R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11-14-2012, 05:52 PM   #586
Tech Addict
 
S.Stew's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Michigan
Posts: 642
Trader Rating: 12 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bvoltz View Post
Last night I ran the car and must say it was very easy to drive and fun...

Now for the questions from a 1/12th newbie (you have been given notice )....

It worked best with 2.5 of front camber (because I did not have a way to measure or a setup board for 1/12th, someone else did and changed it to 1, and the lap times got slower... I need to at .5.... Interesting...

I also having a mind problem with this (it's me....) but to set pod droop the ball end on the center shock does not screw on, it turns to a point then spins... So not sure how to use this to set the pod drop... maybe the end is just bad...

I also was running 2.5mm front RH, 3.0mm Center and 3.5 Rear... Again, this was me not paying attention. I really thought I had it at 3.5, 3.0 and 3.5....

As we corrected issues, I noticed it got harder to drive and the lap times got slower.... I found this interesting....
Okay, so Slapmaster covered some of this but...

I've found most use 1 Deg or Less, myself included. I don't know what 2.5 Deg would feel like, but I imagine it probably would impact feel/corner speed in a negative manner and will probably cone the tire pretty bad. Try 1 Deg and if you need more steering, tune something else (softer front spring, more dope, etc.)

For ride height, I almost always use around 4mm (unless on really small tires - In that case closer to 3.5-3.8). Depending on where my tires are at, I might use a slight rake too. I've found its okay to have the center ride height slightly less than the front (.1mm). I'll use something like 3.9mm Front, 3.8mm Center, and 4mm rear. Just so long as the center is never higher than the rear.

Also interested to know what tires your using and the conditions of the track.

__________________
- Steven Stewart - Kawada USA
www.Kawada-USA.com
S.Stew is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2012, 06:05 PM   #587
Tech Champion
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Hawaii, USA
Posts: 7,157
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slapmaster6000 View Post
Yes, the #4262 ride height shims are for the xti.... Burt wins a CRC sticker!

Brian
I think you mean Xi
InspGadgt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2012, 07:57 PM   #588
Tech Master
 
LonnyJ1950's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ. USA
Posts: 1,139
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bvoltz View Post
Last night I ran the car and must say it was very easy to drive and fun...

Now for the questions from a 1/12th newbie (you have been given notice )....

It worked best with 2.5 of front camber (because I did not have a way to measure or a setup board for 1/12th, someone else did and changed it to 1, and the lap times got slower... I need to at .5.... Interesting...

I also having a mind problem with this (it's me....) but to set pod droop the ball end on the center shock does not screw on, it turns to a point then spins... So not sure how to use this to set the pod drop... maybe the end is just bad...

I also was running 2.5mm front RH, 3.0mm Center and 3.5 Rear... Again, this was me not paying attention. I really thought I had it at 3.5, 3.0 and 3.5....

As we corrected issues, I noticed it got harder to drive and the lap times got slower.... I found this interesting....
You need at least 3mm clearance to be legal. But you can raise the whole car a bit and maintain the rake you have, 3.0, 3.5 and 4.0. Lap times rule, if you change something and the car goes slower change it back. there is no right set up, there is only speed.
__________________
Lonny
LonnyJ1950 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2012, 08:01 PM   #589
Tech Master
 
LonnyJ1950's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Tucson, AZ. USA
Posts: 1,139
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by theatriks View Post
Sure that would help eh ....I'm gonna just try 17.5 blinky to start with....the motor is my cheater corally pro red but this is just for practice day ...thanks
Not familiar with the Pro Red motors, but 17.5 blinky generally runs 95 to 105mm depending on conditions.
__________________
Lonny
LonnyJ1950 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2012, 09:28 PM   #590
Tech Elite
 
bvoltz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Bedtime with Teddi
Posts: 3,635
Trader Rating: 44 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by InspGadgt View Post
Looks like the one you want is 4260
Many thanks to everyone on this one... I have shims but they just do not get me 3.5, I get 3.4 or 3.6... Maybe that it is not that big of a deal at this point in my experience, but I'm trying to use these types of things to learn...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slapmaster6000 View Post
Bvoltz, I just jumped in here and read your post. Odd that you had better lap times with 2.5 camber, it should have screwed right into the carpet. But that said, what tire combo? What is your carpet traction like? What's your sauce pattern (full rear - 3/4 inside front?)

You really want to aim for 3.25-3.5mm of r/h. You can rake the chassis (lower at the nose then the tail) if you want to increase steering, but that is a very subtle setting.

Yes, the #4262 ride height shims are for the xti.... Burt wins a CRC sticker!

A little trick, you can use a header card, a business card, anything with a square 90* corner as a camber gauge. Place it along side your front tire and see how much gap you have at the top. 0.040" or 1mm is going to be about -1* of camber. We normally do not run that much.... so use just slightly less.

Brian
Tires - CRC Chrome fronts and CRC Low Grey Rear, cut to Fronts at 1.63 and Rears 1.67. (I just ordered CRC 1/12th Rear Pro-Cut Tires (Magenta), and Pink fronts...)

Treatment, Paragon Ground Effects (Black Can), Full rear, 1/2 fronts, and I can not handle the car for the first 2 mins with this... put on 10mins before going to the track.

Traction is med., the carpet is older and a bit used....

MANY THANKS on the card trick... I did order a RPM camber gauge. I have a setup kit for 1/10th but not 1/12th....

Stew - It was recommended to me to run a little lower in the middle until I get more comfortable with the car. It is more "forgiving"...

I'm beginning to think I FUBARed the tires, and need to run them a bit to un cone them... Thus the reason for the handling issues... (Hey I'm ok with the learning process.)

Others did drive the car, as I felt it was going to the left... quicker, better, then left... But I think I found that issue after I got home, something to do with 2 Qtrs and lifting the front of the car on the setup board, with the car front facing me, the right side would "drop the Qtr" first, so I turned the side springs until it was even.... (hope this was correct... it took just a little less then a 1/2 turn). (Note I think CRC will have a few more new customers after they drove it....People really loved the car..)

?? Does it matter which side you adjust? Again, sorry for the dumb question... or should you adjust a little on both sides to keep them "balanced"?
__________________
Wheeling an Xray T4 and T4 14 using a Ko Propo, powered by EA motors and Speed Passion Speedo, paid for by my wife.

Digi3Dworks - 3D printing for the medical Field.

Last edited by bvoltz; 11-14-2012 at 09:38 PM.
bvoltz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2012, 09:35 PM   #591
Tech Addict
 
S.Stew's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Michigan
Posts: 642
Trader Rating: 12 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bvoltz View Post
and I can not handle the car for the first 2 mins with this...
Is this because it has too much steering? If so, try a black front and maybe go to a harder front spring.

I agree with running the center a bit lower, but .5mm is a lot IMO for a 12th scale. I use just a little sag in the center, like I said - maybe .2 mm
__________________
- Steven Stewart - Kawada USA
www.Kawada-USA.com

Last edited by S.Stew; 11-14-2012 at 09:37 PM. Reason: added content.
S.Stew is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2012, 09:39 PM   #592
Tech Elite
 
bvoltz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Bedtime with Teddi
Posts: 3,635
Trader Rating: 44 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by S.Stew View Post
Is this because it has too much steering? If so, try a black front and maybe go to a harder front spring.

I agree with running the center a bit lower, but .5mm is a lot IMO for a 12th scale. I use just a little sag in the center, like I said - maybe .2 mm
Yep.... around 15 clicks of dual rate out and then back in over the 8min run.... Oh. I at 55 on the front springs now, I could go to 60....
__________________
Wheeling an Xray T4 and T4 14 using a Ko Propo, powered by EA motors and Speed Passion Speedo, paid for by my wife.

Digi3Dworks - 3D printing for the medical Field.
bvoltz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2012, 09:40 PM   #593
Tech Elite
 
bvoltz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Bedtime with Teddi
Posts: 3,635
Trader Rating: 44 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by S.Stew View Post
Is this because it has too much steering? If so, try a black front and maybe go to a harder front spring.

I agree with running the center a bit lower, but .5mm is a lot IMO for a 12th scale. I use just a little sag in the center, like I said - maybe .2 mm
Ok... Got it...

I added more to my post... I was trying to answer all the question you folks have been so kind to ask and offer help... You have no idea how much I appreciate your help and I'm have been able to give back already....
__________________
Wheeling an Xray T4 and T4 14 using a Ko Propo, powered by EA motors and Speed Passion Speedo, paid for by my wife.

Digi3Dworks - 3D printing for the medical Field.
bvoltz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2012, 09:48 PM   #594
Tech Addict
 
S.Stew's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Michigan
Posts: 642
Trader Rating: 12 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bvoltz View Post
Others did drive the car, as I felt it was going to the left... quicker, better, then left... But I think I found that issue after I got home, something to do with 2 Qtrs and lifting the front of the car on the setup board, with the car front facing me, the right side would "drop the Qtr" first, so I turned the side springs until it was even.... (hope this was correct... it took just a little less then a 1/2 turn). (Note I think CRC will have a few more new customers after they drove it....People really loved the car..)

?? Does it matter which side you adjust? Again, sorry for the dumb question... or should you adjust a little on both sides to keep them "balanced"?
Read THIS and every other article on his blog. Very good content.

I never do the quarter trick. With the CRC front end, ensure the king pin lengths are precisely equal (.404") and ensure nothing is bent. I'll use the technique I linked only every now and then. I almost always run little to no side spring pre-load. If nothing is bent, you should be able to set the side springs perfectly flat to the lower pod (turn them down until just touching) and be pretty close. You can double check this on a tweak station with the rear of the car on the pivoting end.

Hope this helps
__________________
- Steven Stewart - Kawada USA
www.Kawada-USA.com
S.Stew is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2012, 10:07 PM   #595
Tech Elite
 
bvoltz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Bedtime with Teddi
Posts: 3,635
Trader Rating: 44 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by S.Stew View Post
Read THIS and every other article on his blog. Very good content.

I never do the quarter trick. With the CRC front end, ensure the king pin lengths are precisely equal (.404") and ensure nothing is bent. I'll use the technique I linked only every now and then. I almost always run little to no side spring pre-load. If nothing is bent, you should be able to set the side springs perfectly flat to the lower pod (turn them down until just touching) and be pretty close. You can double check this on a tweak station with the rear of the car on the pivoting end.

Hope this helps
I will read it.. They at the track did put the car on a Tweak Station and no tweak but it was turning to the left more then then right, and this was confirmed by others. Using the Qtr trick one side was higher then the other.... But now on to reading....
__________________
Wheeling an Xray T4 and T4 14 using a Ko Propo, powered by EA motors and Speed Passion Speedo, paid for by my wife.

Digi3Dworks - 3D printing for the medical Field.
bvoltz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2012, 10:53 PM   #596
Tech Champion
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Hawaii, USA
Posts: 7,157
Default

This is also a great post for 1/12th scale. Pretty much everything there is to know about 1/12th compiled into 1 post thanks to Redbullfixx:

12th Scale Racing is Alive and Well in So Cal

3.4 or 3.6 will be close enough...we're fairly precise with 1/12th but not exact. As for the handling...if it is too much for the first 2 mins at 1/2 sauce on the fronts you might want to try going to 1/3rd sauce on the fronts. It's a quick adjustment to do without having to buy all new tires.
InspGadgt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2012, 10:55 PM   #597
Tech Elite
 
bvoltz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Bedtime with Teddi
Posts: 3,635
Trader Rating: 44 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by InspGadgt View Post
This is also a great post for 1/12th scale. Pretty much everything there is to know about 1/12th compiled into 1 post thanks to Redbullfixx:

12th Scale Racing is Alive and Well in So Cal

3.4 or 3.6 will be close enough...we're fairly precise with 1/12th but not exact. As for the handling...if it is too much for the first 2 mins at 1/2 sauce on the fronts you might want to try going to 1/3rd sauce on the fronts. It's a quick adjustment to do without having to buy all new tires.
The only reason I purchased the was because this is what everyone else is running, but I think some are going to purchase the chrome / low grey , they really like them...

I really like 1/12th on the rug... to the point I'm really thinking about taking a break from TC 17.5, carpet is to much for my old ass..... LOL!!! I really need to get up to Grand Rapids and hang out with Stew and the CRC crew.... I will learn a bunch....
__________________
Wheeling an Xray T4 and T4 14 using a Ko Propo, powered by EA motors and Speed Passion Speedo, paid for by my wife.

Digi3Dworks - 3D printing for the medical Field.
bvoltz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2012, 11:50 PM   #598
Tech Elite
 
Slapmaster6000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Edmonds, Wash.
Posts: 2,947
Trader Rating: 14 (100%+)
Default

Thing about chrome/graylow combo is that the front will need to be CA'ed if you are 41.5 or bigger. If no one has shown you how to CA a side wall, ask around. It's a big time tuning trick. I usually tell newer guys to start out with yellow/black and work your way into graylow/chrome as it's a bit more "racy".

Paragon is "giddy up" from turn one. That's why guys like it so much.

King pin length is very critical. .404" from the bottom of the knuckle to the far side of the e-clip groove is gospel. Make it so!

The quarter trick works so long as your Up Stops are consistent in the front. IF they are, you can tweak in the side springs just fine. Once you "weight" the car or sit it in the suspension, then you will see if the tweak as real. If you have collapsed front spring or different king pin length, you are are going to be in trouble. Turning more to one side then the other is a classic tweak issue. I like to use a tweak station. Remove your damper tubes so that they do not influence your tweak. Set the car on the stand, tap it by the upper rear shock mount. It should settle into where it wants. Adjust as needed. One thing that hasn't been mentioned is that this car get annoyed if you preload the side springs. Loosen your side springs till the bubble wont center either way, sneak up on spring tension till the bubble centers without over tension. Over tension maybe your irritating first 2 minutes.

Once you realize that rubber is for condoms, you wont look at TC the same way.
__________________
Stay dialed my friends!
www.slapmastertools.com
Team Roche USA
Team Orca orcharc.com
Slapmaster6000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2012, 11:58 PM   #599
Tech Elite
 
Slapmaster6000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Edmonds, Wash.
Posts: 2,947
Trader Rating: 14 (100%+)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by InspGadgt View Post
I think you mean Xi
Yea, yea, yeahhhh..... 4260 is the XTI ride height shim. Don't make me come over there!

Dec 8-15. I will be close enough we can skip rocks and knock a tooth out.
__________________
Stay dialed my friends!
www.slapmastertools.com
Team Roche USA
Team Orca orcharc.com
Slapmaster6000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-15-2012, 01:51 AM   #600
Tech Champion
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Hawaii, USA
Posts: 7,157
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slapmaster6000 View Post
Yea, yea, yeahhhh..... 4260 is the XTI ride height shim. Don't make me come over there!

Dec 8-15. I will be close enough we can skip rocks and knock a tooth out.
Skip on over and I'll buy ya a couple drinks
InspGadgt is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
12th Scale Racing is Alive and Well in So Cal RedBullFiXX California Racing 563 11-20-2016 08:18 AM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 05:00 PM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net

SEO by vBSEO 3.5.0