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Old 10-19-2009, 10:53 PM   #17686
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looking to get a Team Epic 5000 40c or IP5000 40c lipo for my cyclone. Would i have any fitment issues? Something tells me id need to grind the bulkhead to get it to fit.

http://www.teamepiconline.com/shop/i...p?item=TEP2001
would the bullet plug version work better than the deans one or vice versa?
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Old 10-19-2009, 11:03 PM   #17687
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Default Exotek HBX Lipo Chassis - brand new

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Old 10-19-2009, 11:04 PM   #17688
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how much?
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Old 10-19-2009, 11:40 PM   #17689
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Korey Harbke View Post
Sometimes this is a little weird to explain, but I'll give it my best shot. I think of the shims under the camber link and the shims under the suspension blocks as two totally different things. It makes it a lot easier to understand, apply, and see the results on the track.

Shims under the camber link do change roll center, but it's a much finer adjustment of roll center. Personally, I don't think you are feeling this change. When you change the shims under the camber link, most people feel the change in the camber gain characteristics. On the cyclone, more shims under the pivot (flatter link) reduces camber change, so the camber setting stays mostly the same as the car rolls, but it gives a slightly lower roll center. Generally more shims will create slightly more initial grip (especially at high speed) and produce less overall grip through the middle and exit of the corner. Fewer shims (more angled link) does the opposite, and have more camber change (more negative camber as the suspension is compressed), but also gives a slightly higher roll center. Generally a more angled camber link will have less initial grip entering the corner, but more in the middle and exit.

Now for the suspension blocks. The suspension blocks do change roll center and camber change characteristics much like the camber link shims do... but the shims under the suspension blocks have a much greater effect on roll center than it does on the camber change characteristics. More shims under the suspension blocks raises the roll center. This gives more initial grip, less roll, but less overall grip in the middle and exit of the corner. Think of it as if the car feels... stiffer. Fewer shims will lower the roll center. The result is a car that rolls more and has more overall grip in the middle and exit of the corner. It does smooth out the car entering the corner though.

I hope that wasn't too confusing. Sometimes these adjustments can have varied effects depending on the track conditions and the rest of your setup. But it is a good guideline to work from. Hope this helped!

-Korey
Korey (& Co),

(1) It has been about 3 months and (this morning) I have finally found out why my car has been VERY VERY taily (180 degree spins were quite common). So I thought I would share my experience.

(2) Based on Korey's response above (to my previous query), I went back and thought about what I had been doing wrong. I also checked all the other HB Team Driver settings. Previously, I thought I had been changing roll centre, when I had actually been changing the camber gain.

(3) Previously (due to my misunderstanding), my front camber gain was greater than the rear. Whereas, all the Team Drivers have the rear camber gain greater than the front. Typically, 2.5mm shim up front and a 1.0mm shim on the rear (the camber link shim, aka upper arm shim).

(4) As it happens, I now have a setup very similar to Hara at RROC May 2008.
I'll be able to move forward with something much more drivable.

(5) So anyone else having rear end problems might also like to check their camber gain settings (and roll centres).

Oh Joy
PS: At least I am more familiar with my car.
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Old 10-20-2009, 12:53 AM   #17690
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cosmo1974 View Post
Korey (& Co),

(1) It has been about 3 months and (this morning) I have finally found out why my car has been VERY VERY taily (180 degree spins were quite common). So I thought I would share my experience.

(2) Based on Korey's response above (to my previous query), I went back and thought about what I had been doing wrong. I also checked all the other HB Team Driver settings. Previously, I thought I had been changing roll centre, when I had actually been changing the camber gain.

(3) Previously (due to my misunderstanding), my front camber gain was greater than the rear. Whereas, all the Team Drivers have the rear camber gain greater than the front. Typically, 2.5mm shim up front and a 1.0mm shim on the rear (the camber link shim, aka upper arm shim).

(4) As it happens, I now have a setup very similar to Hara at RROC May 2008.
I'll be able to move forward with something much more drivable.

(5) So anyone else having rear end problems might also like to check their camber gain settings (and roll centres).

Oh Joy
PS: At least I am more familiar with my car.
I'm glad it helped!!!
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Old 10-20-2009, 12:56 AM   #17691
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Syber Serulean View Post
looking to get a Team Epic 5000 40c or IP5000 40c lipo for my cyclone. Would i have any fitment issues? Something tells me id need to grind the bulkhead to get it to fit.

http://www.teamepiconline.com/shop/i...p?item=TEP2001
would the bullet plug version work better than the deans one or vice versa?
I would go with the deans version. Any battery with a bullet plug setup typically has a PCB board, and those generally create more resistance than the big fat wires being directly connected to the battery tabs.

You'll have to grind a few mm off the bulkhead, and the upper deck screw, but that's no big deal. There have been no performance losses due to grinding the bulkhead.

-Korey
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Old 10-20-2009, 02:01 AM   #17692
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Korey Harbke View Post
I'm glad it helped!!!
I'm older and wiser (I hope)
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Old 10-20-2009, 10:44 AM   #17693
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Old 10-20-2009, 08:54 PM   #17694
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil C View Post
Hi Cosmo,

No problem at all, sorry its taken so long for me to reply...

Here is a pic of how I have cut the topdecks and a base setup sheet for asphalt which I usually work from.

I will be testing with Andy M from Friday-Sunday at Snetterton Park track in the UK as it is the venue for the next UK national. I will post the setup I end up on if you like, as it is low-medium grip and could also be a good setup to work from.

Hope this helps,

Phil.
Hey Phil - sorry this is in response to your post from 2 months ago

but where did you get the one piece deck you had on your chassis in one of the pics??
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Old 10-20-2009, 09:25 PM   #17695
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Originally Posted by k_bojar View Post
Hey Phil - sorry this is in response to your post from 2 months ago

but where did you get the one piece deck you had on your chassis in one of the pics??
That's a prototype upper deck the European team has been testing. From what I understand there have been mixed reviews on it though. We have been running just a cut std upper deck here in the US and it works pretty well. I find in most conditions just the plain upper deck is better though.

-Korey
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Old 10-21-2009, 02:30 AM   #17696
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hi all,

is there a picture of andy moores car from the IIC anywhere please?

thanks, john
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Old 10-21-2009, 03:47 AM   #17697
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I have very hard problems with my setup, when the track are cool and slipery, when training the car is good, work perfect and the times are great, for example in saturday after race, i repase the car, clean, etc...and go to race sunday, in the morning the car not work, nothing, feel is over water, i tested some setups, from here and other drivers, and i always the same, i don´t can found the problem, i tested Korey setup is some pages back, for parking lot, and work very well for me, but the same problem at morning.
We use control tyres, Sweep 36, the temps here are not very cool, (+-15ēC), i use tire warmers and test different additives and trattaments.

Any advice?
Thanks in advance, Luis C.
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Old 10-21-2009, 01:28 PM   #17698
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You could try my setup that I had posted earlier, but maybe try thinner oil and more shock rebound. I would run about 40wt oil and maybe run full rebound. That will help the car deal with what seems to be colder conditions. This will heat up the tires a little quicker, and probably make the tires stay warmer through the run.

Also, in the morning typically the environment is more humid. The moisture in the air can have varied effects with the tires, and the traction compounds used. I can't give any personal experience with those tires as I've never used them. Hopefully that helps though.

-Korey
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Old 10-21-2009, 02:28 PM   #17699
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Hey Korey, have you tried that Exotek Lipo chassis?
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Old 10-21-2009, 02:49 PM   #17700
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Hi Luis,

Did other cars work well when yours didn't?

In the morning, before many cars run on the track, generally the track would have a lot of moisture and dust. Unless you are racing in this condition, then there is no point setting up your car for it.

Just wait till after more cars have run on the track, then you start your practice and setup your car for the "racing condition".

Also, Sweep tires are generally good for 4-5 fast runs, then they will start to go away. And when they go away, your cars' backend will get pretty loose. And again, set your car up for either new or used tires, because the same setup would normally not work very well with both.

Basically, you need to learn to read the track and the tires.

Hope it helps



Quote:
Originally Posted by luic View Post
I have very hard problems with my setup, when the track are cool and slipery, when training the car is good, work perfect and the times are great, for example in saturday after race, i repase the car, clean, etc...and go to race sunday, in the morning the car not work, nothing, feel is over water, i tested some setups, from here and other drivers, and i always the same, i don´t can found the problem, i tested Korey setup is some pages back, for parking lot, and work very well for me, but the same problem at morning.
We use control tyres, Sweep 36, the temps here are not very cool, (+-15ēC), i use tire warmers and test different additives and trattaments.

Any advice?
Thanks in advance, Luis C.
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