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Old 12-04-2004, 12:46 AM   #46
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Well each kit is the same price, so i might as well go with the newer one, ive never had either so i guess either is fair game.
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Old 12-04-2004, 03:16 AM   #47
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I recently went from an atlas YM34SI to a Tamiya TRF 415. There is very little difference in the overall suspension on both cars except the 415 has better adjustability.

I noticed that a similar setup on both cars resulted in very different results... especially swaybars. Also with the atlas being limited in suspension setup, it was easyier to get the car good but often the car was only ever "so good" and would not improve. The 415's infinite adjustments (like the TC4) make it easy to do something that makes the car undrivable but also allows for speed and stability far beyond the atlas.

Most people I see tuning cars do it with the wrong approach as they always try taking grip away from the front or decrease rear stability thinking they will have more or less grip and the car will improve. With the TC4 now allowing for greater control over rollcenters and similar major suspension factors, most people will prolly get it wrong and never understand why.

The TC4 looks superior to the TC3 and I'm sure the people who give it a chance will get better performance than they got from their TC3's.
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Old 12-04-2004, 05:51 AM   #48
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here's my 2 cents:

My tc3 is good, but I am looking to up grade. The fastest guys at my track are running xrays, and yesterday, I got second to an xray who had almost a lap advantage. But im not about to go buy a new car, when i still have people asking for my setup. I was thinking about switching to a tc4, but listening to this thread, it sounds like tunability just isnt there.
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Old 12-04-2004, 06:40 AM   #49
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I know im going to get flamed for this but, if people spent more time at the track, working on setup, and just driving, then on the internet whining and complaining about everything under the sun, weather it be a tc4 or anything else, you may get some results, with the car.
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Old 12-04-2004, 06:48 AM   #50
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i just might go buy a TC4 now since everyone says it isnt as good as everybody would think it would be b4 it came out...i like to be different
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Old 12-04-2004, 07:05 AM   #51
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Unhappy tc4

i am glad too see that i am not the only one who thinks the same about the tc4 it is a very sloppy car and im not that happy with it at all... dissapointing instructions compared too what they usually print i might just have too sell it and buy a yokomo ssg
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Old 12-04-2004, 07:53 AM   #52
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Default TC4

Guys, let me start by saying that I am in no way an official spokesperson for AE, but I have been sponsored by them for about 10 years. The TC3 is still a great car and there are other great cars on the market -- there is no doubt. However, when the TC3 first came out I know it took me awhile to tailor my driving and tuning to its potential. Once I did, the car was awesome! And undersand that the TC3 has had over 5 years of subtle tuning refinement to bring it to where it is today.

I ran my TC4 on carpet for the first time last week (my setup is posted in the TC4 thread) and I was amazed how quickly it changed direction and reacted! It was also stable and easy to drive, despite very limited track/tuning time. Although it is a refinement of the TC3, the TC4 is still a NEW car with a nearly infinite amount of tuning options to experiment with on the track. I guarantee that hindsight and track time will yield the current negative comments premature as the TC4 reaches its true potential at the leading edge of the touring car market.
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Last edited by Lebatek; 12-04-2004 at 08:00 AM.
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Old 12-04-2004, 08:27 AM   #53
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I think people are probably having some problems with all of this new cars that are coming out because they are new! I hear people complain about the pro4, tc4, and may others at the track. I think it is just going to take some time for everyone to understand how their new TCs handle so that they can get a grasp on setup.
I'm new to touring cars, but I am sticking with my tc3, partly because I am broke, and partly because I am just happy with it. It is one mean, cost effective touring car, and it will still put the heat on all the other cars at the track for years to come.
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Old 12-04-2004, 10:23 AM   #54
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Default Re: Moonman...

Originally posted by RCknight
I have to agree and disagree. Cars like the Pro 4 and Tamiya 415 have slightly larger arms, slightly larger c-hubs and wheel knuckles. The arms are bigger than a TC3/4, but they are molded carbon. I think this is the better way. Making them stronger, but yet they are as light or lighter than the smaller stock TC3/4 counter part. A carbon part that is stonger than a plastic one. Just my theory. Anyone weigh the difference between a TC3/4 plastic arm and a Tamiya one?

Yes I know that many cars have heavier suspension than the TC3 and TC4 but I ment that I think they went the wrong way on the TC4 by making the suspension parts heavier.

I liked the leightweigth suspension and the low CG of the TC3 and I feel that this was the reason for the TC3 beeing a very fast car.

To me it seems that they took the TC3 and just changed the parts that people complained about, but forgot to try to make the new car faster.

To build a faster car is getting more and more difficult but it is possible if you put a lot of effort into it, that's for sure.

Last edited by moonman; 12-05-2004 at 06:28 AM.
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Old 12-04-2004, 10:41 AM   #55
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First, I haven't play TC4. In fact I quit EP (TC3) and focus on GP (NTC3) now.

Frankly I don't understand the philosophy of "give it a little more time". Please check the 2004 GP World result, which chassis win the world? V1RRR. And which chassis dominate the A-main, V1RRR. Is V1RRR an experienced chassis? NO, it released on early Aug in JP, and win the World which took place only 2 months later. And everyone who tried V1RRR has a common opinion: It's a stable, easy to tune, and very fast chassis.

I'm not supporting V1RRR (hey, I'm exclusive on NTC3). But I really don't understand the philosophy of "give it a little more time", and certainly don't wanna see the NTC4 has the same, mixed opinion, as TC4 did.

Just my 2 cents.
edited for spell

Last edited by ttso; 12-04-2004 at 10:49 AM.
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Old 12-04-2004, 05:19 PM   #56
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sorry this is a long post .....

i think people just have to put time into the car and really understand "what it likes" to make it go fast. i have just recently switched from a yokomo cgm to a shcumi mi2. i was extremely happy with my CGM but just had to give the mi2 a shot. i've run the mi2 only for 4 race days so i've had very limited time with the car. to be honest, i was starting to get a bit frustrated with car as i could not get it to handle the way i wanted it to. i was easily 0.4 of a second off with the mi2 vs my CGM - so the laptimes showed that i was slower. it was a struggle to say the least. so just as i was about to give up on it, i decided to actually spend time at the track to tune the car - somthing i could never find time to do.

i ran about 3 packs with the car doing some little set-up changes each run. i was running a one way with the mi2 as i am one of those racers who will always run a 1way (outdoor asphalt track) coz i love the corner speed and the 1-way really works at our local track. anyway, each time out, i still couldn't get what i wanted from the car. at my 3rd pack, i hit a corner incorrectly which reulted in some serious airtime! car lands on the tarmac hard & busted my 1way bearing. of course i was already pissed at this point. not so good handling car and now a busted part that would set me back another $50. i pulled out a spool and slapped it in. note this was somthing i would NOT have even considered if i didnt mess up my 1-way coz i did not want the reduced off power steering it would bring. anyway, i had to make the most of the time i had at the track, so i did number of changes to make up for the turn-in i would loose. put the car on the track and voila! it was better than ever! i did a few more tweaks hear and there during a race yesterday and i must say, the car is great! im eager to hit the track again! just gonna try a few minor stuff to get back the turn-in i want, but the car si almost there!

i guess my point is you just really have to give it some time when you get a new car and you also have to think of doing things that you would normally not do with your previous car. you can't just set the car up as close as possible to your prvious ride and hope that when you put it on the track it will be faster. i'll eventually give the tc4 a try (maybe when the fttc4 is out) and im sure it can be made to handle great..... just having too much fun with my mi2 at the moment. hehehe ..

my two cents....


Last edited by ROBORAT; 12-04-2004 at 05:36 PM.
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Old 12-04-2004, 07:03 PM   #57
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Originally posted by ROBORAT
sorry this is a long post .....

i think people just have to put time into the car and really understand "what it likes" to make it go fast.....
I don’t know if you conceder Team Associated and there slue of world class drivers “people” but I can grantee you that they probably spent a lot of time with the car at the Worlds and Cleveland and they have yet to make it work for them. If the manufacture can’t figure out the car then we customers are going to have a hell of a time.
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Old 12-04-2004, 07:19 PM   #58
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isint figuring it out part of the fun.....just wish I had some time to go to the track... period
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Old 12-04-2004, 07:43 PM   #59
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just read through this thread.....
I have been running and modifying my TC3 for 3 years now.
In that time I have also had; Mi2, 414M2, EVO3, XXXS G+ but have always went back to the TC3. It was just faster on the track for me.
That said, I had to get the setup to suit me and also the track.
SO, I thought I would give the new TC4 a try.
I took my time building it, used some TC3 parts and some non Associated parts too where I thought they would suit me.
Anyway, first time out at my local track, after tuning a bit the car is already quicker than my TC3 !

Can't see why so many people are not happy, it's a great car !

try for yourselves would be my advice.
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Old 12-04-2004, 09:22 PM   #60
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I had a Team tc3 and I got the tc4 when it first came out. It took me four club races to figure out a setup I was comfortable with. I broke one rear hub carrier when I first started because of insane oversteer condition. The chassis is narrower they got rid of that stupid steering rack. The drivetrain is very free with no grinding on diff housings. As far as I am concerned the 4 is better.
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