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Old 10-08-2012, 06:25 AM   #436
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Default T4 Questions......

Hi, just a few questions about the T4 compared to the T3 12........

+ Appart from being lower are the the shock positions on the tower the same as the T3 12?

+ Are the body posts all in the same position as the T3 12 so that current bodyshells can be used?

+ The T4 specs say that the roll center clamps are 2mm lower. Does that mean you need to run an additional 2mm shim on the clamps to get the same roll center position as on the T3 12?
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Old 10-08-2012, 06:29 AM   #437
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XRAY T4 already in and ready to send out

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Old 10-08-2012, 06:42 AM   #438
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Originally Posted by Matt W View Post
Hi, just a few questions about the T4 compared to the T3 12........

+ Appart from being lower are the the shock positions on the tower the same as the T3 12?

+ Are the body posts all in the same position as the T3 12 so that current bodyshells can be used?

+ The T4 specs say that the roll center clamps are 2mm lower. Does that mean you need to run an additional 2mm shim on the clamps to get the same roll center position as on the T3 12?

1) No, new tower have less holes so positions are not comparable. Standard Setup, both carpet and asphalt, start from second hole.

2) Rear body post are different, they are more narrow and more forward.
Front are the same.

3) Roll center holes are only 1mm lower, so for same roll center position they need 1mm additional
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Old 10-08-2012, 06:44 AM   #439
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Originally Posted by Matt W View Post
Hi, just a few questions about the T4 compared to the T3 12........

+ Appart from being lower are the the shock positions on the tower the same as the T3 12?

+ Are the body posts all in the same position as the T3 12 so that current bodyshells can be used?

+ The T4 specs say that the roll center clamps are 2mm lower. Does that mean you need to run an additional 2mm shim on the clamps to get the same roll center position as on the T3 12?
I'm not too sure about the shock positions but i think they changed. Either way there is one postion less since the T4 only has 4 shock positions.

The front bodyposts are in the same position but the rear ones are closer together than before and probably more rearwards positioned as they are now bolted to the shock tower from behind.

I think that you are right with your last point. But you have to consider that the new chassisplate is thinner so there is a minimal change of RC by that. And setting your RC you might want to consider the lower CG of the T4 compared to the T3.

Regards David
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Old 10-08-2012, 07:19 AM   #440
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So you think Paul Lemieux is not that kind of driver? That guy can drive the wheels out of a car. So if that what he got out of it , that's what it can give. Period.
I dont want to cause shit...but i have to agree a bit ....the only way you can tell the differences in a car is to put the same skill level drivers in a car and see what car wins .....and in vegas that happened .....volker....hebert....and lemieux are most likely at the same driver skill level so that part of the equation is almost equal ......now the other part of the equation is what car wins with same skill level driver and the answer is yokomo.....this time around.....im sure tamiya will have some wins this year and so will associated and tcxx..... but xray is a great car and great build but it hasn't won anything in a while with hot shot drivers driving it so that must mean that......?
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Old 10-08-2012, 07:28 AM   #441
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Originally Posted by guru83 View Post
1) No, new tower have less holes so positions are not comparable. Standard Setup, both carpet and asphalt, start from second hole.

2) Rear body post are different, they are more narrow and more forward.
Front are the same.

3) Roll center holes are only 1mm lower, so for same roll center position they need 1mm additional
The upper bulkhead clamps are 2mm lower than before. Not 1mm.

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Old 10-08-2012, 08:19 AM   #442
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I dont want to cause shit...but i have to agree a bit ....the only way you can tell the differences in a car is to put the same skill level drivers in a car and see what car wins .....and in vegas that happened .....volker....hebert....and lemieux are most likely at the same driver skill level so that part of the equation is almost equal ......now the other part of the equation is what car wins with same skill level driver and the answer is yokomo.....this time around.....im sure tamiya will have some wins this year and so will associated and tcxx..... but xray is a great car and great build but it hasn't won anything in a while with hot shot drivers driving it so that must mean that......?
Volker has the BD7 super dialed as he has been racing it for a while, PL has only just got the T4. A fairer comparison will be in around 6-8 weeks once drivers have the setups the way they want them.
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Old 10-08-2012, 08:25 AM   #443
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I pre ordered mine, but I feel I pulled the trigger too fast. I just don't think the T4 is ready yet. Claims of hundreds of hours of testing, odd setups, and I'm just not seeing the results at the track. I have a feeling there are going to be changes. My predictions are chassis, bumper, steering rack and motor mount changes. Pivot ball toe block as an option. I foresee this is going to cost me. time will tell.
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Old 10-08-2012, 08:29 AM   #444
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Volker has the BD7 super dialed as he has been racing it for a while, PL has only just got the T4. A fairer comparison will be in around 6-8 weeks once drivers have the setups the way they want them.
OK fair enough
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Old 10-08-2012, 08:40 AM   #445
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I pre ordered mine, but I feel I pulled the trigger too fast. I just don't think the T4 is ready yet. Claims of hundreds of hours of testing, odd setups, and I'm just not seeing the results at the track. I have a feeling there are going to be changes. My predictions are chassis, bumper, steering rack and motor mount changes. Pivot ball toe block as an option. I foresee this is going to cost me. time will tell.
I foresee none of the above after running last week and seeing how fast Drew Ellis and Paul were after building their cars at the track and a few days before. Everyone is talking about how come Paul wasnt as fast as Volker.....Go look at Andrew Hardman and Drew ellis who didnt run there cars before the event except to set trim and such. They both made the A main in 2 classes with their cars. Not a bad debut in my opinion.

Abosutely nothing wrong with bumper, steering rack, motor mount or anything else. There will be an optional motor mount but that has been planned from the start. They may offer a thinner chassis but I have not heard yet.

Toe blocks will never happen per Xray. Simply not needed, more expensive to the end user and no performance advantage that they have found when testing them.

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Old 10-08-2012, 08:48 AM   #446
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Originally Posted by theatriks View Post
I dont want to cause shit...but i have to agree a bit ....the only way you can tell the differences in a car is to put the same skill level drivers in a car and see what car wins .....and in vegas that happened .....volker....hebert....and lemieux are most likely at the same driver skill level so that part of the equation is almost equal ......now the other part of the equation is what car wins with same skill level driver and the answer is yokomo.....this time around.....im sure tamiya will have some wins this year and so will associated and tcxx..... but xray is a great car and great build but it hasn't won anything in a while with hot shot drivers driving it so that must mean that......?
Thank you; that's what I'm saying. There's no reason for name calling, just trying to be objective In making a purchase decision without letting feelings get involved. Sorry if this sounds offensive but it's my money not yours. I perfectly understand that there's still many more hours to spend figuring out the best setup for it and more modifications done to it. Just wish they gave the drivers more tinkering time with the new car.
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Old 10-08-2012, 08:51 AM   #447
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Originally Posted by RCknight View Post
I pre ordered mine, but I feel I pulled the trigger too fast. I just don't think the T4 is ready yet. Claims of hundreds of hours of testing, odd setups, and I'm just not seeing the results at the track. I have a feeling there are going to be changes. My predictions are chassis, bumper, steering rack and motor mount changes. Pivot ball toe block as an option. I foresee this is going to cost me. time will tell.

Last edited by Sean B.; 10-08-2012 at 09:18 AM.
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Old 10-08-2012, 08:57 AM   #448
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You guys kill me...Paul did not win IIC last year either but the T3 2012 has turned out to be a great car. Paul has been running a T4 prototype for a long time, he just put the production kit together at the race. These guys at the top build new cars all of the time for big races as the plastics and chassis do tend to wear out over time when running modified week in and week out.

There is not car on the market that gets more design attention and prototype testing than the Xray. You guys can pretend that the car is not ready, but it honestly looked very good by the end of Vegas. If you consider the limited track time you get in Vegas I would say they made the car look very good in a very short amount of time. Ronald and Keven have been running their current cars for quite some time and this was the first race with the production kit for quite a few of the top Xray drivers.

You guys are missing the biggest point, which is that it takes more than just a great car to win these events. A lot of stuff has to come together to beat someone like Ronald. Paul is a very good driver, but so is Ronald and Keven. It just does not make sense that you guys determine how good a car is based on the results from one race weekend. It makes me think you guys know less about competitive racing then I thought.

If you think the car is not ready then don't buy one...but when you are getting your asses handed to you at your local track by T4's you can switch back and realized all you did was blow a bunch of money to find out you were wrong. Good drivers will figure out a way to go fast regardless of what car they are driving. If you think a T4 will make you a better driver then I have sad news for you, because that is not how it works.

I am not a team driver for Xray and I do not represent Xray in any way other then being a consumer, but I think that Xray is listening to the industry and is making the changes they feel need to be made. I think it will be a very good car once people start running it and figuring out the setup.

Passing judgment before the car even hits the streets in just dumb and irresponsible.

Stop filling this thread with inaccuracies and speculations that are totally unfounded!
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Old 10-08-2012, 09:04 AM   #449
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Originally Posted by artwork View Post
You guys kill me...Paul did not win IIC last year either but the T3 2012 has turned out to be a great car. Paul has been running a T4 prototype for a long time, he just put the production kit together at the race. These guys at the top build new cars all of the time for big races as the plastics and chassis do tend to wear out over time when running modified week in and week out.

There is not car on the market that gets more design attention and prototype testing than the Xray. You guys can pretend that the car is not ready, but it honestly looked very good by the end of Vegas. If you consider the limited track time you get in Vegas I would say they made the car look very good in a very short amount of time. Ronald and Keven have been running their current cars for quite some time and this was the first race with the production kit for quite a few of the top Xray drivers.

You guys are missing the biggest point, which is that it takes more than just a great car to win these events. A lot of stuff has to come together to beat someone like Ronald. Paul is a very good driver, but so is Ronald and Keven. It just does not make sense that you guys determine how good a car is based on the results from one race weekend. It makes me think you guys know less about competitive racing then I thought.

If you think the car is not ready then don't buy one...but when you are getting your asses handed to you at your local track by T4's you can switch back and realized all you did was blow a bunch of money to find out you were wrong. Good drivers will figure out a way to go fast regardless of what car they are driving. If you think a T4 will make you a better driver then I have sad news for you, because that is not how it works.

I am not a team driver for Xray and I do not represent Xray in any way other then being a consumer, but I think that Xray is listening to the industry and is making the changes they feel need to be made. I think it will be a very good car once people start running it and figuring out the setup.

Passing judgment before the car even hits the streets in just dumb and irresponsible.

Stop filling this thread with inaccuracies and speculations that are totally unfounded!
Very well put.
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Old 10-08-2012, 09:23 AM   #450
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Interesting that no one mentions different ESCs, Batteries, Motors, Servos, Radios like they did years ago. Now people just talk chassis as being the difference. Not even drivers.

My T4s are on order. Congratulations to young Canadian Andrew Hardman, the youngest and least experienced driver in the TC MOD and TC 13.5 A Mains with 5th place finishes in both with his T4.
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