though, so next time I'm going to have to pressure one of our faster F1 guys to test drive it for me. I'm looking at you, Mark
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Old 02-09-2014, 10:28 PM   #955
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The SP-1 behaved better last night, this was with 30K CRC grease in the side damper and 35 wt oil with a 3.0 Spec-R spring for the top shock. Still, though, the car does't maintain corner speed. It might be my driving, though, so next time I'm going to have to pressure one of our faster F1 guys to test drive it for me. I'm looking at you, Mark
It seems like you center spring is way too hard. I am still working on my setup but talking to some factory SP drivers they recommend run softer rear spring..... something like 2.4-2.5 to get more rear grip. Soft tamiya front spring, hard side spring. Tried this setup with rubber on out door track. This setup should give you more rear traction for higher corner speed. If you find the rear a bit loose you can try softer side spring.
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Old 02-09-2014, 11:51 PM   #956
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It seems like you center spring is way too hard. I am still working on my setup but talking to some factory SP drivers they recommend run softer rear spring..... something like 2.4-2.5 to get more rear grip. Soft tamiya front spring, hard side spring. Tried this setup with rubber on out door track. This setup should give you more rear traction for higher corner speed. If you find the rear a bit loose you can try softer side spring.
I'm running on high grip carpet. I still have the stock front springs and silver Tamiya side springs. I started with a 2.5 top spring but the 3.0 felt better. I think. It's really hard for me to tell what this car is doing wrong, honestly. I definitely had understeer before, but it may be the case that the rear is coming loose now, I'll have to try to pay attention to that next time.
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Old 02-10-2014, 12:23 AM   #957
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Hey Adam,

How'd you like Nora? Give some details.

Steve
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Old 02-13-2014, 11:24 AM   #958
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what is the difference, setup wise, between the shims under the arms and under the plate?

I have seen setups with 4mm under the arms and 1mm under the plate and 3mm under arms and 2mm under plate. both are 5mm total but the shims are in a different place, maybe changing roll center??
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Old 02-13-2014, 12:48 PM   #959
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what is the difference, setup wise, between the shims under the arms and under the plate?

I have seen setups with 4mm under the arms and 1mm under the plate and 3mm under arms and 2mm under plate. both are 5mm total but the shims are in a different place, maybe changing roll center??
If you go under the plate, you don't have to shim the steering posts separately. If you go under the arms you will get more downward tilt toward the servo if you don't shim the steering posts. It would make the most sense to shim under the plate to get it close to ride height, then shim under the arm for small adjustments of 1 mm or less. I have mine under the arms and have shimmed my steering posts to get my turnbuckles more parallel. Either way, once you have it set, it will probably never change much for adjustment.
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Old 02-13-2014, 05:49 PM   #960
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If you go under the plate, you don't have to shim the steering posts separately. If you go under the arms you will get more downward tilt toward the servo if you don't shim the steering posts. It would make the most sense to shim under the plate to get it close to ride height, then shim under the arm for small adjustments of 1 mm or less. I have mine under the arms and have shimmed my steering posts to get my turnbuckles more parallel. Either way, once you have it set, it will probably never change much for adjustment.
How many shims are you running under the steering posts? I was looking at this the other night, trying to figure out a way to make the steering links flatter. Settled on flipping over the bell cranks, and putting 3mm under the posts, as well as running the drag link underneath the rack (so as to keep the longest servo horn length). Links did look a lot better this way, IMO.
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