The Politics of R/C Racing
03-29-2005, 08:16 PM
#241
I agree with what John is saying. There is merit in stock, just like there is merit in 125cc motocross racing, albeit not as much as 250cc, but there is still some, just like winning stock is nice, but its not the same as winning mod. I am not really that familar with motorcross and its adversiting, but I would have to assume that when James Stewart dominated, his sponsors probably made light of it to others.
Back to what I said before, as a stock driver, I love the idea of 19t, I am not upset that pro drivers are cherry picking, to me, that adds to the appeal of the class, it allows stock drivers to move up speed wise, as well as drive against the full mod guys on more equal terms (slower than mod, and also the motor tuning is more like tuning a stock motor than a mod motor); it helps smooth the gap.
As far as too many classes to race, ya there are, however I dont think that getting rid of stock is the nessisarily solution nor is getting rid of 19t or limiting either one, and espically having a seperate pro and amatuer 19t certanly, IMO at least is not. And limiting entries to only 2 classes would force drivers to stick to either stock, 19t or mod since most top stock guys run for both a 12th scale company as well as sedan company, and in stock its rarely the same company so you would be burning bridges picking one over the other... I dunno, maybe getting rid of stock or 19t would be the solution if you wanted to limit entries, however, if you look at most big races, there is plenty of time to run 3 classes, I know at the nats I had plenty of time to work on my stuff, making all three mains does present issues (as I am sure Smkya is aware of, lol) but I would prefer to work a little harder a few times a year for big races than be limited from doing it.
Back to what I said before, as a stock driver, I love the idea of 19t, I am not upset that pro drivers are cherry picking, to me, that adds to the appeal of the class, it allows stock drivers to move up speed wise, as well as drive against the full mod guys on more equal terms (slower than mod, and also the motor tuning is more like tuning a stock motor than a mod motor); it helps smooth the gap.
As far as too many classes to race, ya there are, however I dont think that getting rid of stock is the nessisarily solution nor is getting rid of 19t or limiting either one, and espically having a seperate pro and amatuer 19t certanly, IMO at least is not. And limiting entries to only 2 classes would force drivers to stick to either stock, 19t or mod since most top stock guys run for both a 12th scale company as well as sedan company, and in stock its rarely the same company so you would be burning bridges picking one over the other... I dunno, maybe getting rid of stock or 19t would be the solution if you wanted to limit entries, however, if you look at most big races, there is plenty of time to run 3 classes, I know at the nats I had plenty of time to work on my stuff, making all three mains does present issues (as I am sure Smkya is aware of, lol) but I would prefer to work a little harder a few times a year for big races than be limited from doing it.
03-29-2005, 10:01 PM
#242
so what happen to RC nation which tried to go up againts roar and norrca with a national scoring system for local races. starting from scratch now is going to be a uphill battle. even Arcor is having trouble keeping tracks. so if you start something it's going to have to have more appeal then what's been going on lately. I even thought I heard that the RC Pro series is going nitro onroad? this should be an intersting year for RC
03-29-2005, 11:26 PM
#243
RC Nation was a questionable idea that was poorly executed. In the right hands it might have gone somewhere...
03-30-2005, 12:15 AM
#244
Tech Regular
Without someone dedicating all of their time, money, and effort into something like what Shane said, (which I feel is a great a idea), it will never happen. I'm not saying it can't, but someone would need to step up to the plate and take on a huge challenge.
Until then, our current organization needs to put a little of their time, effort and money into a proven deal, otherwise it will cease to exist. Its such simple things that ROAR is missing the boat on, but many simple things together turn into a big problem. Why is it so hard to have a freakin ROAR official set of tech equipment. If a different track can do it every year, why can't ROAR just do it once. ROAR needs to organize the events better and actually have a little bit of say into its preparations. In NASCAR its not the tracks responsibility to have all the templates, scales, and equipment to inspect the race cars. The track doesnt set the schedule or anything. The tracks responsibility is to get sponsors for the event, take care of vicotory lane and all of the race ceremonies. Any aspect of the actual racing is handled by NASCAR themselves. We're paying ROAR fees every year and all we get is a sticker, a rule book and a bad newsletter every 2 months. That just doesnt make sense to me. For a national event it should be ROAR's show, basically taking over the track for the week. If it was the same people running every National event we wouldnt have near as many problems as we do now. Most tracks arent used to handling 250 entries and when it comes time for the race something always goes wrong. ROAR should have a crew of people that puts every race on. Same announcer, same official, same tech person. It would really only take a 3 person crew to run the race. Let the track take care of advertising, sponsors, trophies, trophy presentations. Sure, they tracks may want to run the show, but tough luck. A National event is prestigous and should be run that way. If the Snowbirds crew ran a national event it would be the smoothest national ever because they have done big races before. They know what to expect and how to handle a major event.
If ROAR put a noticeable effort into any of this we wouldn't have a problem. Nationals arent getting any better, they're getting worse, fast. Its going to take some serious work by ROAR to turn their program around.
Oh, and I think TJ has the best idea yet. Being able to only run 1 class per car would be the best thing ever because it would automatically make each class a stepping stone and thats what we need. That rule, plus something about only being able to make a main in stock twice, then being forced into 19turn. I dont know, it could go so many ways but I think TJ is definetly has the right idea going.
Until then, our current organization needs to put a little of their time, effort and money into a proven deal, otherwise it will cease to exist. Its such simple things that ROAR is missing the boat on, but many simple things together turn into a big problem. Why is it so hard to have a freakin ROAR official set of tech equipment. If a different track can do it every year, why can't ROAR just do it once. ROAR needs to organize the events better and actually have a little bit of say into its preparations. In NASCAR its not the tracks responsibility to have all the templates, scales, and equipment to inspect the race cars. The track doesnt set the schedule or anything. The tracks responsibility is to get sponsors for the event, take care of vicotory lane and all of the race ceremonies. Any aspect of the actual racing is handled by NASCAR themselves. We're paying ROAR fees every year and all we get is a sticker, a rule book and a bad newsletter every 2 months. That just doesnt make sense to me. For a national event it should be ROAR's show, basically taking over the track for the week. If it was the same people running every National event we wouldnt have near as many problems as we do now. Most tracks arent used to handling 250 entries and when it comes time for the race something always goes wrong. ROAR should have a crew of people that puts every race on. Same announcer, same official, same tech person. It would really only take a 3 person crew to run the race. Let the track take care of advertising, sponsors, trophies, trophy presentations. Sure, they tracks may want to run the show, but tough luck. A National event is prestigous and should be run that way. If the Snowbirds crew ran a national event it would be the smoothest national ever because they have done big races before. They know what to expect and how to handle a major event.
If ROAR put a noticeable effort into any of this we wouldn't have a problem. Nationals arent getting any better, they're getting worse, fast. Its going to take some serious work by ROAR to turn their program around.
Oh, and I think TJ has the best idea yet. Being able to only run 1 class per car would be the best thing ever because it would automatically make each class a stepping stone and thats what we need. That rule, plus something about only being able to make a main in stock twice, then being forced into 19turn. I dont know, it could go so many ways but I think TJ is definetly has the right idea going.
Last edited by Bobby Flack; 03-30-2005 at 12:23 AM.
03-30-2005, 09:34 AM
#245
and I agree with Bobby....
oh my... I said that out loud?? LOL
oh my... I said that out loud?? LOL
03-30-2005, 09:57 AM
#246
Tech Fanatic
iTrader: (4)
Yes Dawn you did.... 
To everyone that has any constructive suggestions, posting on here is great, BUT the whole of ROAR (except some extremely dedicates peoples) do not read these forumns (although they probably should.... Send e-mails to Roar, CC everyone...
http://www.roarracing.com/structure/excom.htm
http://www.roarracing.com/structure/director.htm
http://www.roarracing.com/regions/index.htm
These are the people that should have overflowing e-mail in boxes and need to know what is going on...
To everyone that has any constructive suggestions, posting on here is great, BUT the whole of ROAR (except some extremely dedicates peoples) do not read these forumns (although they probably should.... Send e-mails to Roar, CC everyone...
http://www.roarracing.com/structure/excom.htm
http://www.roarracing.com/structure/director.htm
http://www.roarracing.com/regions/index.htm
These are the people that should have overflowing e-mail in boxes and need to know what is going on...
03-30-2005, 10:21 AM
#247
Tech Regular
I cant believe my eyes, Dawn agreed.
This just in... Satans wearing ice skates because apparently hell froze over.
I forwarded my post to every e-mail address on the list. We'll see if I get any replies....
This just in... Satans wearing ice skates because apparently hell froze over.
I forwarded my post to every e-mail address on the list. We'll see if I get any replies....
03-30-2005, 10:52 AM
#248
brrrrr..... chilly in here..... LOL
In all seriousness, yes, membership need to begin stating their questions and ideas to the Excomm members. I'm one of those die hard officials who reads everything...absorb everything... and I bring up, of course for promotional and communication reasons, every single idea that strikes a nerve!!
got your email, Bobby!! And, thank you!!!!!!
In all seriousness, yes, membership need to begin stating their questions and ideas to the Excomm members. I'm one of those die hard officials who reads everything...absorb everything... and I bring up, of course for promotional and communication reasons, every single idea that strikes a nerve!!
got your email, Bobby!! And, thank you!!!!!!
03-30-2005, 11:00 AM
#249
This again shows the major issue with ROAR. They are reactive and not proactive. They don't go out and seek problems to find solutions for, you must first direct the problem to them.
If ROAR were my business, and there were threads involving complaints and also solutions, you bettter believe my eyes and ears would be open and I would be involved in the dialogue to help make things better. I would not have my PR director (this is in no way an attack on Dawn, she puts more into ROAR than anyone ive seen) telling people that they should instead direct things to me, I would be right there in the trenches letting people know whats going on.
If ROAR were my business, and there were threads involving complaints and also solutions, you bettter believe my eyes and ears would be open and I would be involved in the dialogue to help make things better. I would not have my PR director (this is in no way an attack on Dawn, she puts more into ROAR than anyone ive seen) telling people that they should instead direct things to me, I would be right there in the trenches letting people know whats going on.
03-30-2005, 11:02 AM
#250
wow.. and I thought we had such a great PROactive conversation beginning....
ok, Jack.... don't you think proactive and reactive is a little subjective? I mean, you don't know there is a problem until the problem arises and then you react to correct the problem... am I correct?
(having fun here, Jack and I banter quite often!)
ok, Jack.... don't you think proactive and reactive is a little subjective? I mean, you don't know there is a problem until the problem arises and then you react to correct the problem... am I correct?
(having fun here, Jack and I banter quite often!)
03-30-2005, 11:36 AM
#251
Roar needs to be proactive in resolving the proactive/reactive issues. But actually its no longer a proactive item since Roar will need to be reactive to the proactive/reactive issues that should have been proactively avoided now that they have been actively addressed by the proactive racers.
03-30-2005, 11:43 AM
#253
I see my sense of humor wasn't wasted....
Yes Keith - you are absolutely correct, sir. (in a Monty Python voice)
Yes Keith - you are absolutely correct, sir. (in a Monty Python voice)
03-30-2005, 11:53 AM
#254
Dawn, I realize that this may be water under the bridge now, BUT here goes: I left a phone message with a top ROAR official months ago as well as sending an e-mail regarding Hobby Chamber's troubles (10-27-04 to be exact). Below is a copy of the e-mail:
[Name withheld], you'll want to look into HC [Hobby Chamber]. A few guys and I were there this past weekend for the RC Driver race. I ended up TQ and winning the event and enjoyed the track (it's nice and big), but had some reservations that I thought you should know about:
1) The driver's stand is *ultra high*--you end up looking over the track and craning your neck to drive. Also, your antenna cannot be fully up as it hits the rafters and pipes in the ceiling.
2) The driver's stand is right on the track. Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought ROAR rules state there needs to be some distance between the track and the stand. What happens is guys have to lean forward making driving way more difficult?
3) Heat--the owner, George has a terrible reputation for not turning on the heat. He didn't do it for this race giving excuses (as I'm told he always does). It was as cold in the building as outside: 56 degrees.
4) Pit space--there simply is not enough pit space for hundreds of guys.
You're going to hear about these complaints before the race, so I figured you'd want to hear about it sooner than later. Let me know if you have any other questions. If you'd like I can take a trip up there and take some more pics of the track. (It's a two hour hike, so it would probably have to wait until I'm racing there next.) [end of message]
I checked through my Inbox and cannot find nor do I remember receiving a reply to this e-mail. It seems that two of the four suggestions were worked on, but #3 (which pertains to the person in charge) was never addressed and neither was my phone message to the official regarding potential problems with the owner. I even confided in several members of my team something to the effect of: "Watch. There's going to be problems. I let ROAR know and still nothing's going to be done."
[Name withheld], you'll want to look into HC [Hobby Chamber]. A few guys and I were there this past weekend for the RC Driver race. I ended up TQ and winning the event and enjoyed the track (it's nice and big), but had some reservations that I thought you should know about:
1) The driver's stand is *ultra high*--you end up looking over the track and craning your neck to drive. Also, your antenna cannot be fully up as it hits the rafters and pipes in the ceiling.
2) The driver's stand is right on the track. Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought ROAR rules state there needs to be some distance between the track and the stand. What happens is guys have to lean forward making driving way more difficult?
3) Heat--the owner, George has a terrible reputation for not turning on the heat. He didn't do it for this race giving excuses (as I'm told he always does). It was as cold in the building as outside: 56 degrees.
4) Pit space--there simply is not enough pit space for hundreds of guys.
You're going to hear about these complaints before the race, so I figured you'd want to hear about it sooner than later. Let me know if you have any other questions. If you'd like I can take a trip up there and take some more pics of the track. (It's a two hour hike, so it would probably have to wait until I'm racing there next.) [end of message]
I checked through my Inbox and cannot find nor do I remember receiving a reply to this e-mail. It seems that two of the four suggestions were worked on, but #3 (which pertains to the person in charge) was never addressed and neither was my phone message to the official regarding potential problems with the owner. I even confided in several members of my team something to the effect of: "Watch. There's going to be problems. I let ROAR know and still nothing's going to be done."
03-30-2005, 12:01 PM
#255
Yes, its water under the bridge now and unfortunately nothing can be done but treat the black eye ROAR has sustained and use this as a learning tool to make some serious changes.
BTW - did I receive that email? I don't recall and I just scanned my inbox, sent box, draft box and deleted box and don't see it. Doesn't matter.. just curious.
BTW - did I receive that email? I don't recall and I just scanned my inbox, sent box, draft box and deleted box and don't see it. Doesn't matter.. just curious.