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Old 08-05-2013, 10:59 AM   #4546
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Originally Posted by TWILL View Post
I'm using button head screws, but I have used them in the past and end up having to Dremel them out of the car. ( CAN"T GET THEM TIGHT ENOUGH)
How much end play do you have in the motor? If it is a lot then the rotor will be allowed to move enough for the pinion to touch both the battery and button head screws. I'm keep my end play (shim the end plate side of the rotor) to a very small amount of end play. I do have marks (very VERY small mark in the battery case, but I 100% do not want the pinion to touch the motor screws. I have never had a problem with the motor sliding, unless in a hard hit. Make sure you are using a long enough screw to mount the motor. I have seen issues when a person only gets contact with a few threads in the end plate. Make sure that the motor screw is long enough to use 100% of the threads in the end plate, but not to long to touch the inside of the motor, I'm using 3 x 6 screws Button Head). If you still have issues, lightly coat the screws with BLUE loctite, let it dry out side of the motor, coat until you have a solid fit...Or a drop of blue loctite on the screws, and mount.. not too much....
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Old 08-05-2013, 11:06 AM   #4547
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I'm using button head screws, but I have used them in the past and end up having to Dremel them out of the car. ( CAN"T GET THEM TIGHT ENOUGH)
You should be able to get almost any screw more than tight enough to hold the motor.
Check that the screws you're using aren't going too far into the can and jamming against the stator.

Also check the motor isn't up against the layshaft mount or the top deck.

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Old 08-05-2013, 11:13 AM   #4548
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ok ,started the race day with a car that was sweet to drive,after 1 round quali im 7th,so the rest of the day im trying to go faster,but this is where it all went wrong,the rear became very loose as the temps came up,i took the 1mm inner link shim off and although a little better its still loose,tried a 1.3 rear bar,still no good,went from 2.7 to 2.6 helped alot (i posted a faster time)but 3/4 mins in the same again,i tried standing them up,laying them down but just couldnt get the rear to grip,was i overheating the tyres? im not sure as i ran a set cold and it was still loose and didnt get better as they warmed,so what should be done and why,thanks

http://forum.teamxray.com/xform/inde...D=484&setup=t4
Where is it loose? Inn or out off the corner?
Front downstop to 6. rear spring 2,3-2,6 is something I would have tried..
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Old 08-05-2013, 11:41 AM   #4549
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Originally Posted by Nathan Wilson View Post
Cristian, why do you think these relatively simple changes have given alot of steering? All down to chassis flex?
The chassis flex is very similar, so the only thing I can think of is the orientation of the split blocks, these should allow slightly more flex.

However, our prototype has a few different items on it as well, including:
-slightly longer steering arms (0.5mm longer). These do 2 things, they increase the steering speed and provide more steering lock than even our increased steering spacers.
-Spec R Top Deck and Center Post Mount: When used with a captured layshaft and no screws on the layshaft bulkhead the car has more flex around the motor mount, which to me makes the car get better forward bite and quicker entry steering. It also makes the car more reactive.

Personally the gains from the Suspension Mounts I have noticed is a more consistent car that even after hard impacts does not allow the arms to get loose. With the balls on the hinge pin, there is definitely less suspension stiction as well. The car seems to generate more traction over my other car with traditional mounts.

The narrower chassis build allows the car to roll a little deeper in the corner without hitting abruptly which I tend to think translates into better side to side transition and more middle of the corner steering.

I have learned a lot about chassis shapes developing different ones over the past 2 years. One thing is no matter how narrow your car is, the chassis will hit the track. Therefore, the narrower it is, the more the car will roll. More roll usually translates into more middle corner steering up until a point that it is too much and it can make the car lazy. While we could have made the chassis narrower, we have observed that 85mm is about the width that you want your chassis to have.

The last thing I want to elaborate on is the layshaft holders. Ours will be able to be keyed onto the chassis. When you don't use the upper screws on the layshaft, these will get cocked sideways with higher power motors, the keyed layshaft holder will make the car freer as the holders will not move.
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Old 08-05-2013, 12:35 PM   #4550
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Originally Posted by heretic View Post
Could someone tell me how much exactly a box stock T4 weighs ?

I mean, car complete except for body, electronics, and tyres.

( But WITH wheelnuts and bodyclips ;-)

Thanks !
I've got a car showing up this week sometime. As soon as I get it build I can weigh it for you.
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Old 08-05-2013, 12:39 PM   #4551
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Originally Posted by CristianTabush View Post
I have learned a lot about chassis shapes developing different ones over the past 2 years. One thing is no matter how narrow your car is, the chassis will hit the track. Therefore, the narrower it is, the more the car will roll. More roll usually translates into more middle corner steering up until a point that it is too much and it can make the car lazy. While we could have made the chassis narrower, we have observed that 85mm is about the width that you want your chassis to have.
Hi

Are you using pre preg with 0-90 deg orientation or 0-45-90 layup for chassis?

What did you prefer?

I have made quite a few myself but have not come to any definite conclusions. Obviously most sheet is supplied 0-90

Cheers
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Old 08-05-2013, 01:19 PM   #4552
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Originally Posted by chasingthepack View Post
ok ,started the race day with a car that was sweet to drive,after 1 round quali im 7th,so the rest of the day im trying to go faster,but this is where it all went wrong,the rear became very loose as the temps came up,i took the 1mm inner link shim off and although a little better its still loose,tried a 1.3 rear bar,still no good,went from 2.7 to 2.6 helped alot (i posted a faster time)but 3/4 mins in the same again,i tried standing them up,laying them down but just couldnt get the rear to grip,was i overheating the tyres? im not sure as i ran a set cold and it was still loose and didnt get better as they warmed,so what should be done and why,thanks

http://forum.teamxray.com/xform/inde...D=484&setup=t4
i should have added this is on corner entry to mid
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Old 08-05-2013, 01:20 PM   #4553
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Where is it loose? Inn or out off the corner?
Front downstop to 6. rear spring 2,3-2,6 is something I would have tried..
hi,its sliding out on corner entry,i dismissed the 2.3/2.6 as i had no luck with them before
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Old 08-05-2013, 02:14 PM   #4554
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Originally Posted by chasingthepack View Post
hi,its sliding out on corner entry,i dismissed the 2.3/2.6 as i had no luck with them before
I would probably go up in camber in the rear and/or reduce the front. 1.5 front and 2.0 rear should help.
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Old 08-05-2013, 02:32 PM   #4555
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Originally Posted by hana166 View Post
Hi

Are you using pre preg with 0-90 deg orientation or 0-45-90 layup for chassis?

What did you prefer?

I have made quite a few myself but have not come to any definite conclusions. Obviously most sheet is supplied 0-90

Cheers
We have tried both. They have their advantages, but nothing too noticeable. Typically the 0-45-90 stays more firm over a longer period of time, where the 0-90 de-laminates more quickly and provides more flex. The 0-90 always needs a "break-in" Period to get the full flex. The 0-45-90 does not change much.
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Old 08-05-2013, 03:26 PM   #4556
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Originally Posted by CristianTabush View Post
We have tried both. They have their advantages, but nothing too noticeable. Typically the 0-45-90 stays more firm over a longer period of time, where the 0-90 de-laminates more quickly and provides more flex. The 0-90 always needs a "break-in" Period to get the full flex. The 0-45-90 does not change much.
Thanks for your reply.. Its proving to be a bit of a black art looking for a combination of bottom and top deck for good handling !
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Old 08-05-2013, 05:08 PM   #4557
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Originally Posted by Odin544 View Post
I've got a car showing up this week sometime. As soon as I get it build I can weigh it for you.
Exactly what I was hoping for. Thanks !
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Old 08-05-2013, 06:43 PM   #4558
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Default weight

I have a built car (no electrics) at home I will weigh.

give me a day or so.
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Old 08-05-2013, 09:34 PM   #4559
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just checked car at home.

508 gms it has graphite arms, ecs, alum steering arms (30 2526 COMPOSITE DUAL SERVO SAVER ARM) and low friction belts. none of which would make a huge difference from stock weight wise.

it's a lot lighter than i thought it would be.
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Old 08-06-2013, 02:39 AM   #4560
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Originally Posted by chasingthepack View Post
i should have added this is on corner entry to mid
Hey Richard,

I'm guessing this was at west London?
The track is so bumpy so we are all running more droop to stop this happening. .5mm is all that is needed

Cheers,
Jay
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