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Old 06-04-2014, 08:50 PM   #7366
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New rule will allow Nitro VTA cars to compete with electrics, but only with the pull start Dynamite .12 and only indoors....with no ventilation. Last driver standing wins!
What about a hybrid VTA? I have a VTA car with a nitro engine that powers a small DC generator which then charges my Lipo battery and powers the electric motor at the same time. The minimum weight for VTA will have to be 4950 grams (with an empty tank).
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Old 06-04-2014, 09:17 PM   #7367
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Yes, that is indeed the replacement
I hope this is legal as its a PITA to take the motor apart to oil that @#^$@^ bearing!!!

IS THERE AN OFFICIAL USVTA STATEMENT THAT THIS IS LEGAL???? I just wanted to drill a damn hole in the current endbel so I can oil the bearing but the rules say ANY modification is illegal.

Last edited by John Wallace2; 06-04-2014 at 09:30 PM.
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Old 06-04-2014, 09:21 PM   #7368
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For the price, it got owned by the Justock
That's probably why they want to ban the Just Stock - too much competition for Novak
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Old 06-04-2014, 09:23 PM   #7369
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I was just thinking how much fun I had racing last weekend. Just watching VTA while marshalling is a blast. The cars are the best looking too.
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Old 06-04-2014, 09:27 PM   #7370
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Can't wait for USVTA to post its new rules so you all can get on to something beside speculating about what might happen and start complaining about what did happen. Actually I'd prefer something more stimulating such as a good discussion of how to make these VTA cars go faster and handle better.

There are certainly a lot of technical issues with ESCs that the USVTA organization is concerned about, IMO perhaps overly so. If ESCs can be programmed with different software like the Hobby Wing Just Stock, that should not necessarily mean that they should be illegal for USVTA. Particularly if its easy to demonstrate what version of the software is being used and if that version has been tested and shown that is doesn't provide an advantage. Oh and BTW if that ESC is illegal for USVTA, why then would the same sanctioning body deem that same ESC to be legal to use for USGT (e.g., the Tekin RS Pro with V228 software)?

However, there are also significant technical issues with the BOSS motor of choice that USVTA seems to overlook either by neglect or by design. For example, the only tech inspection on the BOSS that I'm aware of that is being done is to look to see if the timing label and the timing mark are aligned so that it appears that the motor has no more than 45 degrees of timing. However, there are significant differences on where that timing label is placed on the timing ring (as much as 10%). This variation in placement is explained by manufacturing tolerances so that the placement corrects for differences in the actual zero timing point of that stator. The basic problem, however, is that there is no way to know if this timing ring goes with that stator. By simply switching parts on the BOSS motor you can get close to 50 degrees of timing and the label will still show 45 degrees. My dyno says at 45 degrees that my BOSS motor wants more timing than 45 degrees and at ~50 degrees it's way better than it was at 45 degrees. The next basic problem with the motor is that there is no fool proof way to tech the rotor to be sure it is the stock BOSS rotor without disassembling the motor and inspecting/measuring the rotor. I've talked to many racers and no one can recall any VTA motor being disassembled at any major USVTA race. I raced at a lot of ROAR national and other big races and it was common to see many if not all of the A main stock brushed motors being disassembled and even the armature wires unwound counted and measued. Novak says you can tell the difference in rotors by how easily the motor spins. I can tell you I have a tuning rotor in one of my boss motors and its very difficult to tell the legal one from the other, at least it's not enough that I would be confident to call someone a cheater by just spinning the shaft - I can with my dyno, but not by spinning the shaft.

So I hope if USVTA does make some rule changes that they address both the ESC and motor issues. I love VTA, but to be honest right now because of the motor issues I mentioned, I run USVTA primarily to get track time for racing USGT where I feel I'm on a much more of a level playing field and my driving skills (or lack there of) are the primary factor for my finishes. We run two series here in Texas (AROCS and EOS) and for VTA both of these series allow any ROAR blinky ESC (i.e., zero timing) or any ESC on the USVTA list and any 25.5 motor (I'd say ROAR approved 25.5 but there aren't any on the ROAR approved list). I personnaly haven't found a noticeable difference in ESCs on the list and those with legal blinky software; but I sure have found a big difference in motors and a non BOSS motor gave me enough HP to finally keep up and even be racy with some of the faster BOSS motors.

So I ask you, what is more costly having a motor war where you buy three different brands of motors trying to find the best one, or having a motor war where you buy three of the same brand motor trying to find the best one? If USVTA is really concerned about the cost of racing, then be concern with people buying $800 cars and running them in VTA. Just my 2 cents

Last edited by John Wallace2; 06-04-2014 at 11:44 PM.
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Old 06-04-2014, 09:31 PM   #7371
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Y'all opening up da motor choice??
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Old 06-04-2014, 09:32 PM   #7372
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Originally Posted by John Wallace2 View Post
I hope this is legal as its a PITA to take the motor apart to oil that @#^$@^ bearing!!!

IS THERE AN OFFICIAL USVTA STATEMENT THAT THIS IS LEGAL???? I just wanted to drill a damn hole in the current endbel so I can oil the bearing but the rules say ANY modification is illegal.
that just opens a huge can of worms
- is the timing sticker pre-applied ?? if so how ?? the stories I read here is they are applied when the motor is dynoed so that they are exactly where they need to be, how do you dyno just the endbell ?lol? If the timing sticker is not applied but included how do you know where to place it ?? you get it wrong then ur cheating and are illegal !lol! and if its not included again ... illegal.
- novak states this is a part for the Vulcan motor but CAN also be used on the ballistic ... so you are modifying the motor and making it illegal

just buy a NEW motor .... u dont want to be a cheater lol
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Old 06-04-2014, 09:50 PM   #7373
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Regarding sanctioned USVTA races going forward, all competitors must wear Bud Light t-shirts (bonus points for repping' Spuds Mackenzie). Oingo Boingo will be played over the PA system during qualifying rounds. TQ (BQ) of the B-main must replace his standard driver character with the Max Headroom version. Jack the Gripper for outdoor rounds and Paragon for the rug. No modifications of optional tuning rotor is allowed.
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Old 06-04-2014, 10:39 PM   #7374
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Regarding sanctioned USVTA races going forward, all competitors must wear Bud Light t-shirts (bonus points for repping' Spuds Mackenzie). Oingo Boingo will be played over the PA system during qualifying rounds. TQ (BQ) of the B-main must replace his standard driver character with the Max Headroom version. Jack the Gripper for outdoor rounds and Paragon for the rug. No modifications of optional tuning rotor is allowed.
now thats a great rule! man i aint heard oingo boingo in years. hell max headroom? priceless. lmao.



side note. nf_ekt i notice your location is 22 acacia avenue! up the irons! way to be Trooper!
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Old 06-05-2014, 12:07 AM   #7375
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..
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Old 06-05-2014, 12:09 AM   #7376
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Originally Posted by moparSRT View Post
that just opens a huge can of worms
- is the timing sticker pre-applied ?? if so how ?? the stories I read here is they are applied when the motor is dynoed so that they are exactly where they need to be, how do you dyno just the endbell ?lol? If the timing sticker is not applied but included how do you know where to place it ?? you get it wrong then ur cheating and are illegal !lol! and if its not included again ... illegal.
- novak states this is a part for the Vulcan motor but CAN also be used on the ballistic ... so you are modifying the motor and making it illegal

just buy a NEW motor .... u dont want to be a cheater lol
Yep, that's why I asked if USVTA had approved this end bell as a replacement for the VTA legal motors.
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Old 06-05-2014, 12:13 AM   #7377
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I can tell you I have a tuning rotor in one of my boss motors
That's the point where I stopped reading.

I run a USVTA legal car, anywhere I go. I do fine with it. I don't go home thinking the motor or esc held me back. My good finishes are my cleanest races, any finishing spot other than out front I can usually find either my own mistakes fairly easily or just admit that someone was just simply better on that given day. I then pack up my toy cars and go home happy.
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Old 06-05-2014, 12:39 AM   #7378
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That's the point where I stopped reading.

I run a USVTA legal car, anywhere I go. I do fine with it. I don't go home thinking the motor or esc held me back. My good finishes are my cleanest races, any finishing spot other than out front I can usually find either my own mistakes fairly easily or just admit that someone was just simply better on that given day. I then pack up my toy cars and go home happy.

Love your attitude towards this HOBBY! Wished more had it, instead of wasting their energy finding ways to cheat.....but that seems to be what some will do....even back when people were racing chariots.

I've always said: Cheating is a Losers attempt to level the playing field, which rarely succeeds.
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Old 06-05-2014, 12:51 AM   #7379
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That's the point where I stopped reading.
Too bad because the point of putting the tuning rotor in the motor was to find out how/if you could determine that someone was using one of those Novak tuning rotors. I had hoped there would be an easy non invasive way that I could show our tech folks here how to check for this. If, as Novak had indicated, you could tell the difference between the tuning rotor and the legal rotor by turning the shaft, I needed a legal motor and a illegal motor so the tech people would know how each felt when you turned the shaft. But as it turned out, IMO that isn't a reliable way to tech for these tuning rotors. BTW that BOSS motor is clearly marked so I don't inadvertently put it in the car for a VTA race until I put the stock rotor back in. Until then I'm using it to experiment with how to use track data and my dyno data to select FDRs.

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Old 06-05-2014, 04:40 AM   #7380
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Have you not nticed that the ends of the rotors are painted different colors? I bought a parts lot from a guy that had the SMC tuning rotor in it. It had no paint where as the stock 12.3 rotor tip was pink.
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