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Old 01-27-2013, 12:40 PM   #2521
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Originally Posted by alloyslash View Post
We did this to mine and it came alive. We moved the rear AND front arms all the way forward, set ride height to 5.4mm, set droop with the chassis on 10mm blocks.
I think I'll give this a go. I assume when you moved the front arms forwards, you added another ackerman shim to compensate. I take it the idea is for more weight rearwards?

How much droop did you run (on gauges) and what is the rest of the setup?
Thanks, Max
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:36 PM   #2522
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After months of trying to get this car to drive how I want it to, I've almost got to the stage of retiring my T4. The problem I'm having is a very unresponsive steering mid corner and general lack of steering. Every other xray I've owned has very responsive steering through the whole corner, initial and mid. This T4 however is completely different.

I've tried, every spring combo, 2.7fr2.7rr.... 2.5fr-2.5rr.... 2.7fr-2.3-2.6rr.... 2.5-2.8fr-2.5-2.8rr, even harder rear springs than front lol. Bump steer shims upto 4mm, caster 6 deg, graphite arms, harder c hubs, different shock oil, gear diff oil upto 2000 and car still has similar basic feeling of numb mid corner.

Anyone else suffer this?

I've done well, getting the car in A final at EWS in the UK every time I get a chance to race there this season which is usually an open indoor track, but at my own club where its a lot more technical I struggle with setting it to feel nimble and have steering mid corner on hairpins. It's like it's a limosine. Tried even + 0.75 rear blocks and LTC-R shell which just seems to turn in and feel even worse mid corner. The only good improvements I seem to have is with the Subaru Type C body and front gear diff with 1 million oil which is still not where I want the car to be. Any further ideas would be a great help! Thanks.
What's your usual club?
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:45 PM   #2523
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxg123456 View Post
I think I'll give this a go. I assume when you moved the front arms forwards, you added another ackerman shim to compensate. I take it the idea is for more weight rearwards?

How much droop did you run (on gauges) and what is the rest of the setup?
Thanks, Max
You could also go up on the springs. Even a 2.7 is pretty soft (similar to a HPI blue in stiffness), so 2.9s are worth a try. Keep to a fairly thin shock oil and it should be pretty nimble.

I'd also try the upper links in the shortest positions, with 1mm of inner shims. This will keep the RC fairly high and again should make the car more lively.

And maybe rotate the Lipo so the tubes are at the front, this will give about a 1% balance shift rearwards which might get the back end to come round a bit more.
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Old 01-27-2013, 04:32 PM   #2524
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxg123456 View Post
After months of trying to get this car to drive how I want it to, I've almost got to the stage of retiring my T4. The problem I'm having is a very unresponsive steering mid corner and general lack of steering. Every other xray I've owned has very responsive steering through the whole corner, initial and mid. This T4 however is completely different.

I've tried, every spring combo, 2.7fr2.7rr.... 2.5fr-2.5rr.... 2.7fr-2.3-2.6rr.... 2.5-2.8fr-2.5-2.8rr, even harder rear springs than front lol. Bump steer shims upto 4mm, caster 6 deg, graphite arms, harder c hubs, different shock oil, gear diff oil upto 2000 and car still has similar basic feeling of numb mid corner.

Anyone else suffer this?

I've done well, getting the car in A final at EWS in the UK every time I get a chance to race there this season which is usually an open indoor track, but at my own club where its a lot more technical I struggle with setting it to feel nimble and have steering mid corner on hairpins. It's like it's a limosine. Tried even + 0.75 rear blocks and LTC-R shell which just seems to turn in and feel even worse mid corner. The only good improvements I seem to have is with the Subaru Type C body and front gear diff with 1 million oil which is still not where I want the car to be. Any further ideas would be a great help! Thanks.
Is it worse than mine?
I could do with more initial as well but still have a few things to try.
Video was 2.9 springs front with 2.7's rear. From earlier today at Newbury
+ YouTube Video
ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.
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Old 01-27-2013, 05:20 PM   #2525
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Is it worse than mine?
I could do with more initial as well but still have a few things to try.
Video was 2.9 springs front with 2.7's rear. From earlier today at Newbury
+ YouTube Video
ERROR: If you can see this, then YouTube is down or you don't have Flash installed.
It's still difficult to tell from video, but your car looks pretty good. The proof in the pudding is driving something that suits an individual. I know there are some drivers that get on very well with the t4 and I'm the other lot that can't get on with the car. I'm competitive, but still not as quick as with the T3 12'.

Large open indoor tracks is usually fine, but technical like Newbury and maritime in the UK is a struggle. I race at Maritime most weeks which is very technical. Funnily enough the last time I raced at Newbury is when I tried the Subaru which was a pleasent surprise. Better laptimes by 1/10th. The good thing about this shell, is that I can setup the car more like stock which I notice is when the car handles the smoothest. The subaru actually rotates the car through the hairpins. I think I'll try the wheelbase tricks and droop with speed 6 first. If all fails then last attempts with Subaru.
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Old 01-27-2013, 05:49 PM   #2526
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Originally Posted by maxg123456 View Post
It's still difficult to tell from video, but your car looks pretty good. The proof in the pudding is driving something that suits an individual. I know there are some drivers that get on very well with the t4 and I'm the other lot that can't get on with the car. I'm competitive, but still not as quick as with the T3 12'.

Large open indoor tracks is usually fine, but technical like Newbury and maritime in the UK is a struggle. I race at Maritime most weeks which is very technical. Funnily enough the last time I raced at Newbury is when I tried the Subaru which was a pleasent surprise. Better laptimes by 1/10th. The good thing about this shell, is that I can setup the car more like stock which I notice is when the car handles the smoothest. The subaru actually rotates the car through the hairpins. I think I'll try the wheelbase tricks and droop with speed 6 first. If all fails then last attempts with Subaru.
I ran a Speed 6 today, but tried an LTC-R in one round, certainly helped turn in etc, but kept causing the back to rotate too much which made it a pain to drive.

Let us know how you get on with the changes, good or bad.

Skiddins
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Old 01-28-2013, 02:44 AM   #2527
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Originally Posted by maxg123456 View Post
I think I'll give this a go. I assume when you moved the front arms forwards, you added another ackerman shim to compensate. I take it the idea is for more weight rearwards?

How much droop did you run (on gauges) and what is the rest of the setup?
Thanks, Max
I'll have to see and post it this evening, along with all the other adjustments
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Last edited by alloyslash; 01-28-2013 at 02:54 AM.
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Old 01-28-2013, 04:38 AM   #2528
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Is this enough to offset the weight of the wires and connectors? Seems like a wash to me. 12 guage wires are quite heavy..
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And maybe rotate the Lipo so the tubes are at the front, this will give about a 1% balance shift rearwards which might get the back end to come round a bit more.
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Old 01-28-2013, 04:52 AM   #2529
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Is this enough to offset the weight of the wires and connectors? Seems like a wash to me. 12 guage wires are quite heavy..
Firstly, don't bother with 12AWG wire.
The connector end of a lipo pack is typically 10g lighter than the other end.

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Old 01-28-2013, 10:41 AM   #2530
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Default Hard Rear Uprights!!

Hi,

What is the difference between running the hard rear uprights or the medium. Do they affect the handling at all and would the harder uprights be better for getting a more accurate rear toe?
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Old 01-28-2013, 11:02 AM   #2531
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Hi,

What is the difference between running the hard rear uprights or the medium. Do they affect the handling at all and would the harder uprights be better for getting a more accurate rear toe?
Medium will give you a little more rear bite. I have ran tracks where just changing to medium solved the rear from breaking loose.
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Old 01-28-2013, 12:28 PM   #2532
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Yesterday I had one of those days were what had been working just didn't work . Traction was super high in areas ur shoes were sticking to the carpet in a few areas.
------------------Was running ----------------Now
Camber---------------0f/2r_-----------------1.5f/3r
Springs -----------2.5f/2.3proR----------2.5proF/2.3proR
Shock loc----------3outF/2outR-------------2outF&R
Oil ------------------------400F/350R------------
Wheel base ------------front kit /rear forward-------
Ride height-----------------5.4 F&R------------
Droop over ride ------4.4F/4R---------------2.4F/2R
Using middle location on inner camber link F&R
1mm shim under all inner links
1mm F outer /4mm inside outer rear
2mm Ackerman spacers 1mm bump steer spacers .
Med role center front /high role in rear .
Hope this works for u as well as it did me yesterday .
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Last edited by jlfx car audio; 01-28-2013 at 03:26 PM.
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Old 01-28-2013, 01:33 PM   #2533
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Originally Posted by Skiddins View Post
I ran a Speed 6 today, but tried an LTC-R in one round, certainly helped turn in etc, but kept causing the back to rotate too much which made it a pain to drive.

Let us know how you get on with the changes, good or bad.

Skiddins
Funny I had the same experience at the last EWS with an LTC-R, first time I had tried one, went back to the Speed 6 and it was definetly more planted at the back.
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Old 01-28-2013, 02:15 PM   #2534
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlfx car audio View Post
Yesterday I had one of those days were what had been working just didn't work . Traction was super high in areas ur shoes were sticking to the carpet in a few areas.
------------------Was running ----------------Now
Camber---------------0f/2r_-----------------1.5f/3r
Springs -----------2.5f/2.3proR----------2.5proF/2.3proR
Shock loc----------3outF/2outR-------------2outF&R
Oil ------------------------400F/350R------------
Wheel base ------------front kit /rear forward-------
Ride height-----------------5.4 F&R------------
Droop over ride ------4.4F/4R---------------2.4F/2R
Using middle location on inner camber link F&R
1mm shim under all inner links
1mm F outer /4mm inside outer rear
2mm Ackerman spacers 1mm bump steer spacers .
Med role center front /high role in rear .
Hope this works for u as well as it did me yesterday .
Was running 11.1 wile EA was running 11.0 in mains
Justin,
What brand tires do you all run?
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Old 01-28-2013, 03:21 PM   #2535
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Jaco blue.
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