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Old 06-04-2014, 05:02 PM   #5566
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So how do you know if your belts are tight enough, and if the front is tighter? Right now I have my set by feel, they work well (no slip or excessive binding), but I always wonder if a "pro" would run either one tighter or looser. Is there a good, reproducable method to set the tension?
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Old 06-04-2014, 05:08 PM   #5567
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So how do you know if your belts are tight enough, and if the front is tighter? Right now I have my set by feel, they work well (no slip or excessive binding), but I always wonder if a "pro" would run either one tighter or looser. Is there a good, reproducable method to set the tension?
Not that I know of, it's mostly just feel. I just assume the front belt is shorter and do my best to approximate a tighter feel than the rear. The rear belt, under modest pressure, (no stretching) should give around 3-5mm pushing on the center of the belt.
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Old 06-22-2014, 06:00 AM   #5568
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Questions??

hi guys, I would like advice from any set up genius' out there if possible. I run my xray t4 13 on a large outdoor asphalt track, i race in an unusual class run at my local club called 1/10 outlaw, effectively mod tc but with no limit on body or tyres, so we all run foam tyres of varying widths and lola bodies mostly titan blitz 200mm or 235mm and the cars are extremely quick with loads of traction. The setup i race with is rather unusual to the point some people are shocked that it works but it does and works well, it has plenty of rear traction AND turns well, i pretty consistently finish in second place and am tiring of not being able to regularly challenge the fastest driver, he is a little more consistent then me ( not a lot in it ) and my car turns into corners and gets out of corners just as well, but i am losing out in mid corner rotation, if i can find more mid corner rotation ( turn ) i think i can turn the tables ( HOPE ) so if anyone knows what i can do to help in this area i will be forever grateful. Before i post my setup don't laugh or scoff cause it works well , I just want to see if it can work better,
* Height is variable (foam tyres ) but try to keep rear 6mm front 5.5mm
* Droop variable (foams) but as a general rule as much droop in the back as i get set and virtually no droop in the front
* 45mm wide foams at the rear 37 to 40m shore
* 26mm wide foams at the front 35 shore
* 2.2 springs at the rear 2.7 springs at the front
* 4.0 toe in at rear 1.0 toe out at front
* 3.0 camber at rear 2.5 at front
* gear diff at front 700 weight oil
* spool at the back ( this is not a misprint )
* suspension arms ( graphite ) angled down towards middle of car front and back. middle setting outer, lower setting towards middle \ /
* improvised VDS system ( effectively rear of lola body remains flat )
* 235mm titan blitz body
* 3 hole shock inserts 400 weight oil
* track temp avg 25 to 30 degrees celsius
* 50 mm drive shafts upfront ecs
* 52 mm drive shafts at rear

without getting into which shim is where this should give you guys a good general idea as to whether i can be helped or if there is no helping me ( plenty may agree with the latter )
once again i stress this setup works well , it is the product of a lot of research and development, but if anyone can help me to find a little more mid corner rotation , i will be forever grateful
cheers
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Old 06-22-2014, 07:12 AM   #5569
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Originally Posted by oldenuff View Post
hi guys, I would like advice from any set up genius' out there if possible. I run my xray t4 13 on a large outdoor asphalt track, i race in an unusual class run at my local club called 1/10 outlaw, effectively mod tc but with no limit on body or tyres, so we all run foam tyres of varying widths and lola bodies mostly titan blitz 200mm or 235mm and the cars are extremely quick with loads of traction. The setup i race with is rather unusual to the point some people are shocked that it works but it does and works well, it has plenty of rear traction AND turns well, i pretty consistently finish in second place and am tiring of not being able to regularly challenge the fastest driver, he is a little more consistent then me ( not a lot in it ) and my car turns into corners and gets out of corners just as well, but i am losing out in mid corner rotation, if i can find more mid corner rotation ( turn ) i think i can turn the tables ( HOPE ) so if anyone knows what i can do to help in this area i will be forever grateful. Before i post my setup don't laugh or scoff cause it works well , I just want to see if it can work better,
* Height is variable (foam tyres ) but try to keep rear 6mm front 5.5mm
* Droop variable (foams) but as a general rule as much droop in the back as i get set and virtually no droop in the front
* 45mm wide foams at the rear 37 to 40m shore
* 26mm wide foams at the front 35 shore
* 2.2 springs at the rear 2.7 springs at the front
* 4.0 toe in at rear 1.0 toe out at front
* 3.0 camber at rear 2.5 at front
* gear diff at front 700 weight oil
* spool at the back ( this is not a misprint )
* suspension arms ( graphite ) angled down towards middle of car front and back. middle setting outer, lower setting towards middle \ /
* improvised VDS system ( effectively rear of lola body remains flat )
* 235mm titan blitz body
* 3 hole shock inserts 400 weight oil
* track temp avg 25 to 30 degrees celsius
* 50 mm drive shafts upfront ecs
* 52 mm drive shafts at rear

without getting into which shim is where this should give you guys a good general idea as to whether i can be helped or if there is no helping me ( plenty may agree with the latter )
once again i stress this setup works well , it is the product of a lot of research and development, but if anyone can help me to find a little more mid corner rotation , i will be forever grateful
cheers
oldenuff


That is certainly different! Especially in terms of the rear spool. You might be able to try a rear diff with very thick oil such as 2.5M. This is a usual change in the front of the car to gain more steering/corner rotation you don't have with a spool. My thinking being a lighter oil in the rear would give more grip, and possibly more rotation. I am thinking you run the spool because of the large grip the foams generate, but with the diff action it should help it rotate a little better.

Now just speculating, you could also look into your driving style and try to not use brakes much at all and focus on taking lines to gain better corner speed.
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Old 06-23-2014, 03:07 AM   #5570
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thanks for the response mscumi101, i initially put a front diff in to give me more turn in and it did help steering, then i decreased oil till i got down to 60000 then i tried something drastic in swapping diffs so it then became 60000 rear and 700 front, turning kept getting better and i found on cold days track temp 10 to 15 degrees celsius this worked the best , but for warmer temps it still pushed a little, at around this time i was watching a lot of 1/8 pan cars fly around the track and i had the bright idea of trying to replicate this in my t4, so i threw the spool out the back and a one way into the front and tested, the result was a car that turned brilliantly off power but under steered everywhere on throttle , next up was gear diff out the back and one way up front which worked well but pushed a little ( the reason i could experiment with the one way is of the 12 turns on our track i was only braking at 2 turns, one being at the end of the straight the other being the hairpin so i taught myself to use no brake at all when i had the spool up the front, i have now reverted to braking twice only with my current setup ) finally i tried the the spool in the back with the gear diff up front , firstly with harder oil then gradually softer, at one point i was changing diffs to account for track temp increases thru out the day ( lighter oil up front when temps rose ) till i settled on my current setup, this is how i got to this point and the car is as good as i have ever had it.
But like all racers there is always room for more ( i hope ) i am not keen to try your recommendation ( after all the chopping and changing )but i will consider it and probably try it at some point, but what i was really looking for is some other secret tweak ( if possible )
thanx again for the advice and keep it coming if you have more.
cheers
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Old 06-23-2014, 05:25 AM   #5571
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Originally Posted by oldenuff View Post
hi guys, I would like advice from any set up genius' out there if possible. I run my xray t4 13 on a large outdoor asphalt track, i race in an unusual class run at my local club called 1/10 outlaw, effectively mod tc but with no limit on body or tyres, so we all run foam tyres of varying widths and lola bodies mostly titan blitz 200mm or 235mm and the cars are extremely quick with loads of traction.
cheers
oldenuff
Well that sounds like wicked fun, fair play to you guys for doing something totally off the wall! I like the sound of all that downforce and grip. Do you space the car out to get it closer to the shell width, or are the wheels offset to do that?

You could take off some rear camber, that will give a bit more rotation without harming traction (should actually help straight-line traction).

You could also try going stiffer all round on the springs or roll-bars, if the grip is really good this should help corner speed. Same on chassis flex, if you can stiffen it up with braces or solid blocks it should help corner speed.

Any videos of these beasts in action?
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Old 06-23-2014, 06:15 AM   #5572
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thanks daleburr, for the encouragement, i can assure it is wicked fun, the traction we have enables us to hold full throttle through corners we could of only dreamed of with tc bodies, we cant quite run the same top speeds as mod tc because of the heat generated through all this traction but full throttle sweepers at over 80kmh with no under steer are awesome, i also love being able to bury the throttle before entering some of the corners. Unfortunately we have no video of race footage but i can assure such a class does exist in Australia through our club Greater Western Sydney Remote Control Car Club and while there are only 5 or 6 of us at the moment , more people are showing interest and we hope to gain more racers. thanks for the info, i will definitely try less rear camber, the theory behind it sounds good, i am intrigued by your advice to stiffen up the car, the reason i say this is my competitor who is faster then me has a Serpent 747-e which is running stock setup 200mm lola body and nitro tourer foam tyres ( 30mm rear , 26mm front ) with gear diffs front and back if your not familiar with the car and all he done was soften up his springs,... nevertheless i do have stiffer springs that are worth trying so will give it a go. by the way the body is too wide for the wheels, the rear tyres are offset so are close to 220mm but the front wheels i currently run have no offset and are well inside the body to the point if i don't want to cut out the wheel arches i dont have too ( tempting but yet to try it ! ), i use to run xceed 32mm offset front foams 37shore but found my current front tyres being no offset ULTI 26mm 35 shore have more grip and turn in better ( also cheaper ).
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Old 06-23-2014, 09:48 AM   #5573
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thanks for the response mscumi101, i initially put a front diff in to give me more turn in and it did help steering, then i decreased oil till i got down to 60000 then i tried something drastic in swapping diffs so it then became 60000 rear and 700 front, turning kept getting better and i found on cold days track temp 10 to 15 degrees celsius this worked the best , but for warmer temps it still pushed a little, at around this time i was watching a lot of 1/8 pan cars fly around the track and i had the bright idea of trying to replicate this in my t4, so i threw the spool out the back and a one way into the front and tested, the result was a car that turned brilliantly off power but under steered everywhere on throttle , next up was gear diff out the back and one way up front which worked well but pushed a little ( the reason i could experiment with the one way is of the 12 turns on our track i was only braking at 2 turns, one being at the end of the straight the other being the hairpin so i taught myself to use no brake at all when i had the spool up the front, i have now reverted to braking twice only with my current setup ) finally i tried the the spool in the back with the gear diff up front , firstly with harder oil then gradually softer, at one point i was changing diffs to account for track temp increases thru out the day ( lighter oil up front when temps rose ) till i settled on my current setup, this is how i got to this point and the car is as good as i have ever had it.
But like all racers there is always room for more ( i hope ) i am not keen to try your recommendation ( after all the chopping and changing )but i will consider it and probably try it at some point, but what i was really looking for is some other secret tweak ( if possible )
thanx again for the advice and keep it coming if you have more.
cheers
oldenuff
So, did you try a very stiff gear diff in the back? Keep the setup you have now, but swap in a gear diff for the spool in the back using 2.5 million diff oil. Something that heavy is basically a spool under low to moderate throttle, but under heavy (mod) throttle and in corners it'll give just a little bit more rotation than a spool. Would be worth a try.
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Old 06-24-2014, 02:05 AM   #5574
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hi guys, hmmm that's now the second recommendation to try 2.5m at the rear.... looks like i have to try it now! i have tried 300000 in the back , problem is track temp, were in the middle of a cold snap and if it stays this cold in Sydney ill be trying lighter oil diff, maybe 100000, if it returns to recent temps ( not to cold ) a thick rear diff may be in order, time to go to the hobby shop and get some thick oil, thanks guys for your support.
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Old 07-06-2014, 06:49 AM   #5575
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hi guys, thank you guys for all your suggestions and after a bit of thought and then testing i tried 500,000 rear diff and reduced rear toe to 2degrees, the result was a car with not enough rear traction?!?!, the track temp was pretty low so taking this into account i through a softer shore rear tyre on and bingo!
all of a sudden the car was handling great again with i suspect more rotation!, i haven't timed the car yet ( or tested against the main competition ) but i raced it against another competitor who has been known to occasionally send out a real challenge but i accounted for him so i guess we have to see how we go on race day this weekend!
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Old 07-06-2014, 10:01 PM   #5576
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hi guys, thank you guys for all your suggestions and after a bit of thought and then testing i tried 500,000 rear diff and reduced rear toe to 2degrees, the result was a car with not enough rear traction?!?!, the track temp was pretty low so taking this into account i through a softer shore rear tyre on and bingo!
all of a sudden the car was handling great again with i suspect more rotation!, i haven't timed the car yet ( or tested against the main competition ) but i raced it against another competitor who has been known to occasionally send out a real challenge but i accounted for him so i guess we have to see how we go on race day this weekend!
cheers
oldenuff
Sounds promising! 500K is a lot softer than a spool, which is why the 2.5M was being recommended. You could still try 1M and maybe that would be a sweet spot? Either way, I'm curious to hear how it turns out. Your class/setup are something I've never seen or heard of before
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Old 07-07-2014, 03:49 AM   #5577
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hi guys, metalnut i actually went to the LHS with the intention of buying 1M but it was out of stock so i bought the 500k, but i will be getting me some 1M to try soon. Our class is only young and small with a few dedicated souls who compete fiercely but in good spirit, my setup is a bit more radical then the others, it sort of just happened this way as explained in an earlier post to the point my car is pretty unique, and i love being different. i will post again soon but would like to add how great a platform the xray t4 is, light, strong & fast, i wont race anything else... Until a t5 comes out anyway
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Old 07-15-2014, 07:30 AM   #5578
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hi guys, just an update for my outlaw t4, raced the car on the weekend and finished third in class, but besides this all went well, i had a luckless run with an accident and a bump from other cars going against me but along with a few esc setting changes , slightly longer gearing and 500k rear diff the car was quicker, i managed a personel best lap time and overall time and was able to consistently crack 20 sec range laps where as before i averaged low 21 sec with occasional high 20's ,problem was though my nemesis managed to average low 20's!,
I love this class!
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Old 07-16-2014, 08:00 AM   #5579
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Is it only me who thinks £5 for xr305392 (pin) is a bit excessive, only 2 in a pack?
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Old 07-16-2014, 10:16 AM   #5580
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Is it only me who thinks £5 for xr305392 (pin) is a bit excessive, only 2 in a pack?
Well, yeah, but all Xray parts are priced at a premium. Check out RCMart, I've gotten a lot of Xray spare parts from them for much better prices.
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